Why do they want St Louis???

[LambertMan]

For awhile now I''ve heard US has always wanted STL badly. I can think of a few reasons one being O & D over CLT and PIT, central hub location, lower prices per passenger, on-time performance, and the ability to have a much greater presence out west. Are there any other advantages STL would have over PIT, and have they ever had any definitive statements sayin they wanted the hub? It would be a nice insurance policy to the city if AA was to pull out.

 

[delldude]

hows about the long desired mid west hub?centrally located to mix feeder traffic from east/west?

 

[gilbertguy]

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On 4/5/2003 10:09:19 AM AA763 wrote:

For awhile now I''ve heard US has always wanted STL badly. I can think of a few reasons one being O & D over CLT and PIT, central hub location, lower prices per passenger, on-time performance, and the ability to have a much greater presence out west. Are there any other advantages STL would have over PIT, and have they ever had any definitive statements sayin they wanted the hub? It would be a nice insurance policy to the city if AA was to pull out.

Whichever city they(US) chooses, it will be what is most advantageous for RJ/EJ services....the more cities that can be designated "Express" the better, since this allows them to reduce costs i.e. employee wages in those cities.....

 

[sdavis29]

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On 4/5/2003 10:15:47 AM delldude wrote:


hows about the long desired mid west hub?centrally located to mix feeder traffic from east/west?

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i think they semi tried that also....mci.......

 

[delldude]

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On 4/5/2003 11:40:44 AM sdavis29 wrote:

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On 4/5/2003 10:15:47 AM delldude wrote:



hows about the long desired mid west hub?centrally located to mix feeder traffic from east/west?

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i think they semi tried that also....mci.......



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not from where i sit.indy was only a maintenence base at best.they always drooled at the prospect of twa and st.louis...only draw back from a buyout or merger was sr.employee pension payouts at twa.

 

[motnot]

Frankly, I''m not sure why AA wants STL. Sure, it''s a fairly large O/D city, but LUV''s got a big presence there. A weaker competitor like U (costs are down, but not enough for U to compete head-on in a large way with LUV -- AA has other things going for it) would surely not succeed in STL.

The only major that I think could really do something with STL is AWA (they''ve built themselves up right under LUV''s nose and have comparable costs), but I don''t think AWA would have any reason to do so. There''s just not a big payoff there for anyone.

 

[phllax]

MCI was pretty much dismantled after they started receiving the 757's that could do non-stop transcons from the hubs without a refueling stop. Most of the flying to/from MCI and the West Coast was with 200 & 300's that either originated in DCA and LGA, or couldn't make the trip non-stop from the hubs.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

re: U at STL.

The issue is connectivity and reach at a hub with more
O & D and lower costs. I don''t know if anyone at U is thinking about it. But, I think it''s only relevant to a non-UAL strategy. I mean (knock on wood) only if UAL goes under. (in which case, I think U will want to hook up with AWA, anyway to try to stay in Star. problems with awa/u integration aside, it would have to be easier and cheaper than picking up UAL assets)

Otherwise, get the connectivity with UAL; reduce big jet/short stage length at PIT with small jets and hook up with StarAlliance

 

[a320av8r]

STL makes the most sense as an alternative to PIT. We''ve always needed a mid-west hub. MCI too far west, PIT too far east. AA will retrench to ORD. WN can co-exist with a full service airline. If I were a betting man I''d put my money on STL. But then I had $50k in U stock.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

OUCH!

 

[DCAflyer]

Pineybob said:

From a PAX point of view STL is a toilet and that''s an insult to toilets. PIT financial considerations not withstanding is a much nicer connection point from the PAX side.

DCAflyer replies:

Bob, the STL facilities can easily be remodeled. Admitedly, I know little about STL, but with some good planning, maybe some airline (U) could make it a world-class facility.

Geographically, it''s perfectly situated and I think, FOR ONCE, that needs to be U''s focus. Let''s quit concentrating on the freaking east coast, where people can easily drive to most anywhere they want to go, and build a decent network (actually REBUILD a decent network) and do it right this time, with a hub that is geographically advantageous... and let''s stop running from LCC competition. Let''s build on our niche. LUV isn''t the be all and end all and a LOT of people don''t like flying them.

 

[Pacemaker]

STL is about two things - O & D and geography. STL would stretch out the route-structure in an east-west direction and provide for longer stage lengths, as well as allowing entry into a host of new markets in the west and far west. It would allow US Airways access to the Ohio valley for travel to points west which nearly all our competitors can provide but we currently can''t. And the STL metro. area would provide significantly more local traffic than PIT.

 

[iflyjetz]

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On 4/5/2003 10:15:33 AM PineyBob wrote:

From a PAX point of view STL is a toilet and that's an insult to toilets. PIT financial considerations not withstanding is a much nicer connection point from the PAX side.

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My friend, you are being far too kind. I'd compare STL with one of those porta potties. After a 5 day outdoor concert. Without anyone emptying them. And that's still an insult to the porta potty.

 

[MrMarky]

STL is very weak as an O&D hub. I haven''t seen any comparison statistics, but I seriously doubt it is stronger than PIT. AA wanted STL as a transit hub not an O&D hub. They were looking for ways to strengthen their O&D presence at DFW and especially at ORD by diverting transit connections through STL.

Additionally, the W1W project at STL is underway and will provide for greater bad weather efficiency by providing for parallel landings when weather goes below certain minimums and new terminal construction plans are in place, but obviously this is not a good time for airport terminal expansion projects.

 

[LambertMan]

MrMarky, that is not the case. STL is a much stronger O & D destination hub, STL is ranked 29th with nearly 10 million pax and PIT is hovering around 45th with 6 million or so. But the later is true however.