August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[snapthis]

If the heart surgery was so critical that it could not be postponed (sounds like elective surgery to me), why didn't he simply head for the US, or another country, where he could purchase exactly what he needed when he wanted it?

I suspect I know why.

Maybe he could not afford that alternative...

Actually it was a woman in her late 30's. She had an irregular heatbeat and at risk of sudden death and needed a pacemaker.

She was in good health otherwise but was living with a timebomb. Maybe she went to the back of the line because of her age. I don't know.

Somebody in the system made decisions for her.

 

[im back..!!]

Yeah, you really had me agreeing. The auto thing is not a very good analogy.

And, as I was thinking of how to respond, you answered it yourself.

It's a tax. The government can require everyone to pay taxes, and does exactly that for the most part.

This is a bit of an odd tax in that it gets paid to private companies rather than to the government. It's a Republican plan in that respect, but since a black president managed to get himself elected and this law passed, the Republicans want to part of their own idea.

If President McCain passed this exact same originally Republican, Romney-esque health care plan, the Republicans would be triumphanty harping on how they saved health care for millions of Americans who could not have previously afforded it, and at the same time supported the health insurance business and not simply collecting more taxes into the treasury.

Exactly......

 

[cynic]

It was declared a tax by fiat.

The president and everyone that pushed it said that it was not a tax. The chief justice took a very tortured reading of the statute, that even his own writings don't support, and declared that it was legal because it was a tax.

 

[Claxon]

Plenty of time for the company to weasle out of promises and have a weak, unqualified and medically uncertified company paid union leader, plan your future for them.

"Thanks for all you do."


Q – I’ve read that if the antitrust case that’s blocking the merger is settled without going to trial, there may be a 60-day waiting period before the merger is actually approved and before there is an “Effective Date.” Is that true?

A – As everyone knows, the “Effective Date” is the date when the 2012 APA Contract pay rates, defined contribution payments, retrospective pay, and other provisions go into effect. We also know that the “Effective Date” does not occur until the antitrust case is resolved. There is much speculation that despite the strongly opposed litigation positions taken by the companies (US Airways and American) and the government, that it is in the interests of both sides to settle the dispute rather than roll the dice on a court decision.


The question is, what happens if there is a settlement? When does the merger happen and how soon after a settlement can we expect the “Effective Date?” Because the case is an antitrust dispute between the government and the companies, a federal law known as the Tunney Act applies. The Tunney Act, whose official title is the Antitrust Procedures and Penalties Act, 15 USC §16, generally requires a 60-day notice period before any settlement becomes final. The waiting period is designed to provide time for interested parties and the public to comment on the settlement, so those comments can be taken into account by the court before the settlement is approved. The Tunney Act, however, allows this period to be shortened but only “by order of the district court upon a showing that (1) extraordinary circumstances require such shortening and (2) such shortening is not adverse to the public interest." 15 U.S.C. Section 16(d). (The full text of section 16(d) is included below.) There is also the possibility that if a settlement is reached, the companies could go ahead with the merger even before the end of the comment period.
The short answer, like so many others in the law, is that whether we will need to wait 60-days after a settlement for an Effective Date “depends.” It could be 60 days, but it could be shorter. It depends on whether the court shortens the time period, and on whether the companies decide to go ahead before final approval of the settlement. While we all hope the case is resolved in favor of the merger, and that the resolution comes sooner rather than later, we’ll have to wait to see what the court and the companies decide to do.
Tunney Act, Section 16(d), 15 USC §16(d):
(d) Consideration of public comments by Attorney General and publication of response During the 60-day period as specified in subsection ( of this section, and such additional time as the United States may request and the court may grant, the United States shall receive and consider any written comments relating to the proposal for the consent judgment submitted under subsection ( of this section. The Attorney General or his designee shall establish procedures to carry out the provisions of this subsection, but such 60-day time period shall not be shortened except by order of the district court upon a showing that (1) extraordinary circumstances require such shortening and (2) such shortening is not adverse to the public interest. At the close of the period during which such comments may be received, the United States shall file with the district court and cause to be published in the Federal Register a response to such comments. Upon application by the United States, the district court may, for good cause (based on a finding that the expense of publication in the Federal Register exceeds the public interest benefits to be gained from such publication), authorize an alternative method of public dissemination of the public comments received and the response to those comments.

 

[Claxon]

"This last USAPA meeting was very contentious with a majority of the BPR demanding that Gary Hummel relinquish control of the union and adhere to the Constitution and by-laws as was intended at USAPA's inception. Gary did not want to give up that control, but more and more he has acted as though the BPR is just a side show and all decisions should be made at the executive level.


The 3 PHL BPR Reps and the 3 new CLT Reps have begun the campaign to take back their rightful place in the union and it couldn't come too soon.

Whether by design or just circumstances (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt), Gary Hummel lost track of what USAPA was all about. It is a bottom up union where the members vote for BPR Representation and it's the BPR that makes the decisions. The Executive Branch has it's duties and obligations to follow the Constitution and By-laws and to follow the will of the majority of elected BPR members.

This last go around with the MOU being secretly negotiated with ZERO input by the BPR was the final straw. Once Gary and the Negotiating Committee got the MOU from the company and had the pretty brochures with the talking points all printed up, it was only than that they told the BPR what was in it. Rightfully so, the BPR and most pilots were furious at the process. How did we get the MOU? Could it have been better? What did we miss? How much more could we have received? Gary will tell you nothing, but obviously when the BPR demanded retroactive pay, the company agreed. We will never know how a unified body could have achieved more because it was never offered. The company got what it wanted us to have with no input by our pilots.

Yes, most pilots voted for the MOU because it was basically a done deal by the time the BPR and the pilot group saw the finished product. That vote doesn't justify what happened.

On the issue of Gary Hummel's eligibility to remain President after losing his medical. In another heated debate, Gary's argument was that since the company is paying him and they are not forcing him to use his sick time, he should remain President. The BPR asked the USAPA attorney if Gary could remain President forever under these circumstances with the company paying him but not having a medical, the answer was yes. This is unacceptable and the BPR passed a resolution that Gary has to get his medical back within a year or there will be a new election.

I am not questioning Gary's honesty, but I know I have a problem with Gary remaining in office, not eligible to fly, paid by the company and not having to use his sick time. It gives the appearance of a conflict of interest.

If Gary was forced to leave tomorrow, he would not be able to go back to the line, so it could be argued that he needs to remain in office to keep that paycheck coming in. You or I would be forced to use sick time until it ran out and then long term disability. As long as Gary remains President with the company paying him, he does not have to meet those requirements. It could also be argued that it's human nature to identify with the side that's paying you. I'm sure that is not happening here, but it could give that appearance, especially during negotiations.

If you are going to be a union President, you should be able to perform the duties that the other members of your union perform. That way, you have "skin" in the game. No union officer should be above the requirements that any other member must have to remain at the airline.

The other way the BPR will take back control will be by the staffing of committees that Gary has not done. The By-laws state that the President selects the committee member candidates and the BPR votes on them. By not staffing the committees, the BPR is not given the ability to decide who will be staffing those committees. With proper staffing, the BPR decides who is on the committees and once again takes control.

This last meeting is a big step for establishing the intent of USAPA and I applaud the BPR members for taking it back.

Of course, as usual DCA and PHX BPR Reps sided with Gary. The good news is the PHL and CLT are united so who cares what DCA does. They make themselves irrelevant. "

 

[Claxon]

http://www.nasdaq.com/symbol/lcc/insider-trades

 

[Reed Richards]

"This last USAPA meeting was very contentious with a majority of the BPR demanding that Gary Hummel relinquish control of the union and adhere to the Constitution and by-laws as was intended at USAPA's inception. Gary did not want to give up that control, but more and more he has acted as though the BPR is just a side show and all decisions should be made at the executive level.


The 3 PHL BPR Reps and the 3 new CLT Reps have begun the campaign to take back their rightful place in the union and it couldn't come too soon.

Whether by design or just circumstances (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt), Gary Hummel lost track of what USAPA was all about. It is a bottom up union where the members vote for BPR Representation and it's the BPR that makes the decisions. The Executive Branch has it's duties and obligations to follow the Constitution and By-laws and to follow the will of the majority of elected BPR members.

This last go around with the MOU being secretly negotiated with ZERO input by the BPR was the final straw. Once Gary and the Negotiating Committee got the MOU from the company and had the pretty brochures with the talking points all printed up, it was only than that they told the BPR what was in it. Rightfully so, the BPR and most pilots were furious at the process. How did we get the MOU? Could it have been better? What did we miss? How much more could we have received? Gary will tell you nothing, but obviously when the BPR demanded retroactive pay, the company agreed. We will never know how a unified body could have achieved more because it was never offered. The company got what it wanted us to have with no input by our pilots.

Yes, most pilots voted for the MOU because it was basically a done deal by the time the BPR and the pilot group saw the finished product. That vote doesn't justify what happened.

On the issue of Gary Hummel's eligibility to remain President after losing his medical. In another heated debate, Gary's argument was that since the company is paying him and they are not forcing him to use his sick time, he should remain President. The BPR asked the USAPA attorney if Gary could remain President forever under these circumstances with the company paying him but not having a medical, the answer was yes. This is unacceptable and the BPR passed a resolution that Gary has to get his medical back within a year or there will be a new election.

I am not questioning Gary's honesty, but I know I have a problem with Gary remaining in office, not eligible to fly, paid by the company and not having to use his sick time. It gives the appearance of a conflict of interest.

If Gary was forced to leave tomorrow, he would not be able to go back to the line, so it could be argued that he needs to remain in office to keep that paycheck coming in. You or I would be forced to use sick time until it ran out and then long term disability. As long as Gary remains President with the company paying him, he does not have to meet those requirements. It could also be argued that it's human nature to identify with the side that's paying you. I'm sure that is not happening here, but it could give that appearance, especially during negotiations.

If you are going to be a union President, you should be able to perform the duties that the other members of your union perform. That way, you have "skin" in the game. No union officer should be above the requirements that any other member must have to remain at the airline.

The other way the BPR will take back control will be by the staffing of committees that Gary has not done. The By-laws state that the President selects the committee member candidates and the BPR votes on them. By not staffing the committees, the BPR is not given the ability to decide who will be staffing those committees. With proper staffing, the BPR decides who is on the committees and once again takes control.

This last meeting is a big step for establishing the intent of USAPA and I applaud the BPR members for taking it back.

Of course, as usual DCA and PHX BPR Reps sided with Gary. The good news is the PHL and CLT are united so who cares what DCA does. They make themselves irrelevant. "

Only 38% of the CLT pilots even bother to vote, hardly a majority decision. And angry McKee, Freedom Air Crimi, and the Mr. Flight Pay loss DeWitt returned to the line two days ago. If the BPR is not happy with the way Committee members are appointed, confirmed, removed, or how Officers are paid, then simply put a new CBL out for a vote; or amend the UOM. So easy a cave man could do it. RR

 

[Claxon]

Only 38% of the CLT pilots even bother to vote, hardly a majority decision. And angry McKee, Freedom Air Crimi, and the Mr. Flight Pay loss DeWitt returned to the line two days ago. If the BPR is not happy with the way Committee members are appointed, confirmed, removed, or how Officers are paid, then simply put a new CBL out for a vote; or amend the UOM. So easy a cave man could do it. RR

You did not mention the PHL reps or pilots, they will put this out for a vote with the CLT reps.

 

[Reed Richards]

You did not mention the PHL reps or pilots, they will put this out for a vote with the CLT reps.

About time. Stop the embarassing resolutions with names in them and change the CBL and UOM. Time to put up or shut up. The line pilots look forward to a vote.
And by the way, from the ratified CBL of USAPA:

"2. Amendment initiated by the Board of Pilot Representatives
a. The Board of Pilot Representatives may initiate amendments to the Constitution by a two-thirds (2/3) of the Board. Within thirty (30) days of the vote of the Board of Pilot Representatives, the Secretary-Treasurer shall distribute a ballot with the exactly worded amendment to all members in good standing. Such vote shall be completed within thirty (30) days of ballot distribution"

Maybe time to give up on making fun of the DCA reps, and time to start shaking hands with the PHX reps. Otherwise shut up. 2/3 required. Read it,learn it, live it.

RR

 

[Claxon]

You did not mention the PHL reps or pilots, they will put this out for a vote with the CLT reps.

The PHL Reps and pilots, you just mention CLT and DCA.

 

[Claxon]

Only 38% of the CLT pilots even bother to vote, hardly a majority decision. And angry McKee, Freedom Air Crimi, and the Mr. Flight Pay loss DeWitt returned to the line two days ago. If the BPR is not happy with the way Committee members are appointed, confirmed, removed, or how Officers are paid, then simply put a new CBL out for a vote; or amend the UOM. So easy a cave man could do it. RR

 

[Claxon]

Maybe time to give up on making fun of the DCA reps, and time to start shaking hands with the PHX reps.

RR

You are part of the problem, not the solution.

 

[Claxon]

"This last USAPA meeting was very contentious with a majority of the BPR demanding that Gary Hummel relinquish control of the union and adhere to the Constitution and by-laws as was intended at USAPA's inception. Gary did not want to give up that control, but more and more he has acted as though the BPR is just a side show and all decisions should be made at the executive level.


The 3 PHL BPR Reps and the 3 new CLT Reps have begun the campaign to take back their rightful place in the union and it couldn't come too soon.

Whether by design or just circumstances (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt), Gary Hummel lost track of what USAPA was all about. It is a bottom up union where the members vote for BPR Representation and it's the BPR that makes the decisions. The Executive Branch has it's duties and obligations to follow the Constitution and By-laws and to follow the will of the majority of elected BPR members.

This last go around with the MOU being secretly negotiated with ZERO input by the BPR was the final straw. Once Gary and the Negotiating Committee got the MOU from the company and had the pretty brochures with the talking points all printed up, it was only than that they told the BPR what was in it. Rightfully so, the BPR and most pilots were furious at the process. How did we get the MOU? Could it have been better? What did we miss? How much more could we have received? Gary will tell you nothing, but obviously when the BPR demanded retroactive pay, the company agreed. We will never know how a unified body could have achieved more because it was never offered. The company got what it wanted us to have with no input by our pilots.

Yes, most pilots voted for the MOU because it was basically a done deal by the time the BPR and the pilot group saw the finished product. That vote doesn't justify what happened.

On the issue of Gary Hummel's eligibility to remain President after losing his medical. In another heated debate, Gary's argument was that since the company is paying him and they are not forcing him to use his sick time, he should remain President. The BPR asked the USAPA attorney if Gary could remain President forever under these circumstances with the company paying him but not having a medical, the answer was yes. This is unacceptable and the BPR passed a resolution that Gary has to get his medical back within a year or there will be a new election.

I am not questioning Gary's honesty, but I know I have a problem with Gary remaining in office, not eligible to fly, paid by the company and not having to use his sick time. It gives the appearance of a conflict of interest.

If Gary was forced to leave tomorrow, he would not be able to go back to the line, so it could be argued that he needs to remain in office to keep that paycheck coming in. You or I would be forced to use sick time until it ran out and then long term disability. As long as Gary remains President with the company paying him, he does not have to meet those requirements. It could also be argued that it's human nature to identify with the side that's paying you. I'm sure that is not happening here, but it could give that appearance, especially during negotiations.

If you are going to be a union President, you should be able to perform the duties that the other members of your union perform. That way, you have "skin" in the game. No union officer should be above the requirements that any other member must have to remain at the airline.

The other way the BPR will take back control will be by the staffing of committees that Gary has not done. The By-laws state that the President selects the committee member candidates and the BPR votes on them. By not staffing the committees, the BPR is not given the ability to decide who will be staffing those committees. With proper staffing, the BPR decides who is on the committees and once again takes control.

This last meeting is a big step for establishing the intent of USAPA and I applaud the BPR members for taking it back.

Of course, as usual DCA and PHX BPR Reps sided with Gary. The good news is the PHL and CLT are united so who cares what DCA does. They make themselves irrelevant. "

 

[Reed Richards]

You are part of the problem, not the solution.

I have no vote or say either way, here or otherwise. How can I be part of anything? This is all for fun. But if you claim a sea change is coming, then at least have your voting math set. There will simply be no changes to the CBL sent out to the membership without DCA and PHX. RR

 

[traderjake]

The good news is the PHL and CLT are united so who cares what DCA does.

Did PHL and CLT give in to your blackmail for vacation pay?

How many days did you receive full pay while working (cough, cough) from home?