Thats a small expense to the cost of fully leveraged or leased assets not in the air. A plane on the grounds meter runs very fast
Dan Garton puts full blame on AA mechanics
- Thread starter jetmechjer
- Start date
Thats a small expense to the cost of fully leveraged or leased assets not in the air. A plane on the grounds meter runs very fast
Hmmmm....Interesting comment...."Plastic Cups" from a predepartue drink a safety issue?...Not, but "Thousands" of dollars in personal fines to a F/A for having them out becomes a "SERIOUS" safety issue when it envolves their own livelihood...Now others ,AMT's etc...are feeling the wrath of the FAA, not to mention, the company as a whole.
Nancy....YOU ARE CORRECT...It "All" leads to the top, but they are too busy spending thier bonus checks to worry about the actual running of this company.
Eric....
The FAA has their reasons for having these directives...The Point is, they ARE THE AUTHORITY! Call it nitpicking, etc...it is, what it is, but it's the Law! AA knows what the law is, it's in writing, and it wasn't followed.
cybercat
Advanced
I'm just a mystery writer so I see plots everywhere. That being said, is it possible that the AMR Corp is planning to spin off the airline the way the Trans World Corp spun off the airline to "restructure union contracts."????? :angry:
DING! DING! DING!...We have a winner! Thank you Cybercat....Not just Trans World Corp but Eastern etc.....Sell it off, and spin it off!
title1 for life
Member
Having direct contact with the issue.Having seen the AD in person. I am sure this is all political. The AD alowed a certain amount of leeway in the placement of the string ties on these bundles. The VP called them cords today on the news. I don't have it in front of me now but it did reference the locations of ties at 1" approx.
The AD has grown to a whooping 29 pages long at present. It always amazes to read comments derived solely from speculation. By persons hell bent on accusing people of wrong doing. And no these are not precise to the letter. That is why the FAA can continue to change and reinterpret the rule as they go along.The problem is the wording of the document.Now they have came out and said exactly what they will accept.But even the FAA is having a hard time in what they will accept.
If all of this was as black and white and as clear cut as you say it is none of this would have happened. I count myself proud to stand with the other AMT's in america.
Cheers Title1
eolesen
Veteran
- Jul 23, 2003
- 15,914
- 9,360
Well, if you listen to what some of the wrenches are, there was a lot on this particular AD which wasn't necessarily in writing, and what was in writing kept changing.
I don't think anyone has a problem following the rules, but I do have a problem with the rules changing in mid-game.
The intent of the AD was followed, which is what matters in the end to most people. That message isn't getting out, unfortunately, because of all the scare-mongering in the media.
The Feds are under the gun, and AA just happened to be the nearest dog to kick. It's that simple. I'm hearing more and more of that from outsiders and independent bloggers. Eventually, the FAA's masters (Congress) will realize that as well, and go back to fixing the real problem instead of letting the FAA continue to use leeches and bleeding out to fight a hangnail...
Your forgetting at the time that TWA was spun off from TWA Corp, TWA Corp owned a whole lot more than just TWA. AMR owns AA and AE and their associated operations. Spin of Mainline and you spin AMR into oblivion.
Hooray for the FAA.
While grounding the entire MD80 fleet due to relatively minor discrepancies (1 inch +/- .25) may seem a bit extreme, especially when in the past we saw an MD-80 dive into the Pacific killing all on board and the FAA continued to let the aircraft fly, I see this as a potentially good development for aircraft mechanics. Lets not forget how 737s were doing flips into the ground due to rudder malfunctions yet no grounding of the 737 fleet. The last time I saw such a large grounding of a fleet size was back when the DC10 fliped in ORD. So now they ground a fleet for something minor, but if they stay this vigilant if could be good for us.
If all future maintenance is held to the same exacting standards,AA will have to hire a lot more mechanics, they will actually have to buy the tools and consumables that their paperwork tells us to use and other airlines, since they too would come under similar scrutiny, will likely have to bring work back in house due to quality control issues. Needless to say the FAA will have to hire a lot more A&Ps as inspectors. All this is good news for aircraft mechanics. The demand for mechanics would be so high that even if oil went to $300/barrel we could get the pay and benefits we need. If the FAA holds firm with “make it exactly right or set it down†policy it could be the best thing that ever happened for us.
So if you are an A&P don’t bash the FAA this time. Sure it seems petty but one of the things we were taught in A&P school is that sometimes minor, seemingly inconsequential things can be a link in the chain of events that lead to a major disaster. Despite decades of being subjected to “it flew in it’ll fly out†returning to the basics shouldn’t be that hard and it could very well restore not only our professionalism but our financial well being as well.
While grounding the entire MD80 fleet due to relatively minor discrepancies (1 inch +/- .25) may seem a bit extreme, especially when in the past we saw an MD-80 dive into the Pacific killing all on board and the FAA continued to let the aircraft fly, I see this as a potentially good development for aircraft mechanics. Lets not forget how 737s were doing flips into the ground due to rudder malfunctions yet no grounding of the 737 fleet. The last time I saw such a large grounding of a fleet size was back when the DC10 fliped in ORD. So now they ground a fleet for something minor, but if they stay this vigilant if could be good for us.
If all future maintenance is held to the same exacting standards,AA will have to hire a lot more mechanics, they will actually have to buy the tools and consumables that their paperwork tells us to use and other airlines, since they too would come under similar scrutiny, will likely have to bring work back in house due to quality control issues. Needless to say the FAA will have to hire a lot more A&Ps as inspectors. All this is good news for aircraft mechanics. The demand for mechanics would be so high that even if oil went to $300/barrel we could get the pay and benefits we need. If the FAA holds firm with “make it exactly right or set it down†policy it could be the best thing that ever happened for us.
So if you are an A&P don’t bash the FAA this time. Sure it seems petty but one of the things we were taught in A&P school is that sometimes minor, seemingly inconsequential things can be a link in the chain of events that lead to a major disaster. Despite decades of being subjected to “it flew in it’ll fly out†returning to the basics shouldn’t be that hard and it could very well restore not only our professionalism but our financial well being as well.
One of the many reasons I choose to fly American Airlines is because AMR does most of its maintenance work in house with supremely experienced mechanics under much closer supervision from the FAA than the overseas chop-shops get. You do a fantastic job.
hp_fa
Veteran
- Feb 19, 2004
- 3,290
- 178
That is a valid point. What is going to happen now with the inspections of airlines that out-country their maintenance?
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
Not being a ‘conspiracy theorist’ could it be that AA is being hammered unjustly ‘because’ it has the most in-house maintenance?
With their near-perfect record, this 'event' helps to portray the outsourcing effect neutral?
Naaa, that’s just crazy… -P
B) UT
What Garton had to say in a letter to the TWU:
Gentlemen,
I would like to apologize to you and every American Airlines mechanic who were left with the perception that I was "blaming" the mechanics for our MD80 AD challenges. The mechanics are not to blame. I know how hard our maintenance team has worked to fix this problem and I know they are highly skilled professionals. I am proud to be a part of the company in which they work and I would (and do) trust them with my life hundreds of times a year.
Channel 8 worked hard to create this "blaming" issue. I was actually asked who is to blame for this during the interview. I would like to share my answer to that, it is verbatim.
Q: People want to know who is to blame for this.
A: "American Airlines has to take responsibility for the disruptions they've experienced. We're very apologetic for that. I cannot say that more than I have. We're very sorry for it. We have to take responsibility for it.
In the end, it would have been our job to have followed the strict guidelines that were there. We felt, and our mechanics felt, that they had greater latitude. They did not, and that was our mistake".
The quote they included in the clip was part of my answer to the question "Did your mechanics not understand it or did they ignore it"? My answer - part of which was in the clip started "It's a relatively significant engineering change order. It's about 30 pages. The mechanics understood it. When they accomplished it, they took what I would call certain latitudes in accomplishing it. My example would be where they tied those cords".
I recognize that each and every day we rely on the judgment of our mechanics to interpret maintenance requirements in the repair of our aircraft. It appears to me that the FAA is revoking that latitude.
I am extremely sorry if this was taken as throwing our highly skilled and experienced mechanics under the bus. I think you all know me - I wouldn't try to do that.
Finally, one last quote, which of course Channel 8 chose not to include, "We have 80,000 employees working extraordinarily hard to solve this for the customers. I want to take a special moment to thank all of these people who have worked way beyond their normal hours and their normal jobs to accomplish this work".
That is how I really feel - I am sorry if I left any other impression in anyone's mind.
Dan
Gentlemen,
I would like to apologize to you and every American Airlines mechanic who were left with the perception that I was "blaming" the mechanics for our MD80 AD challenges. The mechanics are not to blame. I know how hard our maintenance team has worked to fix this problem and I know they are highly skilled professionals. I am proud to be a part of the company in which they work and I would (and do) trust them with my life hundreds of times a year.
Channel 8 worked hard to create this "blaming" issue. I was actually asked who is to blame for this during the interview. I would like to share my answer to that, it is verbatim.
Q: People want to know who is to blame for this.
A: "American Airlines has to take responsibility for the disruptions they've experienced. We're very apologetic for that. I cannot say that more than I have. We're very sorry for it. We have to take responsibility for it.
In the end, it would have been our job to have followed the strict guidelines that were there. We felt, and our mechanics felt, that they had greater latitude. They did not, and that was our mistake".
The quote they included in the clip was part of my answer to the question "Did your mechanics not understand it or did they ignore it"? My answer - part of which was in the clip started "It's a relatively significant engineering change order. It's about 30 pages. The mechanics understood it. When they accomplished it, they took what I would call certain latitudes in accomplishing it. My example would be where they tied those cords".
I recognize that each and every day we rely on the judgment of our mechanics to interpret maintenance requirements in the repair of our aircraft. It appears to me that the FAA is revoking that latitude.
I am extremely sorry if this was taken as throwing our highly skilled and experienced mechanics under the bus. I think you all know me - I wouldn't try to do that.
Finally, one last quote, which of course Channel 8 chose not to include, "We have 80,000 employees working extraordinarily hard to solve this for the customers. I want to take a special moment to thank all of these people who have worked way beyond their normal hours and their normal jobs to accomplish this work".
That is how I really feel - I am sorry if I left any other impression in anyone's mind.
Dan
So let me see if I have this right.....Southwest screws up with a major directive regarding issues that could cause the skin of the aircraft to rip off during flight, thus exposing passengers to possible death. Then they get called to DC to testify in front of Congress along with the FAA.
Then, the FAA in order to practice a little CYA starts a hardcore investigation of AA and the MD80's for a technical order about how to far apart some clips can be in the wheel well, claiming that it could cause a center fuel tank expolsion? Southwest acutally had some planes that did have fractures on the skin of the aircraft, but from where I'm sitting all I see is that the FAA and the Dallas office in order to show they have teeth to Congress is coming down on American Airlines when in fact Southwest is the one that actually put peoples life in danger......
Is that the jest of the issue..........
Then, the FAA in order to practice a little CYA starts a hardcore investigation of AA and the MD80's for a technical order about how to far apart some clips can be in the wheel well, claiming that it could cause a center fuel tank expolsion? Southwest acutally had some planes that did have fractures on the skin of the aircraft, but from where I'm sitting all I see is that the FAA and the Dallas office in order to show they have teeth to Congress is coming down on American Airlines when in fact Southwest is the one that actually put peoples life in danger......
Is that the jest of the issue..........
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