Announcement from USairways on 4/20/12 . That's all I can say

[EastUS1]

It sure hasn't taken Doug long to come to an agreement with three AA labor groups. If US pilots wanted a new CBA (which legally will have to contain the NIC), then they would have had one long ago. The US FA's aren't much better since they waited for six years to reach a TA and then rejected the offer negotiated for them by their own leadership.

"It sure hasn't taken Doug long to come to an agreement with three AA labor groups. " Of course not. He's in merger-mania/"gimme many millions!" mode. It's what's felt required for the deal to happen.

"The US FA's aren't much better since they waited for six years to reach a TA and then rejected the offer negotiated for them by their own leadership..." And? What's your point?...Other than dougie can do no wrong of course?..Perhaps that any that refuse mere scraps from the table, some seemingly poisonous, are wrong to do so?

Briefly consider the "flavor" of your "logic" = Had east pilots accepted the nic, all would somehow have resulted in a fantastic contract long ago....BUT...the FA's, who overwhelmingly rejected the toxic BS they were offered, after SIX YEARS...are somehow morons for doing so?

Does it escape you entirely that your "hero" doug was simply exploiting labor conditions and had, in no way shape or form, even the tiniest desire for any contract closings....until of course, merger mania came into direct play?

No offense...but no one can be that amazingly obtuse...or, at least...I'd thought not.

 

[Art at ISP]

ART you do know the Pilot issue has virtually nothing to do with management.

For the most part you may be right UP, but not quite completely. Management could have been more active in the pilots dispute, but they sat back and let it play out because in the end they have reaped the benefits of paying pilots some of the lowest wages in the industry all this time.

That said, the delay in getting an FA TA which was rejected has more to do with management than the pilots' situation admittedly...

Without picking hairs, however, this is far from done, and I just don't think it was appropriate for Parker to do what he did so early on........again they can't make a bid until at least September 28th......

There will be conspiracy theories galore--I just think this was wrong, whichever way it plays out. I wish Doug were as concerned with the employees of US as he appears to be with the employees of AA--but that just doesn't suit him right now.

 

[UPNAWAY]

The pilots would have killed management for interfering in their business initially. The only thing they could have done was once the protraction was obvious make an offer so great that both sides would put aside their differences. That obviously would have been not prudent economically.

 

[Phoenix]

For the most part you may be right UP, but not quite completely. Management could have been more active in the pilots dispute, but they sat back and let it play out because in the end they have reaped the benefits of paying pilots some of the lowest wages in the industry all this time.

That said, the delay in getting an FA TA which was rejected has more to do with management than the pilots' situation admittedly...

Without picking hairs, however, this is far from done, and I just don't think it was appropriate for Parker to do what he did so early on........again they can't make a bid until at least September 28th......

There will be conspiracy theories galore--I just think this was wrong, whichever way it plays out. I wish Doug were as concerned with the employees of US as he appears to be with the employees of AA--but that just doesn't suit him right now.

Considering what management has been up to with AA unions, should we really believe DP wanted/cared if the USAir FA contract was voted in?

As you say it appears he is more interested in laying out plans to the AA unions (with pay rates that USAir unions will go along with, or be out voted on as a combined carrier). It may be that the AA unions are just using DP to leverage their position with AA, but in the end its all about who has the most quid for the quo (Even you say, "Its the fares, stupid.")

 

[Harry Callahan]

Considering what management has been up to with AA unions, should we really believe DP wanted/cared if the USAir FA contract was voted in?

DP does NOT care about any of us, only the money going in his pocket.

Harry

 

[usfliboi]

"It sure hasn't taken Doug long to come to an agreement with three AA labor groups. " Of course not. He's in merger-mania/"gimme many millions!" mode. It's what's felt required for the deal to happen.

"The US FA's aren't much better since they waited for six years to reach a TA and then rejected the offer negotiated for them by their own leadership..." And? What's your point?...Other than dougie can do no wrong of course?..Perhaps that any that refuse mere scraps from the table, some seemingly poisonous, are wrong to do so?

Briefly consider the "flavor" of your "logic" = Had east pilots accepted the nic, all would somehow have resulted in a fantastic contract long ago....BUT...the FA's, who overwhelmingly rejected the toxic BS they were offered, after SIX YEARS...are somehow morons for doing so?

Does it escape you entirely that your "hero" doug was simply exploiting labor conditions and had, in no way shape or form, even the tiniest desire for any contract closings....until of course, merger mania came into direct play?

No offense...but no one can be that amazingly obtuse...or, at least...I'd thought not.

It didnt take long for the east to get a contract offer weeks after our contract became amendable....Not sure what your point is... We were givin a chance....our group chose not to accept it...Not his fault!

 

[EastUS1]

It didnt take long for the east to get a contract offer weeks after our contract became amendable....Not sure what your point is... We were givin a chance....our group chose not to accept it...Not his fault!

"We were givin a chance....our group chose not to accept it...Not his fault!" Sigh!....OK. If I'm seeking to put together the easiest possible package for a merger (which is my only motivation for even seeking any contract closure)....and I assume my employees to be morons, and so offer them an entirely sub-standard first proposal, again assuming they're so desperate they'll take anything.......nevermind. Let's keep this really simple: If I offer all of you 5 cents pay a year....it's "not my fault" if you choose not to accept it...is it?

As for "Not sure what your point is"...I'm hardly surprised.

 

[Move2CLT]

DP does NOT care about any of us, only the money going in his pocket.

Harry

"Us"? I thought you were 66 and retired.

 

[ChockJockey]

DP does NOT care about any of us, only the money going in his pocket.

Harry

Daddy issues much, Harry?

 

[ChockJockey]

As for "Not sure what your point is"...I'm hardly surprised.

Well. No matter how many times your pride in your hardheadedness ends up getting you shafted by corporate types, at least you'll always have the warm comfort of knowing you never backed down.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Did anyone notice the date of the Press Release? 4/20, the weed smokers holiday! Gives me pause to wonder what was going on in Tempe early Friday Morning?

 

[Art at ISP]

Considering what management has been up to with AA unions, should we really believe DP wanted/cared if the USAir FA contract was voted in?

As you say it appears he is more interested in laying out plans to the AA unions (with pay rates that USAir unions will go along with, or be out voted on as a combined carrier). It may be that the AA unions are just using DP to leverage their position with AA, but in the end its all about who has the most quid for the quo (Even you say, "Its the fares, stupid.")

Good points, Phoenix. We may all be jumping to conclusions and this could in fact be a ploy by AA unions to get a better deal with current management. We won't know however until at least Sept. 28.

That said, if the deal does not happen, I think other airline teams will not forget how he interfered with AA's process..he almost seems like a Bizzaro Carl Icahn....maybe if he doesn't get AA Spirit will buy US. 🙂

My best to you all....

 

[wings396]

Art, AA management can't make the same offer with the company as is. If you have read the APA statement, it indicates a fair amount of research done by all of the unions to reach their verdict. While not impossible, I doubt that they would have gone to that extent as part of a ploy. Your comparison with Icahn is a bit of a long shot. Parker isn't doing this in order to split up and sell off assets.

 

[Art at ISP]

Hence the word Bizzaro, Wings-

In any case, the speculation, while interesting, is quite premature. NOTHING can happen until September 28th.

 

[Phoenix]

Good points, Phoenix. We may all be jumping to conclusions and this could in fact be a ploy by AA unions to get a better deal with current management. We won't know however until at least Sept. 28.

That said, if the deal does not happen, I think other airline teams will not forget how he interfered with AA's process..he almost seems like a Bizzaro Carl Icahn....maybe if he doesn't get AA Spirit will buy US. 🙂

My best to you all....

A ploy maybe but I think the unions are just playing their cards they are being dealt and will go with the best deal at the end of the day, whatever it is and whoever has it.

On a side note, I find APA's glowing praise of Doug to be a bit shocking (Its almost as if Doug himself wrote/approved all the press releases and APA updates, and then passed them out to the unions and media to use as their own. And I am not really joking too much...)