Bye-Bye AirBii Fleet retirement begins

[AAviator]

Can anyone confirm? Heard from a couple of sources....

 

[Hopeful]

Can anyone confirm? Heard from a couple of sources....

Yes it's true. Spoke to rep in A300 tech services. Three A300s per year will be retired for the next 4 years starting in 2008. In 2012 all remaining A300 will be retired. Coincidentally, 2012 is when the A350 is scheduled to start service. He mentioned either the A350 or B787 will be the replacement aircraft.

 

[FWAAA]

10 of them are owned and 24 more are leased. Three leases expire this year and in 2009; nine more each in 2010 and 2011. That will take care of the 24 leased AB6s.

My prediction has long been that AA will find some used A-market (or even new) 777s to replace the AB6s. Lotsa cargo space, plenty of pax capacity and fairly low acquisition costs. Three dozen or so in a two-class configuration that would seat about 300 each.

 

[1AA]

My prediction is:
The A330.

The 777 too big for the same markets and not enough aircraft in the fleet to replace.
The 787 too new and not enough to go in service quick enough.
The A350 too new and not built yet and bigger than the A330.
The A330's are available now to replace the A300's one for one.

I hope AA doesn't make the same mistake with the MD-11's. They sold the MD-11's to FedEx before we could take delivery of the 777 to replace them. We ended up paying FedEx to keep the MD-11's until the 777's came on line. That was costly.

 

[777 fixer]

My prediction is:
The A330.

The 777 too big for the same markets and not enough aircraft in the fleet to replace.
The 787 too new and not enough to go in service quick enough.
The A350 too new and not built yet and bigger than the A330.
The A330's are available now to replace the A300's one for one.

I hope AA doesn't make the same mistake with the MD-11's. They sold the MD-11's to FedEx before we could take delivery of the 777 to replace them. We ended up paying FedEx to keep the MD-11's until the 777's came on line. That was costly.

I don't see the A330 joining AA's fleet. One of the reasons AA is retiring the A300 is to reduce the number of types in the fleet. Why do that and then bring on a new type? Especially considering that AA is going to either order the 787 or A350. That would mean two new fleet types instead of just one.

 

[Hopeful]

I don't see the A330 joining AA's fleet. One of the reasons AA is retiring the A300 is to reduce the number of types in the fleet. Why do that and then bring on a new type? Especially considering that AA is going to either order the 787 or A350. That would mean two new fleet types instead of just one.

Once all three unions have reached new agreements with AA, you will see new aircraft orders..

 

[1AA]

Like I said before the 777 is too big of an aircraft to replace the A300 routes. AA does not have enough spare 777's in the inventory. The 767 might replace some A300 routes but AA needs them on overseas and South America. To replace the A300 you have the 787 but too far down the road. The same problem with the A350. So I still believe the A330 would be a logical choice. Then again when does AA make logical choices. I spoke to an Airbus technical Rep. and he told me that there are many similarities between the A300 and the A330. As far as reducing fleet types, that is well and fine but the bottom line here is money. The A300 makes money even though it is a maintenance pig. The A330 would be a new aircraft in the inventory and holds more freight and passengers. I am not an Airbus fan but you must look at reality.
There are other options in the mean time to fill in the time gap and that would be lease 767's or similar types until AA acquires a new replacement such as the 787 or A350 or more 777's.

As far as all three union agreements are in place you do not have to worry about the TWU. They always agree to save jobs and the company at any cost to the members. The pilots union is always an issue especially when it comes to new type aircraft and pay rates and work rules.

 

[777 fixer]

Like I said before the 777 is too big of an aircraft to replace the A300 routes. AA does not have enough spare 777's in the inventory. The 767 might replace some A300 routes but AA needs them on overseas and South America. To replace the A300 you have the 787 but too far down the road. The same problem with the A350. So I still believe the A330 would be a logical choice. Then again when does AA make logical choices. I spoke to an Airbus technical Rep. and he told me that there are many similarities between the A300 and the A330. As far as reducing fleet types, that is well and fine but the bottom line here is money. The A300 makes money even though it is a maintenance pig. The A330 would be a new aircraft in the inventory and holds more freight and passengers. I am not an Airbus fan but you must look at reality.
There are other options in the mean time to fill in the time gap and that would be lease 767's or similar types until AA acquires a new replacement such as the 787 or A350 or more 777's.

IMO if AA is going to order any aircraft to replace the A300 that they can get rather quickly they might as well get more 767-300. While there may be similarities between the A300 and A330 they are two different animals. Kind of like the 767 and 777. Buying A330's would mean getting pilots type rated for it, added maintenance training, buying spare parts etc, etc. With the 767-300 the support network is already in place.

The 767-300 is the cheaper option. And now that Boeing has lost the USAF tanker contract AA probably could get a real good price on them.

 

[Nor'Easta]

Or the easy solution to the problem...


Buy CO or NW! Both carriers have new planes (777, 767, A330, 737-8) and both are receiving the 787.

 

[PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH]

How about replacing the Scarebus with 767-400's? Boeing specifically designed the -400 model to replace older A300's and L1011's. Probably could pick some up out in the desert or from another airline real cheap.

 

[Skymess]

IMO if AA is going to order any aircraft to replace the A300 that they can get rather quickly they might as well get more 767-300.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! Please!!!!!! God no! Anything but that :censored: plane.

 

[AMFAMAN]

How about replacing the Scarebus with 767-400's?

Continental has a bunch of those. <_<

 

[FWAAA]

How about replacing the Scarebus with 767-400's? Boeing specifically designed the -400 model to replace older A300's and L1011's. Probably could pick some up out in the desert or from another airline real cheap.

Boeing was able to convince only two airlines to order the 764: CO took 16 of them and DL bought 21 of them. Maybe they'd let go of them, but I dunno.

While 763s would be cheap and available on short notice, I thought the problem with the 767 series on these Caribbean routes was the 767's inability to fit two LD-3s side by side; the 767 is just a little too narrow and has to use the smaller LD-2s.

While the 777 is indeed larger than the AB6, it offers the ability to carry 32 LD-3s v. only 22 in the AB6. Lots more cargo and more room up top for seats. Most of these AB6 routes offer several daily frequencies - 777s could replace them with -1 or -2 daily flights each. While business-heavy routes demand high frequency, do these routes really need 6x or 7x a day? Like JFK-SJU?

The A350XWB has morphed into a 777-sized airplane, so if the 777 is too big, so is the A350XWB (extra-wide-body). I seriously doubt it's flying prior to 2018 or so (if ever).

My vote? 3 or 4 dozen A-market 777s.

 

[777 fixer]

How about replacing the Scarebus with 767-400's? Boeing specifically designed the -400 model to replace older A300's and L1011's. Probably could pick some up out in the desert or from another airline real cheap.

Only thrity seven of the -400 were delivered to Delta and Continental. I believe that all of them are still in operation.

 

[Skymess]

Boeing was able to convince only two airlines to order the 764: CO took 16 of them and DL bought 21 of them. Maybe they'd let go of them, but I dunno.

While 763s would be cheap and available on short notice, I thought the problem with the 767 series on these Caribbean routes was the 767's inability to fit two LD-3s side by side; the 767 is just a little too narrow and has to use the smaller LD-2s.

The biggest problem is the P.O. box size overhead bins. Small bins + caribbean market= trouble