Hell out source work? In our Station where we have Fleet Service Agents, OUR FINE COMPANY has decided to PAY a vendor $300.00 per move of RON aircraft. They move TWO planes per night so doing the math 2 X $300= $600.00 Daily. Barring a leap year and a RON cancelation 365 x $600 = $219,000 Yearly. My Question is WHY? NO one in CCY can answer it. WE HAVE THE EMPLOYEES TO DO THE WORK! ! ! So anyone out here in cyper land, why would a company in BK twice throw away over $200,000 annually? Lets talk about great management. Bravo Zullo Bruce and Friends..............
Us Airways Bag Handler To Make Counterof
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repeet
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Hope777 said:
Because reducing costs is the excuse. Breaking Unions and reducing America's wages is the goal.
N628AU said:
After two rounds of give backs and assurances that management would ask for no more if given what they asked for, here we are again !
Because of those assurances made by management during earlier concessionary agreements the IAM had every right to use the phrase "the concession stand is closed"
Once US Airways jumped back into ch 11 in order to bust labor agreements the IAM had no choice but to open discussions with management and as the Bk law says, bargain in good faith.
Good faith is a term US Airways management is unaware of and judge Mitchell is payed to overlook.
Linemech
And how long has the company been in Chapter 11 now? Did anyone really think they were not headed to right where the company stands today? All this time wasted, when everyone could have been moving ahead and getting on with their lives.
ClueByFour
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USA320Pilot said:
How then do you suppose the AFA managed to get a deal which did not go over the ask and smells a whole lot rosier than the one obtained by ALPA?
Easy: strike vote. It appears that neither the company nor the creditors really want to see the place tank. Had the GAG8 on the ALPA MEC realized this, they probably could have obtained a better deal.
USA320Pilot
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Clue:
The company initially asked the AFA for $116 million per year in cost cuts, and with the PBGC agreeing to not oppose DB pension termination and the AFA providing a DC Plan provision, the stage is set for DB plan termination.
With the pending retiree health case changes per S.1114 and the DB plan termination, the AFA will see a higher cost cut than necessary, to the sum of $157 million per year.
It's too bad the AFA took a "hardline" approach and hurt their members more than necessary, but that is was they elected to do. You would have thought they would have learned from ALPA'S RC4 who directed the pilot negotiations and were the first MEC in the history of the union to provide a concession greater than the company's "ask".
By the way, did you miss the proposals and counterproposals or are you just clueless? Each union changed different parts of their agreement to suit their needs, but in reality, both are deep cuts.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
The company initially asked the AFA for $116 million per year in cost cuts, and with the PBGC agreeing to not oppose DB pension termination and the AFA providing a DC Plan provision, the stage is set for DB plan termination.
With the pending retiree health case changes per S.1114 and the DB plan termination, the AFA will see a higher cost cut than necessary, to the sum of $157 million per year.
It's too bad the AFA took a "hardline" approach and hurt their members more than necessary, but that is was they elected to do. You would have thought they would have learned from ALPA'S RC4 who directed the pilot negotiations and were the first MEC in the history of the union to provide a concession greater than the company's "ask".
By the way, did you miss the proposals and counterproposals or are you just clueless? Each union changed different parts of their agreement to suit their needs, but in reality, both are deep cuts.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
BillLumbergh
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K boys and girls, things are getting a little hot under the collar....
ClueByFour
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USA320Pilot said:
Well, no. You can't count the pension, since the company has been after it the entire time.
When you can't refute it, take a shot at the poster. I'm glad to see that you've returned to form. Given the choice, I'm quite sure a majority of both the flight attendants and the pilots on the property would rather have some combination of the RC4 and AFA president-elect running the show rather than the GAG8 and such. The votes speak for themselves. In the midst of concessionary contracts, the pilots and flight attendants have elected hardliners, much to the dismay of a few.
If nothing else, the AFA has pretty much cleared the way for the IAM-M to get what it wants from the company. Strike Vote. Of course, the problem is that the good boys and girls in the IAM-M can replace their current level of income relatively easily compared to some other groups, which will probably be making for much longer application queues in the flight departments of LUV, Jetblue, and the like in very short order.
I believe the saying is: Tic-Toc-Tic-Toc....
USA320Pilot
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Clue:
There was no insult, but it's clear you are clueless to what is actually happening.
Are you sure "given the choice, I'm quite sure a majority of both the flight attendants and the pilots on the property would rather have some combination of the RC4 and AFA president-elect running the show rather than the GAG8 and such."
How about Bill Pollock, Kim Snider, and Mike D'Angelo? By the way, what happens to ALPA's "roll call" balance of power on January 31?
Clue, are you sure "if nothing else, the AFA has pretty much cleared the way for Ihe IAM-M to get what it wants from the company. Strike Vote. Of course, the problem is that the good boys and girls in the IAM-M can replace their current level of income relatively easily compared to some other groups.
Does it seem peculiar that the IAM has not taken a position on self-help? Why, they have told negotiators that they know that more than half of their members must lose their job or have cost competitive contracts and they cannot make that decision. It is political suicide with AMFA "sitting on the sidelines".
In regard to replacing their job, the DOL reported earlier this year that automobile dealerships would hire an average of 4 mechanics per year in 2005. That is about 200 mechanic positions in Pittsburgh and Charlotte, for about 3,000 workers. The starting pay is less than $17 per hour, requires 54 weeks of training, and costs $18,000.
Finally, in regard to a strike, it's all rhetoric. Do you really think the bankruptcy court and the Bush Administration would permit a strike when the Republicans do not like labor? For a strike to occur the bankruptcy court would to not agree to the company's motion, the IA would have to win an appeal, the RLA would not apply, there would be no PEB, or no congressional intervention.
The ATSB has supported the company with 5 agreements, which indicates they want the airline to survive. The key move was the GE commitment, which I have been told was even more important than the ATSB's support.
Clue, much of this restructuring is a labor restructuring, which is supported by the Administration. Do I like it? No, of coups not, but it's reality.
By the way, who said on this board that there would be a deal with ALPA, AFA, CWA, and TWU that met the cost cut targets and the strike press releases were nonsense? Finally, the AFA agreement will place even more pressure on the IAM and without a TA, more pressure on Judge Mitchell to "impose" contract changes to support the creditors.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
There was no insult, but it's clear you are clueless to what is actually happening.
Are you sure "given the choice, I'm quite sure a majority of both the flight attendants and the pilots on the property would rather have some combination of the RC4 and AFA president-elect running the show rather than the GAG8 and such."
How about Bill Pollock, Kim Snider, and Mike D'Angelo? By the way, what happens to ALPA's "roll call" balance of power on January 31?
Clue, are you sure "if nothing else, the AFA has pretty much cleared the way for Ihe IAM-M to get what it wants from the company. Strike Vote. Of course, the problem is that the good boys and girls in the IAM-M can replace their current level of income relatively easily compared to some other groups.
Does it seem peculiar that the IAM has not taken a position on self-help? Why, they have told negotiators that they know that more than half of their members must lose their job or have cost competitive contracts and they cannot make that decision. It is political suicide with AMFA "sitting on the sidelines".
In regard to replacing their job, the DOL reported earlier this year that automobile dealerships would hire an average of 4 mechanics per year in 2005. That is about 200 mechanic positions in Pittsburgh and Charlotte, for about 3,000 workers. The starting pay is less than $17 per hour, requires 54 weeks of training, and costs $18,000.
Finally, in regard to a strike, it's all rhetoric. Do you really think the bankruptcy court and the Bush Administration would permit a strike when the Republicans do not like labor? For a strike to occur the bankruptcy court would to not agree to the company's motion, the IA would have to win an appeal, the RLA would not apply, there would be no PEB, or no congressional intervention.
The ATSB has supported the company with 5 agreements, which indicates they want the airline to survive. The key move was the GE commitment, which I have been told was even more important than the ATSB's support.
Clue, much of this restructuring is a labor restructuring, which is supported by the Administration. Do I like it? No, of coups not, but it's reality.
By the way, who said on this board that there would be a deal with ALPA, AFA, CWA, and TWU that met the cost cut targets and the strike press releases were nonsense? Finally, the AFA agreement will place even more pressure on the IAM and without a TA, more pressure on Judge Mitchell to "impose" contract changes to support the creditors.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
D
deano
Guest
USA320Pilot said:
FYI___Captain Kirk...I also am a licensed A&P mechanic and retired from U. I am not even close to doing a mechanics work, and never will. I am doing just fine "outside" the airline industry. Your tired worn out example of the auto mechanic for the U mechanics is condescending as well as annoying, like most of your posts are.
You act like the IAM membership has NO choice and MUST do whatever Glass and company demands. You are dead wrong and full of yourself, clearly and plainly out of touch with the U's mechanics reality which "YOU" don't live, so can it!
Curt
It's amazing that some individuals think that negotiations with this abominable management group would actually get them a better deal. UAIR is NOT interested in making a deal but rather only interested in BREAKING them.
They blew right thru our outsourcing language and spent countless millions fighting it in court. And inspite of the arbiters ruling they still got their way via BK. See any trends here??
UAIR is playing this BK like a fiddle. The IAM is now painted into a small corner of the room. (Why we didn't have a strike vote is beyond my comprehension.). But it seems that the M&R will be the only group not to have an agreement when the judge hears the final requests. What a coincidence.......You might say it was by design that we are at this point.
It's all about busting the unions at ANY expense. If you think otherwise then you are a complete fool. It won't be long before thousands of once loyal employees will be out on the street. And the irony of all this is that UAIR will still fail after it's restructuring is complete. Our management has been and will continue to be the reason UAIR will ultimately fail. PhD's, MBA's, BA's.......all bullcrap!!!
It will be interesting to see who the blame will fall upon when we are all gone and UAIR still can't turn a profit. I'm certain that the poor saps still employed by this third rate airline will once again subsidize the ineptitude of our over-paid and highly talented management. That's right......round 4 coming to a wallet near you!!
To all my fellow employees who have bravely stood up against this Hun and fought for justice in the workplace......Merry Christmas and a Blessed New Year. That goes for all of you who chose to roll over without a peep too.
They blew right thru our outsourcing language and spent countless millions fighting it in court. And inspite of the arbiters ruling they still got their way via BK. See any trends here??
UAIR is playing this BK like a fiddle. The IAM is now painted into a small corner of the room. (Why we didn't have a strike vote is beyond my comprehension.). But it seems that the M&R will be the only group not to have an agreement when the judge hears the final requests. What a coincidence.......You might say it was by design that we are at this point.
It's all about busting the unions at ANY expense. If you think otherwise then you are a complete fool. It won't be long before thousands of once loyal employees will be out on the street. And the irony of all this is that UAIR will still fail after it's restructuring is complete. Our management has been and will continue to be the reason UAIR will ultimately fail. PhD's, MBA's, BA's.......all bullcrap!!!
It will be interesting to see who the blame will fall upon when we are all gone and UAIR still can't turn a profit. I'm certain that the poor saps still employed by this third rate airline will once again subsidize the ineptitude of our over-paid and highly talented management. That's right......round 4 coming to a wallet near you!!
To all my fellow employees who have bravely stood up against this Hun and fought for justice in the workplace......Merry Christmas and a Blessed New Year. That goes for all of you who chose to roll over without a peep too.
ClueByFour
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I remain amused at how much squirming you can get out of those with very little spine and (more importantly) non-transferrable job skills.
A&Ps can generally find work fixing just about anything. Take a look around PIT next time you are enroute to LGA and consider that if it has moving parts, an A&P can probably fix it. Cars. Elevators. Generators. The list goes on and on.
Then consider how many $100k+ jobs are readily available to ATP holders.
It's going to happen, and no amount of hand wringing is going to stop it. The administration is not beholden to US anymore, especially after the election.
Bankruptcy courts have permitted strikes under Republican administrations in the past. In fact, they've been held to be expressly legal (in the case of Eastern, the court refused to issue an injunction). S1113 did nothing to change this, it simply codifies what has to happen before abrogation. No challange to a post abrogation strike has ever succeeded. I find it funny that every company stooge from Chiames on down forgets to mention this, but far be it from any of the spinmiesters to let facts or history get in the way of a good story.
Tic-toc-tic-toc.
A&Ps can generally find work fixing just about anything. Take a look around PIT next time you are enroute to LGA and consider that if it has moving parts, an A&P can probably fix it. Cars. Elevators. Generators. The list goes on and on.
Then consider how many $100k+ jobs are readily available to ATP holders.
It's going to happen, and no amount of hand wringing is going to stop it. The administration is not beholden to US anymore, especially after the election.
Bankruptcy courts have permitted strikes under Republican administrations in the past. In fact, they've been held to be expressly legal (in the case of Eastern, the court refused to issue an injunction). S1113 did nothing to change this, it simply codifies what has to happen before abrogation. No challange to a post abrogation strike has ever succeeded. I find it funny that every company stooge from Chiames on down forgets to mention this, but far be it from any of the spinmiesters to let facts or history get in the way of a good story.
Tic-toc-tic-toc.
RedOne
Senior
The original thread began with "counteroffer". Company or IAM can offer what they want...but if I am presented with anything which has in it to make all but 7 cities mainline express, my vote will be NO.
If the IAM presents something that will allow CWA and IAM agents in THE SAME STATION to have radically different outcomes (such as CWA remaining mainline, while IAM is relegated to express) not only will I vote no, I will buff up on dues objection and decertification.
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