August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Phoenix]

Given Silver's novel assertion that both sides were in danger of violating her order to negotiate with each other, the fact that both sides did show up to negotiate at her behest, and the proposals of that negotiation are sealed, what exactly will Silver look at to judge the merits of a DFR? Silver has shown no compunction for chiding folks for disobeying things she never ordered but claims she did. No one knows what new things she might have up her sleeve.

 

[prechilill]

Can one of you guys post a link to the new document? thx

It's on the AOL website JERRY

 

[prechilill]

And where in the heck is that KINGer dude today? Laying bricks in his pants maybe?
I mean, what better opportunity is there to proclaim the Nic is dead than a Federal Court room??? This is it Mark! All those things you sold your buddies on about Ustupid are about to be heard and decided by a federal judge- YOU"VE GOT THE WEST RIGHT WHERE YOU WANTED US... The fact you fought so hard to keep this out of court is bewildering, but the KING of whining over the NIC is about to get his day in court! And where the he!! is he???

😀





A. This Suit is Ripe
The Court need not linger on USAPA’s ripeness argument.

 

[prechilill]

Thinking about merits, how is Kinger's baby and crew going to argue they:

asked for arbitration

chose the arbitrator

participated in the arbitration to completion

got the results of the arbitration and then declared... the arbitration doesn't count.

Now tell me girls, how are you feeling about your position this morning? Got that awkward morning walk home now after a drinking binge, sober enough to realize you've been had after hearing an "I Love You" from a drunk...

Seham thanks you all.

RIPE

 

[Claxon]

Thinking about merits, how is Kinger's baby and crew going to argue they:

asked for arbitration

chose the arbitrator

participated in the arbitration to completion

got the results of the arbitration and then declared... the arbitration doesn't count.

Now tell me girls, how are you feeling about your position this morning? Got that awkward morning walk home now after a drinking binge, sober enough to realize you've been had after hearing an "I Love You" from a drunk...

Seham thanks you all.

RIPE

As ripe as it was with Wake. Not.
Another Arizona judge about to get a day in front of the 9 th.
get your popcorn. Parker is smiling. No JCBA with AA for 4 yrs. Lowest pay for 5 more yrs.
The new Amerikan. Amerikan West. Franke will be proud.

 

[snapthis]

If Parker brings along the derriere kissing AOL and your kind, the low pay for you will follow, it's elementary. Oh, from another thread:
Sounds like a job action to me. I'll be watching on the line for any West pilot advocating job action and report them.

Phoenix, AZ Charlotte, NC

Date: Saturday, July 20, 2013

Flight #298 Operated by Depart Arrive Status

US Airways PHX
Scheduled1:15 AM CLT
Scheduled8:10 AM Cancelled


US Airways #307 CLT
Scheduled9:50 AM PHX
Scheduled11:09 AM Cancelled

PHX Basic Indoc class September 3 - 16 has been cancelled


Please let me know if you have any questions.


Thank you,
Rana Glover
Senior Flight Crew Training Instructor
General Operational Subjects
Flight Crew Training

We have flights being cancelled, new hire classes being cancelled. It's a job action.

Yea right

 

[Claxon]

Thinking about merits, how is Kinger's baby and crew going to argue they:

asked for arbitration

chose the arbitrator

participated in the arbitration to completion

got the results of the arbitration and then declared... the arbitration doesn't count.

Now tell me girls, how are you feeling about your position this morning? Got that awkward morning walk home now after a drinking binge, sober enough to realize you've been had after hearing an "I Love You" from a drunk...

Seham thanks you all.

RIPE

I think they feel the same way they always have. They saw how Silver really didn't know her way around the RLA. And how Siegle didn't either, yet she listened to him.
The one mistake USAPA made was not having the Wilders in the house.
They won't make that mistake again. Either way, Silver will probably make the same stupid decision Wake did. She is the one who will do the REAL walk of shame in the 9th.
Either way, it is evident your pal Cactusboy has an inside friend in the court and company. You need to talk that one up. He doesn' t read my posts, so have the other maroon Cleardirect tell him.
Prechillil, the only way you get to sniff that seat is to ask permission from the east metal 330 guys.

 

[Claxon]

Phoenix, AZ Charlotte, NC

Date: Saturday, July 20, 2013

Flight #298 Operated by Depart Arrive Status

US Airways #307 PHX
Scheduled1:15 AM CLT
Scheduled8:10 AM Cancelled


US Airways CLT
Scheduled9:50 AM PHX
Scheduled11:09 AM Cancelled

PHX Basic Indoc class September 3 - 16 has been cancelled


Please let me know if you have any questions.


Thank you,
Rana Glover
Senior Flight Crew Training Instructor
General Operational Subjects
Flight Crew Training

We have flights being cancelled, new hire classes being cancelled. It's a job action.

Yea right

Parker can't even handle what he has now. DOJ take note.

 

[snapthis]

Parker can't even handle what he has now. DOJ take note.

By your logic (West pilots have STOLEN 25% of East flying).

We had three more pilots in 2005 when America West acquired US Airways than we do now. Would you not think 300 less pilots can do our flying but that 25% figure as well?

Splain that to the DOJ.

 

[Freighterguynow]

East new hire class cancelled... Rumors of the east fall bid to be cancelled... UH OH!

At POR fleet mins and tails go away- only thing left is scheduled block hours. East flying is loaded with 190's with possibly more coming- all which will NOW count in the east min block hours calculation UH OH!

TA Growth flying, stolen by the east, now being rolled into east block hour mins... UH OH!

76s going away, 73s going away... UH OH!

Talk of slot divestures in DCA- all east flying.... UH OH!

Bular, the great Usap enabler and sympathizer, going away next year. UH OH!

You clowns got a lot of UH OHs!

The value of a higher education .....

 

[cleardirect]

Given Silver's novel assertion that both sides were in danger of violating her order to negotiate with each other, the fact that both sides did show up to negotiate at her behest, and the proposals of that negotiation are sealed, what exactly will Silver look at to judge the merits of a DFR? Silver has shown no compunction for chiding folks for disobeying things she never ordered but claims she did. No one knows what new things she might have up her sleeve.

Are you under the false impression that the negotiation results are sealed from judge Silver?

Besides that little side show has nothing to do with usapa's DFR. I think the judge was quite clear in her order about how she is going to judge this case.

C. The West Pilots Have Stated a Claim

USAPA’s final argument is that the complaint does not satisfy Federal Rule of Civil
Procedure 8 because it does not allege sufficient facts to support a claim for breach of the
duty of fair representation. Given the parties’ history and extensive interactions, there is no
real question that USAPA knows how the West Pilots believe USAPA breached the duty of
fair representation. In other words, the complaint alleges sufficient facts such that USAPA
knows “the nature of [the West Pilots’] claim” and USAPA has “a fair opportunity to defend
against it.” Starr v. Baca, 652 F.3d 1202, 1216 (9th Cir. 2011). USAPA’s request to dismiss
for failure to comply with Rule 8 will be denied.

Judge silver is saying there is a long and complete record of what has happened and what usapa has done to violate their DFR. Why do you think she only scheduled this trial for ONE day. Judge Wake took 8 days to create the record. After years of bad behavior it will be very easy to rule on the former actions of this soon to be gone "union".

There may be a few twists and turns but the destination should be obvious. No LUP. No attempt at treating the west fairly.

A group of East Pilots formed a new labor organization known as USAPA. USAPA
was originally, and remains to this day, committed to the combined pilot list being based
primarily on date-of-hire. In other words, USAPA was formed to ensure that the Nicolau
Award not govern the seniority issue.

Shamanski lied to her in court when he told her usapa would consider the Nicolau. she caught him during the hearing. Silver gave usapa a chance to do the right thing but you easties have no ides even what the right thing is.

The end game is going to be a permenant injunction ordering usapa to use the Nicolau as the combined seniority list for the US Airways pilots. Just like we were supposed to use 5 years ago before your childish emotional temper tantrum. A tantrum that cost us all hundreds of millions of dollars and you easties your reputation and personal integrity.

The APA knows exactly who and what usapa and you easties are and are acting accordingly.

 

[dca319]

Therein lies the problem, your idea of what's fair to you vs. the rest of the world's idea of what's fair to the whole pilot group.

Even when the court system tells you your perceived idea of fairness is wrong?

Leave the world out of this.

 

[snapthis]

Even when the court system tells you your perceived idea of fairness is wrong?

Leave the world out of this.

It's not fair. It's not fair. I've heard it for years from their "union"

Nobody likes a whiner.

 

[snapthis]

As ripe as it was with Wake. Not.
Another Arizona judge about to get a day in front of the 9 th.
get your popcorn. Parker is smiling. No JCBA with AA for 4 yrs. Lowest pay for 5 more yrs.
The new Amerikan. Amerikan West. Franke will be proud.

You think the APA is going fund your stupid little appeal? You are going to be selling T-shirts to raise money when Leonidas gets your union's assets frozen.

 

[Reed Richards]

Wow, wake up on a layover and Judge Galactus has set up camp on the top of my building! The scary thing is Prechilli stuffed in that silver suit buzzing my windows!
Still digesting the order, but it's a doozy. Looks like USAPA legal is already on it, just saw this:
"In short, the Court has decided:
•    the claim "actually" at issue in this case is whether USAPA breached the DFR by entering into an MOU that "does not require USAPA go into the McCaskill-Bond process with the Nicolau Award,"
•    there are potentially disputed issues of fact concerning this claim that can only be resolved through an evidentiary hearing, and
•    the hearing will be held on September 24 following an orderly process that gives all parties time to prepare their claims and defenses."
Judge Silver told Marty over and over that USAPA does NOT have to use the award (under obvious penalty of death and dismemberment) if there is an alternative method that (now my own words) "does not violate the DFR." Addington I, the formation of USAPA, etc. are now all dead in this ruling, not just in courtroom banter. This case just got very, very small in scope. Did entering into the MOU with no NIC give cause to the West Class claim of a DFR? Period. That's it. One question. Somehow I think the 98% vote, as well as Silver's comments to Marty in April, are going to bracket the answer. If things go South in the ruling, USAPA already has a case to back to the Ninth on ripeness. I give Silver credit on her creative thinking that supposedly bypasses the Ninth ruling, but I predict it again won't hold water. IF this things goes beyond Judge Silver, we can all kiss goodbye any chances of a negotiated settlement with the APA guys. They are not going near such a thing with any litigation pending. On first read I don't see anything about the West Class getting a seat at the table, but I may have missed it. We might just get Greeter's wish of separate ops for years. I would prefer we get this thing together, but could finish out my career just fine in the three East bases. RR