2014 Pilot Discussion

[Pi brat]

I have a question for East and West Pilots.
 
Does either or both your CBAs have the same language as all three IAM CBAs, the CWA CBA and the AFA CBA that permits you not to cross a sanctioned picket line at US property?

So you guys went out on strike that you couldn't win yourselves and wanted the pilots to sympathize with you(after taking massive cuts) to pull it off. You sure you don't work for ALPA?

 

[700UW]

Where ever did I say that?
 
I am asking for CBA language, thats all.
 
And I would never hold my breath for support from pilots, since you made a sweetheart deal with US in 92 to fly across the picket lines and the company grounded all the F28s, F100s, DC-9s, MD-80s and 737-200s and every pilot still got paid.
 
And filed hundreds of grievances against flight crews cleaning planes during the 30 day cooling off period.
And you and your labor traitors went to Seth and whined because of our buttons that said "thanks for nothing ALPA".
 
It is quite apparent that you dont give a crap about labor as you and your fellow pilots were always first in line to bend over for management and take concession, all the way back to 92.
 
And we won our strike, we came back on our terms and got double the money back for our concessions.
 
At least the AFA supported us and took a judge to order them back to work, which is now CBA allowed to honor a sanctioned picket line.
 
If there isnt anyone to fix, or load a plane or agents to check them in, good luck on getting paid this time when you dont fly.
 

 

[Claxon]

Where ever did I say that?
 
I am asking for CBA language, thats all.
 
And I would never hold my breath for support from pilots, since you made a sweetheart deal with US in 92 to fly across the picket lines and the company grounded all the F28s, F100s, DC-9s, MD-80s and 737-200s and every pilot still got paid.
 
And filed hundreds of grievances against flight crews cleaning planes during the 30 day cooling off period.
And you and your labor traitors went to Seth and whined because of our buttons that said "thanks for nothing ALPA".
 
It is quite apparent that you dont give a crap about labor as you and your fellow pilots were always first in line to bend over for management and take concession, all the way back to 92.
 
And we won our strike, we came back on our terms and got double the money back for our concessions.
 
At least the AFA supported us and took a judge to order them back to work, which is now CBA allowed to honor a sanctioned picket line.
 
If there isnt anyone to fix, or load a plane or agents to check them in, good luck on getting paid this time when you dont fly.
 

Your upstanding  peers defecated in passenger bags during your work action.  No one wanted anything to do with you after that.

 

[EastUS1]

No it's not but keep the spin coming, after all you are SpinThis. You can keep what you brought to this merge we don't want it at all.

 
Works for me, and after all, wasn't the whole west argument essentially just based on what they "expected" and of course "brought" to the (and presumably any) merger? Seems they're animals fully capable of changing their stripes as quickly as it suits them. "Integrity Matters" to them for sure! 😉

 

[nycbusdriver]

Let's cut to the chase, shall we? Your side wants to pretend that the old US Airways was in a better position than it was at the time. The arbitrator recognized this and made comments concerning the career expectations of our pilot groups.

Hate to break the news to you but this is going to be a factor in seniority talks with the APA.

 
Listen to what you are saying.
 
The APA is the union whose contract was with the bankrupt company  They can point out that US was in bankruptcy vs. Americas Worst, and that's why Nicolau put it to the east pilots.  But with that logic, they are torpedoing their own position, since this time AA is the bankrupt company.
 
That's EXACTLY why the APA won't take that absurd position, i.e. that somehow the bankrupt company's pilots deserve a rotten deal in any SLI.
 
Personally, I don't think the bankruptcy of either company in either merger is germane to the issue of seniority list integration.  Nicolau got it wrong in somehow thinking that pilots have any control whatsoever over corporate affairs, and therefore deserve reward or punishment based on that absurd notion.  It was not fair for the US Airways pilots in 2007, and it would be just as unfair to impose such idiotic logic on the American pilots in 2014.

 

[EastUS1]

 
Listen to what you are saying.
 
The APA is the union whose contract was with the bankrupt company  They can point out that US was in bankruptcy vs. Americas Worst, and that's why Nicolau put it to the east pilots.  But with that logic, they are torpedoing their own position, since this time AA is the bankrupt company.
 
That's EXACTLY why the APA won't take that absurd position, i.e. that somehow the bankrupt company's pilots deserve a rotten deal in any SLI.
 
Personally, I don't think the bankruptcy of either company in either merger is germane to the issue of seniority list integration.  Nicolau got it wrong in somehow thinking that pilots have any control whatsoever over corporate affairs, and therefore deserve reward or punishment based on that absurd notion.  It was not fair for the US Airways pilots in 2007, and it would be just as unfair to impose such idiotic logic on the American pilots in 2014.

 
Pretty much. Advancing the nic template would do exactly that as well.  I'm still waiting for any explanation from the west folks as to what reasons the APA might even possibly have for supporting the nic....?

 

[snapthis]

COOL! Lets show them how one of the two West bases had to be closed for lack of interest and that it took 24% East flying to prop up the other one (PHX) to meet your min fleet contract minimums.
 
Then we can show how US Airways as a whole was making record profits while AA was in bankruptcy.
 
Should be interesting...

Certainly your union did not work with East managers to make that happen.

They never take care of their own as you may find out in the near future.

Changes are a comin....

How's the future of RIo flying out of CLT, btw?

Should be interesting 😉

 

[700UW]

Claxon you are a liar, mechanic and related don't handle luggage, make up some more lies.

 

[EastUS1]

How's the future of RIo flying out of CLT, btw?

 
None can ever know. How's the future of Rio or ANY international flying out of PHX looking?

 

[nycbusdriver]

Where ever did I say that?
 
 
 

 
You can't be serious.
 
You bring that strike up at EVERY opportunity on these threads so that you can pummel the pilots who made concessions to keep the company afloat that your union would not entertain.  Well, FU and the horse you rode in on.  I happened to be on vacation for the two weeks of that strike.  But I would have walked across your back to get to work had I a trip scheduled.  Maybe I would have even made used of my A&P license to help the company break you idiots.  You deserved no help from the pilots after thumbing your nose at our collective effort to get through the difficult times.
 
I don't have the time or inclination to go back into the archives and find all your angry missive on just this point, but they are legion.
 
Give us all a break.  If you don't work here, WTF do you even care?  Go stick your nose in your own business.

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
Pretty much. Advancing the nic template would do exactly that as well.  I'm still waiting for any explanation from the west folks as to what reasons the APA might even possibly have for supporting the nic....?

 
I'm certain the APA is anxious to place hundreds of  "roadblocks" on the path of their own pilots' advancement.  They can't WAIT to get the Nicolau abortion in place, then go back to their pilots and tell them their advancement is now stalled....forever.

 

[end_of_alpa]

Not only are RTO's discussed in the news but in the classroom as well. Case studies have been completed and the following thesis is a good example. I think it would be safe to say that Duke is a respected university.

http://econ.duke.edu/uploads/media_items/losardo-zhu-thesis.original.pdf

Again?  REALLY?!?
Why don't you go back to the community college and take business 101.
 
That is NOT was Parker says and that is NOT what 10-K says.
 
In short LEGALLY:
 
"US Airways Group, a Delaware corporation, is a holding company formed in 1982 and whose origins trace back to the formation of All American Aviation in 1939. US Airways Group’s principal executive offices are located at 111 West Rio Salado Parkway, Tempe, Arizona 85281. US Airways Group’s telephone number is (480) 693-0800, and its internet address is www.usairways.com. US Airways Group’s primary business activity is the operation of a major network air carrier, through its ownership of the common stock of America West Holdings and its wholly owned subsidiary AWA; US Airways; Piedmont Airlines, Inc. (“Piedmont”); PSA Airlines, Inc. (“PSA”); Material Services Company, Inc. (“MSC”); and Airways Assurance Limited. On September 12, 2004, US Airways Group and its domestic subsidiaries, US Airways, Piedmont, PSA and MSC (collectively, the “Reorganized Debtors”), which at the time accounted for substantially all of the operations of US Airways Group, filed voluntary petitions for relief under Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code in the United States Bankruptcy Court for the Eastern District of Virginia, Alexandria Division. On May 19, 2005, US Airways Group signed a merger agreement, subsequently amended on July 7, 2005, with America West Holdings pursuant to which America West Holdings merged with a wholly owned subsidiary of US Airways Group. The plan of reorganization of US Airways Group and its domestic subsidiaries was confirmed by the Bankruptcy Court on September 16, 2005. The merger became effective upon US Airways Group’s emergence from bankruptcy on September 27, 2005. Following the merger, America West Holdings continued as a wholly owned subsidiary of US Airways Group."
 
Again for the LEGALLY IMPAIRED, AWA did not have the money to "acquire" US Airways.  To "combine" the airlines: 
 
"The merger has been accounted for as a reverse acquisition using the purchase method of accounting. As a result, although the merger was structured such that America West Holdings (LEGALLY) became a wholly owned subsidiary of US Airways Group, America West Holdings was treated as the acquiring company for accounting purposes (FASB) due to the following factors:
 
(1) America West Holdings’ stockholders received the largest share of US Airways Group’s common stock in the merger in comparison to unsecured creditors of US Airways Group;
(2) America West Holdings received a larger number of designees to the board of directors; and
(3) America West Holdings’ Chairman and Chief Executive Officer prior to the merger became the Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of the combined company.
 
As a result of the reverse acquisition, the 2005 consolidated statement of operations for the new US Airways Group presented in this report is comprised of the results of America West Holdings for the 269 days through September 27, 2005 and consolidated results of US Airways Group for the 96 days from September 27, 2005 through December 31, 2005. The results of operations for fiscal years 2004 and 2003 are those of America West Holdings."
 
I didn't anywhere in the 10-K AWA pilots had greater career expectations that anyone else.  Parker and Kirby will tell you that.  Go ask them.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Certainly your union did not work with East managers to make that happen.

They never take care of their own as you may find out in the near future.

Changes are a comin....

How's the future of RIo flying out of CLT, btw?

Should be interesting 😉

 
Yes.  I am sure the CLT pilots are worried sick over losing Rio.  Without that route, surely the company can't come up with other plans for the A330s, and will likely have to mothball those particular airframes since they won't be going to Rio anymore.
 
Did you even get through eighth grade?  Really?

 

[luvthe9]

Claxon you are a liar, mechanic and related don't handle luggage, make up some more lies.

Go back to your own board, but before you do we need the lavs dumped on A13

 

[luvthe9]

Certainly your union did not work with East managers to make that happen.
They never take care of their own as you may find out in the near future.
Changes are a comin....
How's the future of RIo flying out of CLT, btw?
Should be interesting 😉

Yes we know all about our international flying will be transferred to AA within a few years. We will be a narrow body airline. Right?