August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Monkee]

That was clearly a truly brilliant strategy on your part, but; if "you'se" were simply using the opportunity to demonstrate what worthless excuses for "fellows" you were, are now, or could ever be, well..."you'se" succeeded admirably. 🙂

Jeez, do you even have an ounce of originality in you posts anymore? Another lonely night drinking and posting, trying to recapture your glory days... Cheaper than seeing a shrink I guess, but, obviously it isn't helping you...

 

[Monkee]

Put the bottle down Michael and get the help your rambling post clearly indicates you desperately need! Maybe your HIMS Committee people will help you up from the gutter...seeing as how much you believe USAPA has accomplished by alienating the west.

Mikey is just angry that no one will take him up on his emotionally needy challenges. It is pretty sad to watch, for someone else, but for him...well, it is oddly fascinating to watch his continued breakdowns.

 

[electricjet98]

Mikey is just angry that no one will take him up on his emotionally needy challenges. It is pretty sad to watch, for someone else, but for him...well, it is oddly fascinating to watch his continued breakdowns.

Shhh...let him sleep it off...again.

 

[mrbreeze]

The Company, MEC's and JNC had all earlier agreed that Pay Parity would result from the completion and ratification of a JCBA. The east's little tantrum and poor strategy of attempting a power-play by pulling out of JNC negotiations is what sentenced you to loa 93. Management and west pilots knew that keeping east pilots on loa 93 was the only way to motivate you to return to the table...and honor your obligations. Sharing the rum with Mr. Dale?

If that were the case, is it not obvious to you that declaring to the company that the "West pilots will be OUTRAGED if the pay parity should occur" is drawing a hard line in the sand? And does it not occur to you that you were trying to FORCE the East into a submission that was not acceptable? Again, that is where the divergence occurred. Your NIC lottery ticket blinded you so much that there was no other option.....you were to be fukin KINGS and would not be denied that leap frog ability. I remind you that for most of the East pilots, ALPA was already on their way off the property. Your militant attitudes just escorted them out the door. breeze

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

We can argue about pay parity and righteousness all night long, we pilots are all the same animal. The fact of the matter is, both sides set ourselves up for this trainwreck from moment one, with this dual ratification nonsense. IIWII at this point, lesson learned. It's done. Maybe in the next hundred years we'll get through this and be smart enough not to do it again.

 

[EastUS1]

Cheaper than seeing a shrink I guess,...

electricjet98/Monkee:

My apologies princesses, but I don't specialize in child psychology. Have a fine evening regardless. 🙂

 

[EastUS1]

We can argue about pay parity and righteousness all night long, we pilots are all the same animal. The fact of the matter is, both sides set ourselves up for this trainwreck from moment one, with this dual ratification nonsense. IIWII at this point, lesson learned. It's done. Maybe in the next hundred years we'll get through this and be smart enough not to do it again.

More reasonable people could've avoided this entire mess LS, but, as you well know; we're sadly stuck with things as they are. I'd wish it otherwise, as would you, but I don't see any viable exit from the proverbial "trenches" to be seen at this point...More's the pity.

I've long considered you as one of the sane and decent west folk, for what little that's worth.

I hope you and yours are doing well LS.

 

[Monkee]

electricjet98/Monkee:

My apologies princesses, but I don't specialize in child psychology. Have a fine evening regardless. 🙂

No, but you do specialize in acting like a needy child, I hope you get the self esteem you so desperately crave, but you aren't going to get it by drinking, or by pretending to be a stunt pilot. Get some new responses, you are like a broken record...

 

[mrbreeze]

More reasonable people could've avoided this entire mess LS, but, as you well know; we're sadly stuck with things as they are. I'd wish it otherwise, as would you, but I don't see any viable exit from the proverbial "trenches" to be seen at this point...More's the pity.

I've long considered you as one of the sane and decent west folk, for what little that's worth.

I hope you and yours are doing well LS.

Fully agreed 🙂

 

[EastUS1]

Fully agreed 🙂

If there'd been many more like LS, and far less wannabe "spartans" and "knights" who've Fantasyland notions of having apparently, by way of zero personal endeavors in the field/real world, felt some perverse need to demonstrate themselves as hopeless, utter infants that must somehow imagine they've "fought with valor in many battles" in supposed "war"...or are, by way of printing up T-shirts, magically made paradigms of "Integrity"...Oh well. No matter. Sigh! It is what it is. Consider the below, truly pathetic case, and I'd ask of ANYone how-in-hell they could even imagine generating the slightest shred of respect for "it"?:

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

If there'd been many more like LS, and far less wannabe "spartans" and "knights" who've Fantasyland notions of having apparently, by way of zero personal endeavors in the field/real world, feeling some perverse need to demonstrate themselves as hopeless, utter infants that must somehow imagine they've "fought with valor in many battles" in supposed 'war"...or are, by way of printing up T-shirts, magically made paradigms of "Integrity"...Oh well. Sigh! It is what it is.

I appreciate that, but I'm just as guilty as the next guy as to why we are here. At the time, I thought dual ratification after a seniority list was a good idea. It's just in retrospect that I now see how dumb an idea that really was. I'm still funding the west legal fund, and intend to keep doing so. I just think the pointing fingers at each other is really a waste of time, because we all made our bed. No one pilot, east or west has a lock on bad or good behavior. By virtue of greater numbers, it turns out the east had the ability to take this out farther than the west would have(ie usapa), but when I'm forced to think about it, I must admit I played a role in setting it up this way. What can I say then? I did it to myself. Oh well, if I wasn't smart enough to think it through a little farther to begin with, I really don't have any call to start blaming others.

 

[EastUS1]

I appreciate that, but I'm just as guilty as the next guy as to why we are here.

Noted. I don't believe anyone fully saw this mess coming, as it's worked out to date...hence the proverbial "trenches" reference. You're at least a reasonable man who actually thinks, doesn't imagine himself magically imbued with excessive "Integrity", nor claims "heroic" "war" service as any "knight"/"spartan"/etc, and I can't hold your support of your "own" at all against you. I'd do the same, after any line-in-the-sand was ever drawn.

Had the tiny handfull of fools that actually set all this in motion been able to share any similarly civil discourse...I'm thnking neither of us would be "here". It all seems a sorry waste of time and resources, that we ALL could've easilly avoided. Oh well/etc.

 

[mrbreeze]

If that were the case, is it not obvious to you that declaring to the company that the "West pilots will be OUTRAGED if the pay parity should occur" is drawing a hard line in the sand? And does it not occur to you that you were trying to FORCE the East into a submission that was not acceptable? Again, that is where the divergence occurred. Your NIC lottery ticket blinded you so much that there was no other option.....you were to be fukin KINGS and would not be denied that leap frog ability. I remind you that for most of the East pilots, ALPA was already on their way off the property. Your militant attitudes just escorted them out the door. breeze

Another very important point concerning the attitudes of the East pilots at this time....we accepted LOA93......a $9.8 billion pay cut over 10 years to preserve our jobs, which as a bottom line includes our seniority and the time served at this company. To have the West draw such a hard line in the sand was not acceptable......we paid our price already and sure as hell weren't going to cave in to your demands. I am not bitter or trying to be accusing here, just trying to shed some light. Again......that is where I thing the train left the tracks. Who's fault....I don't really know......but I do know that Parker played it to the hilt, now possibly having the opportunity to be the CEO of the largest airline in the world. Why? because we were not unified from day one. Good luck guys. breeze

 

[mrbreeze]

Another very important point concerning the attitudes of the East pilots at this time....we accepted LOA93......a $9.8 billion pay cut over 10 years to preserve our jobs, which as a bottom line includes our seniority and the time served at this company. To have the West draw such a hard line in the sand was not acceptable......we paid our price already and sure as hell weren't going to cave in to your demands. I am not bitter or trying to be accusing here, just trying to shed some light. Again......that is where I thing the train left the tracks. Who's fault....I don't really know......but I do know that Parker played it to the hilt, now possibly having the opportunity to be the CEO of the largest airline in the world. Why? because we were not unified from day one. Good luck guys. breeze

So, having said all that in the last couple of days......a question. Who is the only employee who has done any leap frogging since the AAA/AWE was announced? Doug Parker and crew. Who has given up the most? His pilots.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Noted. I don't believe anyone fully saw this mess coming, as it's worked out to date...hence the proverbial "trenches" reference. You're at least a reasonable man who actually thinks, doesn't imagine himself magically imbued with excessive "Integrity", nor claims "heroic" "war" service as any "knight"/"spartan"/etc, and I can't hold your support of your "own" at all against you. I'd do the same, after any line-in-the-sand was ever drawn.

Had the tiny handfull of fools that actually set all this in motion been able to share any similarly civil discourse...I'm thnking neither of us would be "here". It all seems a sorry waste of time and resources, that we ALL could've easilly avoided. Oh well/etc.

I fully saw this mess coming. Maybe not all the particular details we have seen and continue to develop. But in 2008 I realized that I would retire on LOA93. And that remains true absent the very iffy AA merger.

I'm long past being concerned about it; it is what it is.