Oil

[novaqt]

Ukridge:

"HM government however, has decided to tax the daylights out of it once it exits the refinery and enters my auto."

You are right Ukridge. It does not occur to most Americans that actually you are paying the same as we are here in the good ole US of A. When you take $2.25 per gal. here, you are paying the same only you have the costs associated with socialized medicine and education added to your fuel costs. So you end up paying approx. $5.00 per gal. plus or minus.

 

[jimntx]

Ukridge:

"HM government however, has decided to tax the daylights out of it once it exits the refinery and enters my auto."

you have the costs associated with socialized medicine and education added to your fuel costs. So you end up paying approx. $5.00 per gal. plus or minus.

[post="262421"][/post]​

It always amazes me how Americans can not resist throwing in some comment about Socialized Medicine
in any discussion about the economy of the United Kingdom. At the same time, we blissfully ignore the economic and social costs of having 20% of our population devoid of health care insurance and therefore dependent upon tax-supported medical facilities, and another substantial portion of the population who are under-insured to the point that any catastrophic illness results in bankruptcy.

 

[Fly]

Unfortunately, that is the way it is here. I, for one, do not want sub-standard health care (not saying the medical staff, just the remarkable wait times to see medical staff) just so the masses can have health care too. I like picking up the phone, dialing the doctor of MY choice, and getting in immediately. I have too many friends in 'participating' countries, and all of them still buy private medical insurance just for the reasons I stated above.

There is no perfect fix....but if I'm going to have to pay for it anyway AND pay higher taxes to support people who can't afford it,.....no thank you!

 

[aafsc]

Ukridge:

"HM government however, has decided to tax the daylights out of it once it exits the refinery and enters my auto."

You are right Ukridge. It does not occur to most Americans that actually you are paying the same as we are here in the good ole US of A. When you take $2.25 per gal. here, you are paying the same only you have the costs associated with socialized medicine and education added to your fuel costs. So you end up paying approx. $5.00 per gal. plus or minus.

[post="262421"][/post]​

But someone in the UK does not have to worry about losing everything they have worked for just because they got really sick or were unlucky enough to be seriously injured. They get treated and that is it. In this country they send threatening phone calls and letters to pay your bills even though you are still trying to recover. Four days in the hospital for gall stones can set you back $40,000-$50,000. And with the new bankruptcy laws just passed, it will get even worse for the average person. Of course it will not affect the wealthy or the corporations.

 

[jimntx]

Unfortunately, that is the way it is here. I, for one, do not want sub-standard health care (not saying the medical staff, just the remarkable wait times to see medical staff) just so the masses can have health care too. I like picking up the phone, dialing the doctor of MY choice, and getting in immediately. I have too many friends in 'participating' countries, and all of them still buy private medical insurance just for the reasons I stated above.

There is no perfect fix....but if I'm going to have to pay for it anyway AND pay higher taxes to support people who can't afford it,.....no thank you!

[post="262442"][/post]​

Yes, I've heard this argument ad nauseum for years. Trust me, it is much older than you probably are. However, put yourself in the shoes of the woman whose story was related in the paper the other day.

She is married, goes to church, works full-time at the same company for over 15 years (makes over $45,000/yr), and has 3 children--like all true patriotic Amurricans should. The problem is that the family insurance has a 30% co-pay
because that was all they could afford from the plans offered. Everything was fine until the last child was born. The child had multiple problems at birth, was in neonatal intensive care for several months, and continues to need expensive medications. 30% of just the hospital bill came to almost $100,000.

Given your current situation, would you be in a position to continue on as usual if you have a similar occurrence?


The major activity of the modern conservative is finding justifications for selfishness. -John Kenneth Galbraith

 

[markkus757]

Look, I find this interesting and very educational, but the bottom line still remains. No one acurately knows how long the oil will flow at a respectable level. We all can agree that demand will continue predictably with no other changes(terrorism, politics, etc.). What we haven't had though in the last 3 decades, is a government looking out for our best interests in this regard. Ever since Carter and his problems, no one has been willing to put their political careers on the chopping block to fix an issue that will be a future problem. I don't believe this is quite an issue yet. However, if the world gets anymore polarized, oil could dry up overnight if you tick off the wrong country. That is a problem we currently have no solution for. Proactively, someone for the last 2-3 decades should have tried to start to wean this country off the fossils and onto more renewables. At least if someone could help kick start the industries that would not have to be totally dependent on the fossil fuels so the ones that are(like ours) would not be so devastated. I would imagine that at least half of the airlines today could at least break even if you excluded the oil prices. Getting back to the subject, the oil industry is as flexible as the airline industry. It seems that the smaller, newer players are more flexible and can react and change with the trends. We are being left behind and must adapt if we don't want to smooch a lot of buttocks in the future. If more countries can yield a nuke, we lose leverage with ours. Too many more battles with other countries will ruin any resolve we have to overcome these long term issues. In the meantime, we need to adapt to the changing environment before we have no will to.

 

[jimntx]

If you think it was all over 100 years ago, please read the article in today's NY Times regarding drinking water pollution from MTBEs and certain Republican efforts to absolve the guilty parties of any financial responsibility for the cleanup.

A Dirty Little Footnote to the Energy Bill

[post="262415"][/post]​

And, again this morning, the evil (probably Communist) New York Times reveals another environmental gotcha in the Administration's vaunted energy bill.

Change to the Clean Air Act Is Built Into New Energy Bill
By MICHAEL JANOFSKY

Published: April 16, 2005


WASHINGTON, April 15 - Deep in the energy bill that was approved by a House committee this week, under a section titled "Miscellaneous," is a brief provision that could have major consequences for communities struggling to clean up their dirty air.

If it becomes law, it would make one of the most significant changes to the Clean Air Act in 15 years, allowing communities whose air pollution comes from hundreds of miles away to delay meeting national air quality standards until their offending neighbors clean up their own air.

The Rest of the Story

 

[Borescope]

But someone in the UK does not have to worry about losing everything they have worked for just because they got really sick or were unlucky enough to be seriously injured. They get treated and that is it. In this country they send threatening phone calls and letters to pay your bills even though you are still trying to recover. Four days in the hospital for gall stones can set you back $40,000-$50,000. And with the new bankruptcy laws just passed, it will get even worse for the average person. Of course it will not affect the wealthy or the corporations.

[post="262449"][/post]​

If you want to live in a socialistic society, contact your representative or move. This country has been built on free enterprise. I'm sure if you were running a HMO or similar you wouldn't give your services away for free just because your a good person. The people in congress are the ones making it difficult, you always cna call, write, or vote.

In this country they send threatening phone calls and letters to pay your bills even though you are still trying to recover.

[post="262449"][/post]​

Get caller ID, you don't have to answer every call coming into your house.

 

[aafsc]

If you want to live in a socialistic society, contact your representative or move. This country has been built on free enterprise. I'm sure if you were running a HMO or similar you wouldn't give your services away for free just because your a good person. The people in congress are the ones making it difficult, you always cna call, write, or vote.

Get caller ID, you don't have to answer every call coming into your house.

[post="262565"][/post]​

HMOs make money by denying care to their customers. When I was in DFW, there was a story of a boy who had a problem in his head. The HMO denied a $1,000 CAT Scan/MRI and the boy eventually became a vegetable. If the CAT Scan/MRI would have been done the problem would have been found, easily corrected, and the kid would be healthy today. And then governor Bush was pushing for a law where you can not sue HMOs. Bottom line, they can take your money (expensive premiums) give you nothing in return, destroy your child, and not be held liable (so much for conservative-republican moral responsibility). If this kid would have been born a Canadian, he would be healthy today because corporate greed would have been eliminated from his situation. How would you feel if this was your kid?

 

[aafsc]

Also you talk about this country being built on free enterprise. Is it necessary for the CEO of a PPO(HMO) to have 5 houses each being over 100,000 square feet? According to one of my former coworkers ,he has seen this himself. So I guess there is nothing wrong with this CEO having these 5 mansions while denying tests to a kid that could have prevented him from being a vegetable. You complain about the airline CEOs and about how much they make. They make #### compared to HMO executives. In fact, AAs two former CFOs left AA to go to the health insurance industry where they are making 3 to 5 times more than they were at AA. Also, I think former NWA CEO Richard Andersen did the same thing. If a majority of people in this country think it is OK for the HMO and insurance company executives to have 5 mansions while denying treatment to sick people because "we are a capitalist society" then this IS indeed a sick country. With things getting so bad, some people I work with have talked about leaving the country. And before you go and call them unpatriotic, some of them have served in the US military. I myself have considered leaving but I hate cold weather.

 

[MCI transplant]

Also you talk about this country being built on free enterprise. Is it necessary for the CEO of a PPO(HMO) to have 5 houses each being over 100,000 square feet? According to one of my former coworkers ,he has seen this himself. So I guess there is nothing wrong with this CEO having these 5 mansions while denying tests to a kid that could have prevented him from being a vegetable. You complain about the airline CEOs and about how much they make. They make #### compared to HMO executives. In fact, AAs two former CFOs left AA to go to the health insurance industry where they are making 3 to 5 times more than they were at AA. Also, I think former NWA CEO Richard Andersen did the same thing. If a majority of people in this country think it is OK for the HMO and insurance company executives to have 5 mansions while denying treatment to sick people because "we are a capitalist society" then this IS indeed a sick country. With things getting so bad, some people I work with have talked about leaving the country. And before you go and call them unpatriotic, some of them have served in the US military. I myself have considered leaving but I hate cold weather.

[post="262600"][/post]​

<_< May I sugest Siberia!!!! 😛

 

[Borescope]

Is it necessary for the CEO of a PPO(HMO) to have 5 houses each being over 100,000 square feet?

[post="262600"][/post]​

I don't own 5 houses, so your asking the wrong person. Although, I don't have any problem with it. We each made choices in life and I'm guessing you didn't choose the medical profession or business for that matter.

You complain about the airline CEOs and about how much they make.

[post="262600"][/post]​

Where did I mention that I cared about what a CEO makes in this post?

AAs two former CFOs left AA to go to the health insurance industry where they are making 3 to 5 times more than they were at AA.

[post="262600"][/post]​

These were probably the ones you didn't want to let go.......the smart ones.

With things getting so bad, some people I work with have talked about leaving the country.

[post="262600"][/post]​

Talk is cheap.........Alex Baldwin said the same thing if GW got elected, I'm not sure but I think his residence is still in Los Angeles.

I myself have considered leaving but I hate cold weather.

[post="262600"][/post]​

There are a lot of places you can go that don't know what cold weather is unless cold to you is 60 degrees.

 

[sastal]

But someone in the UK does not have to worry about losing everything they have worked for just because they got really sick or were unlucky enough to be seriously injured. They get treated and that is it. In this country they send threatening phone calls and letters to pay your bills even though you are still trying to recover. Four days in the hospital for gall stones can set you back $40,000-$50,000. And with the new bankruptcy laws just passed, it will get even worse for the average person. Of course it will not affect the wealthy or the corporations.

[post="262449"][/post]​

I agree with you 100 percent. People in the U.S. always mention England when criticizing socialized medicine. There are many European countries in which I would (and do) prefer to go for healthcare than the U.S.
Norway, France, and even Italy all have excellent care, and you do get to choose whom you want to see. With as good of an insurance policy as I have at UA, I always have had to wait months to see a specialist in the States. If people had to pay for their own care in the U.S., I am sure the story about how wonderful our capitalistic society is would change (lose that card and let the "Cobra" suck the life out of you, buddy). And let's not discuss on this thread the cost of drugs in the U.S., either.

 

[aafsc]

I don't own 5 houses, so your asking the wrong person. Although, I don't have any problem with it. We each made choices in life and I'm guessing you didn't choose the medical profession or business for that matter.

Where did I mention that I cared about what a CEO makes in this post?

These were probably the ones you didn't want to let go.......the smart ones.

Talk is cheap.........Alex Baldwin said the same thing if GW got elected, I'm not sure but I think his residence is still in Los Angeles.

There are a lot of places you can go that don't know what cold weather is unless cold to you is 60 degrees.

[post="262682"][/post]​

So you don't see anything wrong with HMO CEOs ripping off families while denying critical care to their child while becoming extremely wealthy by doing it. Have you overdosed on the Bush-right wing koolaide? Do you really believe that this is morally right? HMOs are not in the medical profession, doctors are. HMOs are in the FINANCIAL/INSURANCE business and are dictating to the doctors the kind of treatment they can perform (this is a form of medical rationing that opponents of the Canadian system accuse that system of). I went to business school and have a masters degree so I have a pretty good idea of what is going on. Although I majored in business, I would have a problem with working in an industry that denies medical care to it's customers for the sake of corporate greed. There are people that have significantly less education than myself that work in the insurance industry and make sginificantly more than me This goes to show that denying medical care to people who need it is very lucrative.

I believe you are an AMT. And all the AMTs get on here and complain about what the airline CEOs make and call them crooks Yet when they go in to the health insurance company/HMOs and make 5 times more by denying care to people you call them smart. Totally hypocrtitcal.And they were not necessarily the smart ones. They helped to put AA in the sad position it is today.

I am from Florida, so anything less than 70 degrees is cold.

By the way, you did not answer my question. How would you feel if it was YOUR child?

 

[aafsc]

<_< May I sugest Siberia!!!! 😛

[post="262677"][/post]​

MCI my ex-TWA friend, I know you would like to see that.