Then your side tried to weasel out of it by forming a new union. And then you went to court and lost. So, you will agree to NIC.
Lots of folks on furlough wanted my job when the merger happened, USAPA founders are on record saying why they deserve to take my job. Now it seems they have sucessfully stolen some 142+ West jobs, and continue the fight to take more.
Snoop was right, for a short time USAPA will have West money to persue their attack of the West, but the backlash resulting from their misguided theivery has caused irreparable harm, and will strengthen the divide between the two groups.
As a seperated yet combined group we have furloughed out of seniority and there are east pilots working while there are West pilots senior to them furloughed( these same pilots were furloughed at the merger and are now working while the employed West pilots at the time of the merger are furloughed), there are also displaced West pilots who are now in F/O seats and F/Os who have never upgraded who all are senior to the junior east captains. This translates into the stealing of jobs.
USAPA spews the same union rhetoric as ALPA or any other organized group, the difference is they are not organized. The latest "lets get an industry leading contract talk" coming from both sides to further their arguement is laughable. Right now the best we can hope for is 78% of an industry standard contract ( a 30% raise for the east) and we will not even get that as long as USAPA is at the wheel. It will be contract 2000 and LOA93 for the duration of USAPA's fight to enhance east positions at the expense of the West.
Meanwhile, weâ€™ve got LOA84 pay rates, $70 M, pension investigation to look forward to. Your future is staring at a permanent fence.
Nic4, when the merger happened, who was on furlough? From what airline? â€œSucessfully stolen.â€ More flamebait. Please quote where the USAPA founders went on record saying they deserve to take your job.
â€œStealing of jobs?â€ More flamebait. If any jobs were stolen, they were stolen by the company. USAPA grieved this.
That Union was unfortunatly ousted by a mob of cry baby members AND NON MEMBERS from usair and replaced with an organization that has recently been found guilty of NOT representing me or any other former America West Pilot. I had the integrity to pay my dues to ALPA and they had the integrity to represent me. uspa has zero integrity, has been found guilty in a Federal Court for DFR, so why in the world would I pay for no representation unless I had a gun put to my head to do so which is the case here. usappa convienently demands enforcment of our section 29, which I honored for many years, yet won't honor the transition agreement.I pay my dues now because I'm forced to, period.
Who are the ones that really lack integrity?
What is going to happen when the West folks join and they and the moderates will control at least 35% of the votes? What happens if the East objectors decide to join so they can vote against USAPA?
You can say "majority rules" and thank you for the dues contributions, but is that the real scenario?
Alternatively, what happens when some objectors decide to legally question the germane issue as far as USAPA litigation expenses in connection with the DFR litigation? Megasnoop has posted that he reads the Ellis case as allowing for those funds to be deemed germane. I am not sure that I agree that his interpretation is correct under the prevailing circumstances in the Addington and RICO litigations.
The name calling will stop now--no more calling unions "organized crime", no more insulting work groups by misspelling their names (ALPA is just that, not ALPO or ALPOOO).
Please stay on topic.
Do you, and I mean very honestly, actually imagine that AWA would still be flying, had this monstrously mismanaged "merger" not taken place? If so....Why?..and on what basis? Specifics would be greatly appreciated.
I mean no nonsensical BS as to who supposedly "saved" who, as it's my guess neither would yet be in business.
A new union has to honor by law any existing CBAs and Arbitration awards, changing unions does not relieve it of the obligations, as you just saw a Federal Jury ruled on it.
And don't think LOA84 payrates are a walk in the park, back in 93 we had very strong snapback language and had to take it to arbitration and believe or not we lost, this was IAM M&R, the arbiter ruled that since the company did all the unions the same way and no one snapped back that we weren't entitled to the snapback even though the language stated" at the end of the pay freeze we would be placed on the next step as if we never had taken a cut and freeze upon the ending of the one year concessions"
Stranger things have happened when it comes to arbitration.
You guys= change of control. Lost (and should not have-but it is what it was)
US= A fixed contractual item with a start date, and an end date.
Such harsh words, eastpus. â€œmob, cry baby, found guilty, zero integrity, found guilty.â€ I guess your passing on the Labor Day Unity Picnic? Good to hear you had integrity. Honoring the transition agreement is what this all boils down to, something ALPA didnt do. Does a new union have to honor the decisions of the old union? The 9th will decide. Or maybe they wont. Worse scenario for both sides is that the 9th rules the case wasnâ€™t ripe and throws it out. Then what? USAPA â€œtestsâ€ the waters with a No-Nic contract? Hmmm. If that happens, does AOL try to raise another $2M and sue again? (1mil to pay for the new case, the other 1mil to pay their attorneys form that first case) This could be weird. What do you think, hp_fa?
35%? That still leaves 15% short majority. Their less than 14 delinquents in PHL and not many more non-members. The list reads like a whos-who in ALPA-FPLosers. There arent enough East objectors even with all the west pilots to get 50%. Even in their best days, west only had 82% alpa MIGS (that came from 2005 DOL report, so not made up).
Major rules the real scenario until the 9th speaks. Then, based on their rulings, no telling how this will continue to play out. Germane, non-Germane is the next battle. DH, LS, DB, CM and their ALPA hanger-ons are already working that angle. Looks like we get to spend more germane mx fee money to find out if Addington/RICO are germane. While that debate goes on, most will pay up in full or face being 29 fired. If they dont pay in full, at best theyll remain objectors with no vote.
I never agreed to NIC arbitration
Well, for starters we were not in bankrupcy when the merger happened.
AWA had been shopping merger partners ala ATA ....
Project "zanzibar" or whatever worse case scenario would not have been needed if the West turned in the numbers they did following the merger ....
Perhaps when fuel spiked it could have dealt a terminal blow,...
So who knows what would have happened to AWA sans merger?
That's unfortunate, since the ALPA merger policy does not seek your (or my) ratification or approval. I know you are upset and reacting, but I wouldn't hurt to read the ALPA section 45 and the AWA/AAA arbitration transcripts, and finally the actual Nicolau award (not just the numbr that you ended up with).
How much of our money (yes, I am member in good standing) are you willing to spend in a land grab that has been already settled (2, going on 3 x)? How much money are you willing to watch float away that you will NEVER be able to recover? The Kirby proposal +8% and other improvements would garner over $40,000 in wages, time off and other benefits.