C
Cosworth
Guest
So because one person/group does something bad justifies the act of the soldier?
How pray tell does my lack of faith have anything to do with respecting those who do?
So because one person/group does something bad justifies the act of the soldier?
How pray tell does my lack of faith have anything to do with respecting those who do?
Tug McGroin
Senior
So your moral equivalence of using an 8 year old in a suicide bombing is shooting a hole in a discarded Qur’an? You’re an idiot!
What would you call a person who has no respect for God or religion telling a total stranger to show respect for God or religion? On who’s authority do you reference?
C
Cosworth
Guest
Never equated the two, I said that one act does not in any means justify the other.
Where have I shown disrespect for religion? I have merely stated my beliefs.
Also, name calling nothing to support your argument.
Where have I shown disrespect for religion? I have merely stated my beliefs.
Also, name calling nothing to support your argument.
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
I was sure this thread would die due to the shear lunacy of a ‘sniper’ shooting a ‘book’ (apparently in my own values) even made the news.
After reading the 7 pages of this thread, and the ‘PC’ retorts, my heart is saddened.
Some of you ‘nuts’ advocate kicking this Soldier out of the military and ruining his life as some type of vindication for your political correctness.
Do I think he was right? No, but I do understand his ‘venting’ the frustration with his buddies being killed by the people they are trying to protect.
Where were his NCO’s and Officers? How many of them are being sent home?
JMHO, it is BS!
That this even became a ‘story’.
I recommend that that some of you nancies take a walk on the wild side before you run your mouth. War sucks, and this type of war sucks even worse. :down:
Glad I didn’t have to ‘read’ the freaking ‘Field Manual’ while trying to stay alive!
Try it, and then get back to me. :down:
After reading the 7 pages of this thread, and the ‘PC’ retorts, my heart is saddened.
Some of you ‘nuts’ advocate kicking this Soldier out of the military and ruining his life as some type of vindication for your political correctness.
Do I think he was right? No, but I do understand his ‘venting’ the frustration with his buddies being killed by the people they are trying to protect.
Where were his NCO’s and Officers? How many of them are being sent home?
JMHO, it is BS!
That this even became a ‘story’.
I recommend that that some of you nancies take a walk on the wild side before you run your mouth. War sucks, and this type of war sucks even worse. :down:
Glad I didn’t have to ‘read’ the freaking ‘Field Manual’ while trying to stay alive!
Try it, and then get back to me. :down:
KCFlyer
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
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- 11,582
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Yes...it's a shame. Especially when one considers that the primary reason that ANY American soldier is in the Middle East was because of Osama bin Laden...who's still around because liberating Iraqis became more important than punishing the guy who attacked US soil - and who is inciting others to kill American troops. God Bless George W Bush. Not.
The Koran..Qur'an...Bible...are just books.
Here is the book that should have been used:
View attachment 7582
Here is the book that should have been used:
View attachment 7582
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
KCflyer,
I think you have read my posts enough to know where I am from and where I am. If you read back far enough, I was never for this ‘Iraq’ war as I knew that we would be here ‘once again’. But this thread isn’t about the politics but IMHO the support of the troops that have to deal with this crap. I have and always will support our troops. They are in a shitty situation and until they are ‘released’ from their ‘assignment’, I will support them (been there-done that).
What is ‘really’ sad is the ‘PC’ police hold Soldiers to higher standards than they themselves are immune from.
I don’t give a #### about the ‘politics’ of it all.
B) UT
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
Gilding the Lily
Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 30, 2006
- Messages
- 1,466
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I think we would all agree that it would have been much better if this hadn't become a "story." Perhaps, that would have led to a lesser reaction by people in the middle east. Perhaps the soldier would have received a slap on the wrist, if any punishment at all. Perhaps we would have never heard about it.
Although to some it is about being PC; to me, it is about strategy. I liken it to a basketball game. Most coaches provide a strategy for each and every game. Against some teams you will play a rush/drive offense, fast pace, high intensity game. The goal -- beyond simply winning -- is to frustrate the other team... perhaps even get them enflamed because you know they do not play well when they are pissed off. Against another team, you may want to slow the pace down, reduce fouls to a minimum, and keep the intensity low... because you know that the other team is easily charged-up and they do more damage in that state. The coach is responsible for developing the strategy and engraining the strategy in the minds of the players. The players are responsible for carrying out the strategy and the team captain is the guide and example on the court. When players act in contradiction to the given strategy, it often leads to confusion/chaos, mishandling and, ultimately, may lead to a loss. Depending on the severity of failing to carry out the strategy, the Coach and/or captain may simply yell at the player or the player may be "benched". For more serious infractions, the player may be suspended for a certain number of games. Sometimes, if the first half did not go well, the coach may change the strategy during half-time.
Likewise, the heads of the military got together and changed the strategy for Iraq at half-time (let's hope that it was half-time and not just the first quarter). It is the responsibility of the heads to communicate that strategy to the soldiers and it is the soldiers responsibility to carry out the strategy on the battle field.
When soldiers act blatantly contrary to the current strategy, it can hurt the entire team and the entire effort. Even you, UAL, recognize that he was likely wrong. Is it possible that he never knew that his actions were wrong; that he was never given "that part" of the strategy? Perhaps. If so, maybe the officers in charge of doing that should be given the appropriate "punishment," whatever that might be. Was the soldier's punishment appropriate? I cannot say... I give deference to the officers on the field and in charge. They have more info than we do. (upon my limited knowledge, however, it does seem a bit harsh of a punishment).
I feel bad for the guy... because you are right, he was likely blowing off steam. But the reasoning behind the action does not replace the fact that he acted contrary to the current strategy in Iraq.
I think most people are frustrated at the severity of the punishment. I think had the soldier just received a rebuking and had to clean a toilet or something, then people would not be so frustrated.
I also think people are frustrated with the public apology and the manner in which the Koran was given by our soldier.
E
EastUS
Guest
Fully agreed.
"Although to some it is about being PC; to me, it is about strategy. I liken it to a basketball game." We can stop right there, and we're "done"...No one gets killed paying basketball ..or other "games". The most "savage" ...umm.."games" don't result in thousands of coffins. If you can even remotely consider killing people any "game"..we're on not only different pages..but not even within the same library/bookstore in life.
C
Cosworth
Guest
a·nal·o·gy
–noun, plural -gies.
- a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
- drawing a comparison in order to show a similarity in some respect; "the operation of a computer presents and interesting analogy to the working of the brain"; "the models show by analogy how matter is built up"
- A resemblance of relations; an agreement or likeness between things in some circumstances or effects, when the things are otherwise entirely different. Thus, learning enlightens the mind, because it is to the mind what light is to the eye, enabling it to discover things before hidden.
–noun, plural -gies.
- a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
- drawing a comparison in order to show a similarity in some respect; "the operation of a computer presents and interesting analogy to the working of the brain"; "the models show by analogy how matter is built up"
- A resemblance of relations; an agreement or likeness between things in some circumstances or effects, when the things are otherwise entirely different. Thus, learning enlightens the mind, because it is to the mind what light is to the eye, enabling it to discover things before hidden.
E
EastUS
Guest
Wow!..What an utterly unimpressive cut and paste!
Ummm..let me guess...within the standard "Liberal" Fantasyland of possessing self-ascribed, (but not actually existent), vast, and even unchartable intellectual capabilities..I should take that as an oh-so-not-subtle display of "brilliance"? :blink: 🙄 "If you can even remotely consider killing people any "game"..we're on not only different pages..but not even within the same library/bookstore in life." :angry:
You simply haven't even the tiniest "clue".
Bottom Line? = "Liberally" stupid and/or just generically insane morons everywhere (along with our murderous enemies of course) clamoured for an "off with his head" exercise....for a beleaguered, and properly irritable soldier...so far, far away from any enviornment that the "liberals" can actually even begin to imagine...and "some" of us, quite rationally, disagree with such clinically insane BS. The Good News is that liberals don't volunteer to serve and actually fight. The Bad News is that, protected by such people as do...you idiots are, tragically, actually given a vote...regardless of whether you're the least bit deserving of any such, by way of personal deeds in any fashion.
The man/soldier in question did nothing that should have been such a cause for any uproar..nor should he have suffered in the least for a few rounds tossed into some BS book...PERIOD.
Thanks for the educational moment..
I seem to remember "ogy" indicating 'study of' .....so it would seem then that this word implies a study of anals?
I see nothing,its quite dark in here.....
C
Cosworth
Guest
Wow!..What an utterly unimpressive cut and paste!
"If you can even remotely consider killing people any "game"..we're on not only different pages..but not even within the same library/bookstore in life." :angry:
You simply haven't even the tiniest "clue".
Bottom Line? = "Liberally" stupid and/or just generically insane morons everywhere (along with our murderous enemies of course) clamoured for an "off with his head" exercise....for a beleaguered, and properly irritable soldier...so far, far away from any enviornment that the "liberals" can actually even begin to imagine...and "some" of us, quite rationally, disagree with such clinically insane BS. The Good News is that liberals don't volunteer to serve and actually fight. The Bad News is that, protected by such people as do...you idiots are, tragically, actually given a vote...regardless of whether you're the least bit deserving of any such, by way of personal deeds in any fashion.
The man/soldier in question did nothing that should have been such a cause for any uproar..nor should he have suffered in the least for a few rounds tossed into some BS book...PERIOD.
How many of your conservatives in power who started this war have served in the military and seen combat? Lets start with the White House and work our way down.
Bush W - technically yes but we all know that story.
Cheney - 5 deferments
Rove - nope
Rumsfeld - yes
Mitch Connel - nope
Trent Lott - nope
Fred Thompson - nope
John McCain - yes
Dennis Hastert - nope
Dick Armey - nope
Tom Delay - nope
Bill Frist - nope
Rick Santorum - nope
John Ashcroft - nope
Newt Gingrich - nope
Phil Gramm - nope
Bob Dole - yes
Chuck Hagle - yes
Apparently conservatives (who actually get into power and send soldiers off to die) do not volunteer and actually fight either. Do you actually research anything you say or is more a shot off at the moth and hope something sticks?
Currently in the US Senate there are:
13 Dems
16 Repubs
who have served in the military.
In the Hose there are
9.9% Dems
12.5% repub
Presidents who served.
Dems
Rosevelt - nope
Truman - yes
Kennedy - yes
Johnson - yes
Carter - yes
Clinton - nope
Republicans
Reagan - kind of (made training movies)
Bush I - yes
Bush II - yes (kind of ... served in NG protecting Indiana, was AWOL for a bit)
On the Senate Armed services Committee 60% did not serve
Of those who did serve its a 20% / 20% sl=plit between Dems and Repub.
House Armed services is a 13% / 13% even split again of those who served.
All this info was found at this site:
Who Served
I am now beginning to understand why your party is doing so poorly. With people such as your self who just spout off with out verifying anything its no wonder.
Edited at 12:39 CST to correct some info.
