Phoenix
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Spot on. I couldn't have said it better. The EC seems to often be all about pandering apparitions for people to interpret for themselves. :huh:
Award will NOT be vacated
- Thread starter Junebug172
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Spot on. I couldn't have said it better. The EC seems to often be all about pandering apparitions for people to interpret for themselves. :huh:
Junebug172
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Pretty interesting post from my ALPA webboard:
This is an interesting and very technically worded resolution from the EC. They covered their legal “ends†and have ensured that all the “i’s†are dotted and “t’s†crossed. It certainly took longer that it should have had. That is a lesson learned for Prater. There are a couple of other lessons here though.
The first is that one should remember when someone (ahem…) is posting their predictions on an EC outcome (aka, stirring the pot), and their argument is supported by focusing only on a small part (a single sentence in this case) of a document (the ALPA C&BL’s in this case), they are most likely wrong. That narrow focus was posted loudly and often as a warning that the EC has the authority to interpret merger policy to our detriment. That person forgot to read the rest of the document. Our leadership, following the advice of council, was correct all along. The resolution states:
2. The Executive Council is a body of limited jurisdiction and authority with regard to seniority integration under Merger Policy. Although Part 1, Section B.3. of Merger Policy provides that “ssues as to application or interpretation of Merger Policy shall be determined by the Executive Council,†this authority is subject to other provisions in Merger Policy. In particular, Merger Policy provides that ALPA’s role in seniority integration “is solely to provide the process,†and that “ALPA National†is confined to “a neutral position on the merits.â€
The second lesson is, as Don Steinman related to me from his past MEC experience, don’t threaten the Executive Council with decertification in an attempt to bully them to see an issue your way. Such conduct as occurred at this weeks meeting, which resulted in the rather clear and unambiguous statement from the Executive Council that I believe is directed directly at the East leadership:
3 “BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that, in the absence of full cooperation with the process for achieving consensual solutions, the President, in consultation with the Committee, develop other procedures for solutions that will best fulfill our union’s representation responsibilities, and…â€
Think trusteeship as in what happened in the Air Wisconsin integration if the East continues to act in a manner that is contrary to the Transition Agreement. The East leadership has been warned. I can’t wait to read their response.
Overall, we should thank our union leadership for an excellent job handling this bump in the road caused by the East MEC. They didn’t carpet bomb National as some suggested. They didn’t panic and burn precious dollars filing counter litigation claims. They met and hashed things out, consulted legal council and also NC and MC committee members, and they developed and stuck with a strategy to deal with this problem. Now let’s return our focus back to the issue of getting a contract negotiated. Thanks for a job well done guys.
New word for you east guys:
TRUSTEESHIP
This is an interesting and very technically worded resolution from the EC. They covered their legal “ends†and have ensured that all the “i’s†are dotted and “t’s†crossed. It certainly took longer that it should have had. That is a lesson learned for Prater. There are a couple of other lessons here though.
The first is that one should remember when someone (ahem…) is posting their predictions on an EC outcome (aka, stirring the pot), and their argument is supported by focusing only on a small part (a single sentence in this case) of a document (the ALPA C&BL’s in this case), they are most likely wrong. That narrow focus was posted loudly and often as a warning that the EC has the authority to interpret merger policy to our detriment. That person forgot to read the rest of the document. Our leadership, following the advice of council, was correct all along. The resolution states:
2. The Executive Council is a body of limited jurisdiction and authority with regard to seniority integration under Merger Policy. Although Part 1, Section B.3. of Merger Policy provides that “ssues as to application or interpretation of Merger Policy shall be determined by the Executive Council,†this authority is subject to other provisions in Merger Policy. In particular, Merger Policy provides that ALPA’s role in seniority integration “is solely to provide the process,†and that “ALPA National†is confined to “a neutral position on the merits.â€
The second lesson is, as Don Steinman related to me from his past MEC experience, don’t threaten the Executive Council with decertification in an attempt to bully them to see an issue your way. Such conduct as occurred at this weeks meeting, which resulted in the rather clear and unambiguous statement from the Executive Council that I believe is directed directly at the East leadership:
3 “BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that, in the absence of full cooperation with the process for achieving consensual solutions, the President, in consultation with the Committee, develop other procedures for solutions that will best fulfill our union’s representation responsibilities, and…â€
Think trusteeship as in what happened in the Air Wisconsin integration if the East continues to act in a manner that is contrary to the Transition Agreement. The East leadership has been warned. I can’t wait to read their response.
Overall, we should thank our union leadership for an excellent job handling this bump in the road caused by the East MEC. They didn’t carpet bomb National as some suggested. They didn’t panic and burn precious dollars filing counter litigation claims. They met and hashed things out, consulted legal council and also NC and MC committee members, and they developed and stuck with a strategy to deal with this problem. Now let’s return our focus back to the issue of getting a contract negotiated. Thanks for a job well done guys.
In due time boo-boo, in due time.
New word for you east guys:
TRUSTEESHIP
EyeInTheSky
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Everybody knew ALPA was useless. Good thing they'll be given the old heave-ho very soon. Westies are you ready for a new union ride? Woo hoo!
Later,
Eye
Later,
Eye
flyboeing737
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Yep new union with the same list. Enjoy.
grog_sit_reserv
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I'm still a little foggy on how a new union will vacate the arbitrated award. Trust me, ALPA lost on this side too, so what next?
EyeInTheSky
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Phoenix
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ClueByFour
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With the same list. Let's not lose sight of that fact.
grog_sit_reserv
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Eye in the sky, why no new contract?
Phoenix
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Like I said. Depends on who you ask. As someone said, Its like being Shia and Sunni. There is no agreement on what happens to the list. Many say it lives, others say it dies. Both are too angry to be rational.
And there will never be peace at USAir.
EyeInTheSky
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Clue,
The list will always be there. If East has it's way (and they are the big majority) a new union will come on the property and that list will stay in UFO land. Simply put, I feel bad for Parker, this ALPA mess really has the company by the balls. Easties really don't give a crap anymore and they'll do whatever it takes to protect their senority. You have two groups at war with each other, what does that tell you? And why? It's all because of ALPA's cluster f&#k. You're all nuts to keep them on the property - get rid of them, they're useless.
Later,
Eye
The list will always be there. If East has it's way (and they are the big majority) a new union will come on the property and that list will stay in UFO land. Simply put, I feel bad for Parker, this ALPA mess really has the company by the balls. Easties really don't give a crap anymore and they'll do whatever it takes to protect their senority. You have two groups at war with each other, what does that tell you? And why? It's all because of ALPA's cluster f&#k. You're all nuts to keep them on the property - get rid of them, they're useless.
Later,
Eye
USA320Pilot
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Junebug,
You must not have read the same resolution that I did because the resolution does not deny the US Airways pilots' request to have the Nicolau award overturned nor does it authorize the list being sent to US Airways.
Furthermore, the EC is clearly of the opinion that taking any action at this time would not be appropriate.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
You must not have read the same resolution that I did because the resolution does not deny the US Airways pilots' request to have the Nicolau award overturned nor does it authorize the list being sent to US Airways.
Furthermore, the EC is clearly of the opinion that taking any action at this time would not be appropriate.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
flyboeing737
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July 20, 2007
Special MEC Update
Today the ALPA Executive Council issued a resolution regarding the US Airways pilots’ request that ALPA overturn the Nicolau award. Without saying so directly, the resolution rejects that request. More specifically, the Executive Council resolution makes it clear that ALPA’s only responsibility - and its only authority - is to provide a fair process for the resolution of seniority issues following the merger of two airlines. That process, set out in Merger Policy, encompasses negotiation, mediation and ultimately arbitration. In this case, all those steps were made available to both pilots groups. In other words, ALPA provided the process and has fulfilled its obligation under Merger Policy. The Council clearly stated that it is up to the Arbitration Board alone, not ALPA National, to decide the merits of the case. The Executive Council Resolution has made it clear that it may only set aside an award if the procedures of Merger Policy were not followed or if the Award was the product of fraud. Further, the resolution goes on to say that “No evidence has been presented of any impropriety in any aspect of the process which would support finding that ALPA has not provided the exact process that it was obligated to provide, including negotiations, mediation, and arbitration.†Absent such a finding, the resolution states that Merger Policy provides that the award is “final and binding†and that ALPA’s responsibility is to defend the award and ultimately present it to the company and use all reasonable means to cause the company to agree to it. Finally the Executive Council resolution states that “taking other action on this agenda item…is neither called for nor appropriate at this time.â€
In addition to finally laying to rest the issue of overturning the award in the absence of evidence of fraud, the Executive Council acknowledged that both east and west pilots continue to face serious issues with regards to achieving a joint contract that will bring improved pay, work rules and job security to all the pilots of US Airways. This is principally because a joint contract will bring the seniority list to life, and the East pilots seem committed to keep that from happening – even if doing so keeps their pilots from gaining the economic benefits a new combined contract will bring to them. As a result, the Executive Council resolution seeks to bring practical solutions to this dilemma by continuing the work of the Rice Committee in assisting both pilot groups to work together in achieving a joint contract.
In the days and weeks ahead our pilots should look forward to further communications from the National Union on these important issues facing both of our pilot groups. This communication campaign will include roadshows by the National Officers and members of the Rice Committee. Those roadshows will be an excellent opportunity for all of you to directly communicate with the ALPA leadership.
It’s important to remember these points:
The Executive Council will not vacate the Nicolau Award unless impropriety in the merger process can be proven. No such accusation has been made by either party. With this resolution, the only jurisdiction the Council retains is narrowly specific to accusations of impropriety.
Although the Award will stand and be defended by ALPA, it cannot be implemented without a joint agreement.
The primary focus of all America West pilots should now shift from the Award to maximizing financial and other gains for all pilots by achieving a joint contract and avoiding ALPA’s decertification.
Look for further communication from the MEC in the days and weeks to come as we start to further refine and focus our legal and political strategies to ensure the interests of our pilots are fully protected.
In the meantime, please continue to fly safe and secure.
Special MEC Update
Today the ALPA Executive Council issued a resolution regarding the US Airways pilots’ request that ALPA overturn the Nicolau award. Without saying so directly, the resolution rejects that request. More specifically, the Executive Council resolution makes it clear that ALPA’s only responsibility - and its only authority - is to provide a fair process for the resolution of seniority issues following the merger of two airlines. That process, set out in Merger Policy, encompasses negotiation, mediation and ultimately arbitration. In this case, all those steps were made available to both pilots groups. In other words, ALPA provided the process and has fulfilled its obligation under Merger Policy. The Council clearly stated that it is up to the Arbitration Board alone, not ALPA National, to decide the merits of the case. The Executive Council Resolution has made it clear that it may only set aside an award if the procedures of Merger Policy were not followed or if the Award was the product of fraud. Further, the resolution goes on to say that “No evidence has been presented of any impropriety in any aspect of the process which would support finding that ALPA has not provided the exact process that it was obligated to provide, including negotiations, mediation, and arbitration.†Absent such a finding, the resolution states that Merger Policy provides that the award is “final and binding†and that ALPA’s responsibility is to defend the award and ultimately present it to the company and use all reasonable means to cause the company to agree to it. Finally the Executive Council resolution states that “taking other action on this agenda item…is neither called for nor appropriate at this time.â€
In addition to finally laying to rest the issue of overturning the award in the absence of evidence of fraud, the Executive Council acknowledged that both east and west pilots continue to face serious issues with regards to achieving a joint contract that will bring improved pay, work rules and job security to all the pilots of US Airways. This is principally because a joint contract will bring the seniority list to life, and the East pilots seem committed to keep that from happening – even if doing so keeps their pilots from gaining the economic benefits a new combined contract will bring to them. As a result, the Executive Council resolution seeks to bring practical solutions to this dilemma by continuing the work of the Rice Committee in assisting both pilot groups to work together in achieving a joint contract.
In the days and weeks ahead our pilots should look forward to further communications from the National Union on these important issues facing both of our pilot groups. This communication campaign will include roadshows by the National Officers and members of the Rice Committee. Those roadshows will be an excellent opportunity for all of you to directly communicate with the ALPA leadership.
It’s important to remember these points:
The Executive Council will not vacate the Nicolau Award unless impropriety in the merger process can be proven. No such accusation has been made by either party. With this resolution, the only jurisdiction the Council retains is narrowly specific to accusations of impropriety.
Although the Award will stand and be defended by ALPA, it cannot be implemented without a joint agreement.
The primary focus of all America West pilots should now shift from the Award to maximizing financial and other gains for all pilots by achieving a joint contract and avoiding ALPA’s decertification.
Look for further communication from the MEC in the days and weeks to come as we start to further refine and focus our legal and political strategies to ensure the interests of our pilots are fully protected.
In the meantime, please continue to fly safe and secure.
It wasn't ALPA's cluster*** it was East's MEC who attempted to sell their membership down the path to where they are now.
Junebug172
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When did I ever state anything about a resolution?
Allow me to quote Prater's letter - the one that accompanied the resolution.
"The jurisdiction of the Executive Council in response to the AAA request to set aside the Award is limited to determining whether ALPA provided the process specified in Merger Policy. In this case, the Council took note the "no evidence has been presented of any impropriety in any aspect of the process which would support a finding that ALPA has not provided the exact process that it was obligated to provide."
Its pretty clear that any hope of vacating the award should now be allowed to die.
