Siegal...make A Deal To Carve-up Us Now!

[birdseyeview]

With the ATSB having given US the green light to accept an "IOU" from a potential purchaser of US assets, now is the time to actively shop a deal around to the other airlines. What are your thoughts on how this can be done and save the jobs of many US employees in the process?

Here are my thoughts and ideas.......

CM has recently been suggesting that NWA might be in pursuit of US. This is a plausible possibility, but only if they withdraw from their 3-way alliance with DAL and CAL. It would give NWA a large east coast hub to launch their international flights from (PHL). The A330 and small AB aircraft would fit nicely into their system, as would DCA and BOS. PIT would be downsized (if not eliminated) and MEM would be reduced in favor of CLT.

While the NWA senario is a possibility, I think NWA is probably happy with their 3-way alliance, and a division of US makes more sense to them. So how could Seigal broker a deal to the other airlines that makes sense to them as well as recognizes the dedication and loyalty of US employees.

If Bronner decides to liquidate US, then all jobs are lost and everyone loses. Maybe Seigal and the unions could put together a win-win senario for everyone. The objective at this point (I personally feel that US can no longer survive as a stand-alone carrier) should be for Seigal and the unions to craft a plan for the orderly dis-manteling of US. Those unions that agree to participate with management on this plan will be guaranteed that their positions will transfer with the asset sales. Those unions that choose not to participate, will be left without a job.

I know at this point someone is going to say "my contract states that if more than 20% of the assets are sold, the employees must transfer also". That may be true if US stays in business. What I am talking about is a COMPLETE liquidation of the airline. YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS IN THAT CASE.

The time has come to dismantel US. We lost our opportunity to survive as a stand-alone airline. The hardest part at this point is in just accepting the facts surrounding all of us and crafting a plan with management to maximize shareholder value while at the same time saving our jobs.

HERE IS JUST ONE POSSIBLE BREAKUP SENARIO FOR USAIR....

1) Sell CLT and the 737's to AMR. My guess is AMR would love to move their southeast hub from RDU to CLT.

2) With 3 airlines JBLU AMR and DAL on a suicide course at JFK (all waiting for the other to blink), my guess is one of them would love to move their operation to PHL and avoid the bloodbath. Yes, I know SWA is coming to PHL but it would be much better than what is happenning at JFK. It doesn't matter which one of them wants to move over to PHL....any one of the three makes sense. Personally, I think it would be a perfect opportunity for JBLU to take over our AB aircraft and send SWA packing, but it would work great for AMR and DAL also.

3) The DCA assets could be sold to any airline....they all want them and make sense.

4) BOS and LGA would be an easy sell also to an airline without a major operation there.


This is a poker game we are playing with our jobs. We as employees do not hold a very strong hand. However, we can improve our hand by working with management to maximize shareholder value and guarantee our jobs with the purchaser of our assets.

I look forward to your ideas and thoughts.

 

[mweiss]

1) Sell CLT and the 737's to AMR. My guess is AMR would love to move their southeast hub from RDU to CLT.

CLT, yes. 737s, no. US doesn't have any 738s, and those are the only 737s in AA's fleet.

2) With 3 airlines JBLU AMR and DAL on a suicide course at JFK (all waiting for the other to blink), my guess is one of them would love to move their operation to PHL and avoid the bloodbath.

Maybe, but I kind of doubt it. The NYC market is much more lucrative than the PHL market overall. Then again, I don't have enough of the numbers to do anything more than a gut check on it.

Personally, I think it would be a perfect opportunity for JBLU to take over our AB aircraft

Hmmm, now there's an interesting thought. Maybe B6 would be interested in the 320s. I suppose it depends on how much US wants for them, how much it will cost to refit them to B6 specs, and what the current value of the older planes is (I sure hear an awful lot about the long-term maintenance problems of this model).

3) The DCA assets could be sold to any airline....they all want them and make sense.

Yup. Probably the most valuable asset US has.

4) BOS and LGA would be an easy sell also to an airline without a major operation there.

CO would be an interesting choice for LGA, given that they have the concourse already. Perhaps they'd want BOS as well, but I'd be more inclined to put my money on DL or NW for BOS.

This is a poker game we are playing with our jobs. We as employees do not hold a very strong hand. However, we can improve our hand by working with management to maximize shareholder value and guarantee our jobs with the purchaser of our assets.

Interesting idea. You certainly have nothing to lose and everything to gain by trying.

 

[mga707]

1) Sell CLT and the 737's to AMR. My guess is AMR would love to move their southeast hub from RDU to CLT.

The only "southeast hub" AA has is way southeast, at MIA.
RDU hasn't even remotely resembled an AA hub for nearly a decade.
And, as has already been mentioned, they would have no use for a bunch of ageing 737-300s/-400s.

 

[pitguy]

mweiss states: "Interesting idea. You certainly have nothing to lose and everything to gain by trying."


They may not teach you this in MBA school, but I will try to help you out. What they are asking for is concessions and lay offs. So please explain to someone whom will lose their job or take more life altering concession how they have nothing to lose.


--If you are going to sell something at least know what it is you are selling.

 

[Winglet]

The only thing AMR might be remotely interested in is the shuttle slots, but certainly no aircraft nor personnel. I can't imagine any airline being interested in a wholesale transfer of personnel with the integration problems that would ensue. I think all you have to do is look at the disaster that the TWA aquisition created. I don't think anyone wants to chance a repeat of that.

 

[mweiss]

So please explain to someone whom will lose their job or take more life altering concession how they have nothing to lose.

Sure. But before I do, I'd like to point out that I don't recall seeing the word "concession" anywhere in this thread before you used it.

If you concede that US Airways will not exist as an independent company in the next 12-18 months, then surely you must recognize that liquidation gives you no job. Unemployed. With no income.

The alternative is to do everything you can to attach employment to the assets. Thus, where the assets go, so go you. Employed. With income.

So, when you make the comparison, doing nothing puts you in the first scenario. Doing something may put you into the second scenario. The second has a job, and the first doesn't. Thus, "nothing to lose."

 

[avek00]

While I share your view that there is No Plan B for US Airways short of a merger or sale, I cannot see a fragmentation scenario taking place that would involve more than a skeleton of US' employees. With the other airlines having over 100,000 employees laid off or on furlough, WOE be unto the major airline that brings on thousands of new people while the acquirer's employees are still collecting unemployment checks. The relatively senior US workforce will also make it tough to practically integrate the two airlines' workforces, unless a straight staple is used.

Besides, if things get so bad at US that a total fragmentation is necessary, no one will bite at the apple until US is dead and the assets/leases can be picked up for a fraction of the current asking pices.

 

[birdseyeview]

The point of this thread is being lost on some of you that have posted here.

Bronner wants something from us now to make this airline survive for however long this latest bandaid concession will allow us to survive. Don't you think the #1 thing we should be asking for as employees is his guarantee that our jobs go with the assets to another carrier. Why should WE care that another carrier has employees on furlough (as some of you have pointed out) as a reason to torpedo this idea. If they want our assets, a certain number of employees come with the deal.PERIOD! That's what our deal with Bronner will say if we tie any more concessions to the concept that employees transfer with assets.

The number one thing ALPA,AFA,IAM and TWU should be asking for with any concession is..............

ASSET SALES EQUALS EMPLOYEE TRANSFER.

This IS a request Bronner has the ability to agree to. All you have to do is DEMAND IT!

What other demand from the unions really matters at this point. Is my union going to secure the right for me wear a pair of leather pants to go with my leather jacket! Give me a break. WAKE UP ALPA.

 

[PITbull]

Other airlines have "scope clauses". I don't think they are in the same business as U and "piss off" their employees.

To have to take ALL the employees of an airline or any company that has been acquired makes it less attractive for a suitor.

 

[Bear96]

The point of this thread is being lost on some of you that have posted here.

Bronner wants something from us now to make this airline survive for however long this latest bandaid concession will allow us to survive. Don't you think the #1 thing we should be asking for as employees is his guarantee that our jobs go with the assets to another carrier. Why should WE care that another carrier has employees on furlough (as some of you have pointed out) as a reason to torpedo this idea. If they want our assets, a certain number of employees come with the deal.PERIOD! That's what our deal with Bronner will say if we tie any more concessions to the concept that employees transfer with assets.

The number one thing ALPA,AFA,IAM and TWU should be asking for with any concession is..............

ASSET SALES EQUALS EMPLOYEE TRANSFER.

This IS a request Bronner has the ability to agree to. All you have to do is DEMAND IT!

What other demand from the unions really matters at this point. Is my union going to secure the right for me wear a pair of leather pants to go with my leather jacket! Give me a break. WAKE UP ALPA.

The only problem with that is that it would discourage any potential buyers. So instead of selling assets while U is still an independent entity, buyers would simply wait until U shuts down completely and then pick through the remains. An agreement such as this would only hasten that process.

Either way is bad for the employees. But my point is that if you think a contract provision saying employees go with the assets will actually lead to U employees being absorbed by another carrier, I don't think that is very likely. In a total shut-down, labor agreements don't mean anything.

 

[JFK777]

birdseyeview,

Your JB, AA & DAL competiton at JFK is true only to a certain degree. AA flies to the two most lucrative and hardest to get into foreign airports, NRT & LHR. AA only flies to Miami, not against DAL's Song and JB to Florida. DAL is only now flying to the Caribean, SJU & SDQ, against AA and JB service is new as well, only AA flies to the whole Caribean. DAL is the biggest airline to Europe( NOt the UK), AA has limited flights and JB doesn't fly to Europe. The 3 do compete to California but DAL flies to feed it JFK hub, AA flies to LAX & JB to LGB. These 3 only compete in parts of their JFK portfolios, AA as the widest group of destinations but only limited competition from JB & DAL. Why would someone move to PHL, a large PHL opertaion would be unrelated to JFK,not involving any of these.

 

[avek00]

Don't you think the #1 thing we should be asking for as employees is his guarantee that our jobs go with the assets to another carrier...If they want our assets, a certain number of employees come with the deal.PERIOD!

Ask, but you shall not receive. Requiring major employee transfers with an asset sale is the most surefire way to guarantee that no one will buy a thing unless/until US fails completely, when the assets can be snapped up for LESS money with FEWER labor hassles. Besides, if the shoe was on the other foot, you'd probably raise holy h*ll over the prospect of OAL folks coming to US while tens of thousands of US employees are on furlough.

 

[ITRADE]

Ask, but you shall not receive. Requiring major employee transfers with an asset sale is the most surefire way to guarantee that no one will buy a thing unless/until US fails completely, when the assets can be snapped up for LESS money with FEWER labor hassles. Besides, if the shoe was on the other foot, you'd probably raise holy h*ll over the prospect of OAL folks coming to US while tens of thousands of US employees are on furlough.

Just means that things will be sold in itty, bitty chunks.

AA gets 30 planes and 15 gates; NW gets 50 planes and a hub; UA gets 50 planes and a few slots. The rest go out to the desert to rot.

Asset sale problem resolved.