US-East Observation Rides In Full Force

[Travelpro72]

In the past week I have had observation riders on my aircraft twice. They are looking at Safety procedures mostly but service is right up there as well. The one woman said that the safety stuff is being watched closely by the FAA due to the merger. Little stuff like stepping off the a/c, equipment checks and exit row cards for each seat. As for service, we all know that many don't know the service flow and procedures. She said and these were her words.."The company pays you for a flight. If in doubt of how the service is to flow check the newly published service guidelines." She did a flight to Vegas which I see this all the time. The crew did ONE (1) beverage with the BOB meal. They did NO coffee or arrival service. She handed them ALL service guidelines and they said "they didnt know". Ya have to be kidding me. LOL My take on that is, we are understaffed and sometimes it gets a little tiring but we all know the job...If you don't want to do the service or follow safety procedures GET OUT. I watch some do the service and they make it more difficult than it has to be. I thought the B was trying to find a cure for cancer it took them so long to get it done. So anyway, just be aware. The one f/a I'm flying with today has the stance of, "Psssshs whatever...I do what I want and NOBODY better say a word to me." Yeah well when they are the one paying the fine for doing something rediculous I'm sure they will remember our conversation.

 

[bofie]

It is just great to hear that Tempe is snapping the leash a little bit. In the past year I have seen much lower levels of service, esp from PHL-based crews (which particularly pains me to say since I am not a PHL basher).

If standards are not enforced then there will be the creeping decay that we've all seen.

 

[ab320driver]

It is just great to hear that Tempe is snapping the leash a little bit. In the past year I have seen much lower levels of service, esp from PHL-based crews (which particularly pains me to say since I am not a PHL basher).

If standards are not enforced then there will be the creeping decay that we've all seen.

I wish they would ghost ride more on the Republic flights. The two I have been on recently have been embarrassing and lacked professionalism in many areas. (appearance, and especially announcements.) The operation there REALLY needs to be watched closely. :angry:

 

[bigbusboy]

GOOD!!!!!! It's about time. Nice to see Tempe will crack down on all of the procedural interpretations out here. Normally I work transatlantic with a few 757 trips thrown in. I'm real tired of going through the transatlantic briefing and hearing nine different interpretations of procedure. Just do what is published in the manual. It's not difficult people. Another thing I'm real tired of is the debate about push/pull or full service on transatlantic. It's actually gotten to the point of crews getting into verbal fights in the galley. Where's the debate? The procedure is black and white, cut and dry. Push/pull on all eastbound flights departing after 8PM ONLY. And ALL flights westbound from Europe are full service. No excuses. Come on folks these are 7+ hour flights. There is plenty of time.

 

[Travelpro72]

I asked her what to do if you are flying with a f/a such as the B who is to run the show and they don't want to do a coffee service or arrival beverage. She said that they DO NOT run the show if it violates what is written in black and white. Start to set up your cart and head on out without them. More times than not they will follow and realize they are wrong. With the service at minimum levels, the transcon service being abbreviated by crews is insane. There are soooo many that want to come back to work. Just do the service. More times than not the f/a is making more than I am on that same flight across the country. If I can do it so can they. I don't mean to say that it's usually senior f/a's because there are certainly some junior ones that are lazy as well. It is just the case more than not that the senior person is flying the B or A (csd) position. Again if the CSD or A/B does not want to do correct service they can do NOTHING to you about following procedure. It does not make you a pain in the @$$ f/a or a fuddy duddy either. Just doing your J-O-B.

 

[LCC_#1]

Well, that's all good, but the company needs to look at the service overall and make changes...both in f/c and coach. To sell someone a BOB meal and then give them..after ice..what is about 1/4 cup of soda is STUPID and CHEAP. Please don't give me the lcc crap. This is a humanity issue. I GIVE and WILL give the entire can on a transcon flight and I WILL tell the ghost rider how I feel and tell her to KEEP her little service flow chart. This angers me as NOBODY listens to the fact that 5 hours is TOO long for such little amt of bev. I'll go down on this one TRAVELPRO, so rant on me for this one all you want. If the company gives bigger cups, then I'll DO the cup thing. What is the company going to do, fire me for doing MORE? The press would LOVE that and YES, I WOULD exploit that.

Having said that, to me the sin on the a/c is not at least giving what the company wants. It's one thing to give the entire can, but to take away turns me off. Sorry, I'm an old Piedmonster and we made plenty of money being generous and not being cheap. Having to take a paycut is no reason to cut the service.

When I am the A f/a, I say do procedure (except can issue) and to not take AWAY from the service. Now I can't be behind the curtain for the entire 5 hours. I have work to do as well. The B f/a is ultimately in charge back there in coach. If the service flow is such that there is taking away and there is a ghost rider who points it out, the B is the one running the show and should be the one to answer. When I am C, I will NOT fight with the other crew about this. I will question it, but I am NOT going out on a 4 day trip fighting crew members about service flow.

I am for cracking down, but even the westies I have talked to give the entire can on transcons. I mean, how STUPID that we give the entire can on a 30 min. Shuttle flight ...please don't give me the competition BS on this. It IS TOO SHORT, considering comparable domestic flights are REQUEST ONLY!!

Until the COMPANY gets consistant, please don't come crying to me with your little ghost riders and your service flows. :down: :down: :angry: :rant:

 

[bigbusboy]

I actually blame management (east) for allowing us to become indifferent towards procedure. For the past few years they have never focused on enforcing procedure with anything. Uniform compliance, safty procedures, serving procedures all have gone unchecked for years. This allowed F/As (me included) to do what ever we wanted to do. Our attitudes have become: we've been unsupervised for years, and now who are you to tell us how to do our job? I hope Tempe knows how to confront these attitudes and work ethics, because it's going to be a tough one to tackle. I applaud their efforts though.

 

[bigbusboy]

Travelpro, well said. That's what usually happens on transatlantic with juice and water. There's always one or two who are willing to do it and the remaining three or four who flat out refuse. But once at least one F/A starts the service, they all fall like dominos. Guilt I guess.
And LCC, good point. I'm with you on this one. Until they use a sensibly sized cup, it's full can on all transcon with a coffee service and arrival service (can only on request for the last service).

 

[xoxo]

I hope Tempe knows how to confront these attitudes and work ethics, because it's going to be a tough one to tackle. I applaud their efforts though.

Maybe when everyone goes to recurrent, they should talk about service procedures and that there will be ghost riders..and we need to start following procedures. I dont think it is all laziness with the east f/a's. I think that they go by whatever works best and is flowing well. There should be a coffee/water service or arrival if you are doing Vegas. I do not know why anyone would want to just sit for that long and do nothing? That is laziness. I myself would rather give the full can on first time out and then a glass for an arrival service. I remember on Metro Jet that we were forbidden to ever give the can even if they asked. How stupid!! We gave it anyway if they asked. Most of the time the procedures the company have do work..and if they do not ..just suggest it to them that something else will work better. I do know this..West has more of an open ear to suggestions and they are willing to change it if it works better. That is a fact.

 

[Travelpro72]

Ok, now I agree on the whole can issue. Transcon is far to long to only give a cup and especially when a meal is sold. How many f/a's give the can on flights to and from florida? Most usually say "Can" and load the already 300 pound cart with cans on top. If the customer wants a can and you set a cup down in front of them, they'll let you know they want the can. The whole can issue came about as a way to streamline the service and not have to "pour" cup after cup and wait for the foam to go down. Just pass the can and whizz through the cabin. The big "party cups" that I believe are from the west side are HUGE and will take the whole can almost so there ya go. I had the issue with the pursor on a flight to LGW and brought the meal cart back for another.... there were about 7 carts our all over the place. She turned to me and said, Haaauhhhh don't just leave that cart there." I said, Listen I'm not a mind reader and don't know what kind of new service your doing so I'll just take my next cart and go. I hate when someone more senior takes a position just because they can and COMPLETELY muffs the whole service up. 🙄

 

[xoxo]

I also think that with us furloughees coming back and we are all chomping at the bit to fly and work..there may be some head butting. There are some lazy ones that are returning..but for the mostpart..we are ready to come back and work. And as always..have fun while we are doing it. Because for me this job is fun also. 😛

 

[USstew23]

I thought the procedures for East and West were the same. West gives out the can on the first service on a BOB flight.

 

[hp_fa]

Travelpro has the right idea. If the other main cabin FA's don't want to do it or help, it is on their head. If there is a ghost rider on board they will figure the situation out and make the appropriate notations about who did and did not do their job. Just do your job and don't argue with any folks that want to do as little as humanly possible.

LCC's issue, to me, is different. Lcc's issue has to deal with not liking the policy that is being dictated by management. Travelpro is trying to comply with policy.

FWIW, the only reasons that HP management really listened to for service failures were because of turbulence or inflight medical reasons, and they would be documented by Irregs or other forms of reports. Even in those cases you were supposed to make a good faith effort to comply with normal service policy, but they know that after and hour with the seatbelt sign on there is the classic isse of getting carts out or allowing free access to the lavs without cart issues.

 

[Dog Wonder]

If these are "ghost riders" they must be to caught up in self-importance to remember the "ghost" part.

 

[SegmentKing]

hum... I did notice on my last CLT-PHX flight (930/10A A321) that we only had *one* beverage service... didn't even get anything before arrival!