TWU/IAM Members: How Long Will Negotiations Take?

[WeAAsles]

Refute anything that I just posted.

You can act like a philanthropist and that the LLCers are your “brothers and sisters” but with your 05/1995 seniority you would have been on the street had they gotten full DOH across the system. It’s convenient for you to act this way now but you would have been adversely impacted had they gotten full DOH.

Stop with the revisionist history.

Josh

American Airlines/ Trans World Airways.



Seventeen years ago now. Wow.

NEXT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[The Watcher]

 

[Bob Owens]

Why does it work for the CWA/IBT and has for over a decade?

And the leadership is certainly unified now.

Why so you could pull another TWA?

Did they carve up the membership like spoils like the Association did?

The IAM never should have waived their contractual rights at TWA, but oh yes, that's right, TWA had convinced the IAM to buy them equipment (an engine wasn't it) and lag behind on Pension monies so rather than having their Treasury take a hit they signed off on screwing their members and hoped the TWU would just let them walk in with their seniority while they ran off with their dues. I have 1986 Seniority, my first 6 years in the Industry were just for experience, but that's how it worked, I would have had no problem allowing the EAL guys come in with their Seniority, after all they too were screwed by the IAM but they fought the good fight for all of us. TWA lingered and at best helped drag the rest of us down. They saw big raises when they got their 4/10/01 , kept all their Vacation and sick time, had a fence around KC and STL and 25% in cities where they had overlaping staff, they didnt have to start over as new hires like the guys you wanted displaced from EAL(IAM), Pan Am (TWU) and even the guys who quit TWA (IAM) . If we had given them, their seniority I would have supported giving the tWA guys theirs, but I couldn't support allowing you to displace them.

USAIR. We didn't want the merger, only Little did. To us, USAIR was "a pauper on a pony, not a Knight in shining armor'.

 

[The Watcher]

Yes they did.

East of the Mississippi is CWA represented.

West of the Mississippi is IBT represented.

AA forced all unions on TW property to give up LPPs or the deal was off.

Also William O’Driscoll was in Negotiations with a wealthy hedge fund to purchase TW but ran out of time when AA forced the issue.

 

[Bob Owens]

Bottom line, the IAM looked out for their own financial interests and not that of its TWA members. Just like they did at EAL. "The deal" that was at risk was AA making good on debts TWA had to the IAM.

 

[Bob Owens]

Did members in either Union get traded to the other union? At least the east west separation makes sense. BOSTON PHL DCA , IAM, NY NJ-TWU, its all over place and makes ZERO sense from a membership perspective, it was all designed solely as a dues retention scheme by the two Unions.

 

[The Watcher]

Those debts you speak wouldn’t have been lost, the IAM had secured the debt with engines and equipment and were a preferential debt holder, the assests were either to be sold and money used for the pension debt for its members in the different pension plans TW owed to its IAM members.

So it didn’t matter what happened to TW.

My Uncle was an Inspector for EA for 29 years, I walked the picket lines at JFK and LGA.

EA did owe the IAM money nor did TW

Eastern would have been long gone and the same for TW if it wasn’t for the the IAM



Great documentary on how the IAM and others tried to save Eastern and how Borman and Lorenzo destroyed it.

 

[The Watcher]

Did members in either Union get traded to the other union? At least the east west separation makes sense. BOSTON PHL DCA , IAM, NY NJ-TWU, its all over place and makes ZERO sense from a membership perspective, it was all designed solely as a dues retention scheme by the two Unions.

Yes before the HP merger all mainline agents at US were CWA all over the US.

And HP agents were IBT all over the US.

After that merger they split the country in half.

Next?

 

[Bob Owens]

Next? You didn't address the structure. Like I said , at least that structure makes sense, our Association was structured purely to maintain dues for each Union, not about creating Unity. What they could have done was do it by class and craft, Mechanics and Related in one union, Fleet in the other.

 

[The Watcher]

What’s the difference?

Both Associations split up its membership according to what the leadership voted on.

Probably a dozen or more ways it could have been done.

It’s samentics.

What’s are you going to try and pick apart next?

 

[Bob Owens]

I had lunch with Sito Pantoya and Ed LaClair after they gave their presentation to the TWU committee (in Nashville?) , they told me about the monies owed to the IAM as the reason they signed away the LPPs.

I didnt say that EAL owed the IAM money, but under the RLA we are allowed secondary strikes, the workers were all set to shut down the entire Northeast, but the IAM called off the secondary strikes at the rails because a judge threatened them. Bill Geoghan, chair at DCA for the IAM at EAL asked why? They told him they would be fined, they would lose their jet.

 

[Bob Owens]

What’s the difference?

Both Associations split up its membership according to what the leadership voted on.

Probably a dozen or more ways it could have been done.

It’s samentics.

What’s are you going to try and pick apart next?

How many people were switched from one union to the other? Its not semantics when it affects you.

 

[Bob Owens]

From the agents union website;
December 2005 Passenger service agents at the former America West had organized with the International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT) in 2004. However, they had not reached a first contract with America West by the time of the merger. After the merger, CWA and IBT formed the Airline Customer Service Employee Association, CWA-IBT (known as the Association). In December, the unions signed an interim transition agreement that spelled out the transition of IBT members at the former America West into the CWA contract.

So the IBT side never even had a contract.

 

[The Watcher]

And Al Hemenway refused to negotiate a JCBA with them and told the he would make them vote betweeen unions and not recognize their Association.

He forced them to only negotiate how to transition the HP agents to the US/CWA CBA.

So to this day they are in an Association together.

 

[The Watcher]

Oh look a new member of the red Mark brigade.