Dec 2012 / Jan 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[prechilill]

Chill, may not have come across that way, but it was a compliment on your unity. No dig there.

See you and crazy Suzi in court also, after the APA integration.

Greeter

Ok, I believe you. You are reasonable, much more than the Cleary crowd is. Who is crazy Suzi?

 

[cleardirect]

It really is impressive that PHX was able to get almost 98% of their guys to act in unison. I know I will just take incoming for saying this, but if we could all get on the same page, any page, it would really help us in our dealings going forward with the APA. Probably won't happen if there is any perception on either side the NIC can still be used.

Based on the new makeup of the BPR, I now change my tune. I don't see any chance of a mutual agreement on seniority. We are going to arbitration. And I believe our 4 crew bases have the most to lose in that process. So sad.

And I missed my estimate on the vote, I thought it would be 80% or greater. Kudos to Ciabattoni, he ruled the roost in PHL. But nowhere else.

Greeter

Yep the west pilots are unified. Will be until the Nicolau is in place. Something we could bring to the table if we were not under attack from the start. we can be unified against usapa, against the company against the APA if we have to. Right now usapa is the clear and present danger.


I agree with you about the new make up of the board, no playing nice with the APA full on arbitration and the full 24 months. The key will be the run off. Will that guy be the swing vote or will Mckee get his 6-5 cabal?

Ciabottoni gets some of the credit but don't forget that DiOrio is in PHL too. The oreo I would say gets as much or more credit/blame for the PHL vote and all of the no voters.

 

[cleardirect]

If US had liquidated, the other airlines would have quickly bought up the coveted slots and real estate. The pilots would have most certainly been hired by the other carriers. Yes, it would have been inconvenient. AWA would not have been far behind, only exactly what were the coveted slots and real estate that would have been offered by AWA? I doubt UA or AA or WN would have wanted to touch the cactus. So who would have been the biggest losers? I think it is safe to assume the airplanes would have been taken much like what seems to be happening at Frontier and by now AWA would be just another losing airline experiment lost to history. US always had more to offer. So don't be so cocky, you kids have a lot to learn about the history of US. There have been All American/allegheny/US planes flying in the sky daily since 1937. So America West had/has nothing by way of history or assets to offer. Just my 2 cents to the uninformed youngsters on the playground monkey bars.

Think back about the time frame.

NWA and DAL were both in bankruptcy, AA was doing all they could to avoid it. No airline was hired and most had furloughs. Where were you going to get a job?

With US Airways going out of business how much capacity would have been pulled down?3% 5%-10% of the market? No one had any money to pick up the shoot out airplanes you guys were flying.

 

[A320 Driver]

Ciabottoni gets some of the credit but don't forget that DiOrio is in PHL too. The oreo I would say gets as much or more credit/blame for the PHL vote and all of the no voters.

Ciabottoni lead the charge in the last seniority integration as the PHL F/O rep that threatened the Merger Committee and forced them into the straight DOH or nothing negotiating stance. He is a real peach (not). He gambles everything but enjoys his cult following. You are likely right. With the new makeup of the BPR, cooperation will be the LAST thing on their mind. DiOrio just wants a seat at the table so he can feel like is doing something. After his total failure as Chairman of the NAC, I suppose he still needs to feel important.

 

[cleardirect]

cleardirect,

Not nearly as ignorant as some of the jackass statements you've made! I'm sure there are many former AWA pilots that have just as many, if not more hours and experience.

But At US there are pilots with tons more seniority than those at sand flea airlines in general. So, take the statement for what it is, the US folks in general are far more experienced and have known what it was like to work for the best at one time. Was AWA ever the best at anything, ever? Just askin

Just shows your lack of understanding what is meant by seniority. If Us airways had liquidated and you all were looking for a job. You can take all that experience and flight hours and start over a that flea bag outfit. Any idea how much seniority you would have on day one at the flea bag outfit where you just started over?

US airways was never the best at anything except maybe self destruction and in fighting.

What was AWA ever the best at? Oh I don't know a little detail like not crashing airplanes and killing PAX. How much experience does that take?

 

[767one]

Might be a "hoot" to you Bob, but not for us. No matter what 25% of us think about what was supposedly left on the table, the other 75% realized (and my favorite quote from An Officer and a Gentleman) "we got no place else to go!"

If the transaction does not occur, we have at least laid some small foundation for negotiations with the company going forward. But that will drag out for years.

I hope you keep posting here, always appreciate your outlook on things. Hope you enjoy your extended vacation!

Greeter

Greeter,

If the merger happens I wish for the best for USAirways employees but I'm sure there will be enough pain to spread around. Maybe there will not be much if any pilot job losses but the two airlines are not going to go together without finding a fair amount of "redundant" positions.
If the merger does not happen I think that the foundation for further negotiations will crumble and it will be business as usual at the airline. The only reason the company was talking to the pilots was to grease the merger along.

I hope that there are no hidden traps in the MOU due to company interpretation of the language or for that matter union interpretation or misinterpretation of the language or even misrepresentation of the language. None of the aforementioned items are out of the realm of possibility given our history.

All the best,

Bob

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Yep the west pilots are unified. Will be until the Nicolau is in place. Something we could bring to the table if we were not under attack from the start. we can be unified against usapa, against the company against the APA if we have to. Right now usapa is the clear and present danger.


I agree with you about the new make up of the board, no playing nice with the APA full on arbitration and the full 24 months. The key will be the run off. Will that guy be the swing vote or will Mckee get his 6-5 cabal?

Ciabottoni gets some of the credit but don't forget that DiOrio is in PHL too. The oreo I would say gets as much or more credit/blame for the PHL vote and all of the no voters.

I hold out zero chance DuBarry can win, and he is a good, reasonable man. But just looking at the votes that went for "Paul squared" I assume most of those votes will go the "other" guy, who I do not even know.

I understand your position on the NIC, just will never agree. Good luck on your upcoming grievance. Monday?

Greeter

 

[cleardirect]

I hold out zero chance DuBarry can win, and he is a good, reasonable man. But just looking at the votes that went for "Paul squared" I assume most of those votes will go the "other" guy, who I do not even know.

I understand your position on the NIC, just will never agree. Good luck on your upcoming grievance. Monday?

Greeter

Grievance Monday? A little cryptic for me? Is there a grievance hearing on Monday?

 

[dca319]

Ciabottoni lead the charge in the last seniority integration as the PHL F/O rep that threatened the Merger Committee and forced them into the straight DOH or nothing negotiating stance. He is a real peach (not). He gambles everything but enjoys his cult following. You are likely right. With the new makeup of the BPR, cooperation will be the LAST thing on their mind. DiOrio just wants a seat at the table so he can feel like is doing something. After his total failure as Chairman of the NAC, I suppose he still needs to feel important.

The only thing DiOrio and the rest will accomplish is have the APA put on property even sooner rather than later.

 

[dca319]

They're not going to recall Hummel. I hope they're smart enough to know they are wasting their time and union resources to even try. Recalls are an uphill battle even when everybody is pissed off. If they have a recall on their minds, they should take a VERY close look at today's results and then fuggedaboudit.

Smart has nothing to do with anything. They're out for blood and McKee wants to be president very badly. They've been empowered by this recall result and they'll use it, along with PHL to go after Hummel.

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Smart has nothing to do with anything. They're out for blood and McKee wants to be president very badly. They've been empowered by this recall result and they'll use it, along with PHL to go after Hummel.

Recall will happen, but only after the new reps take their seats in 1.5 months or so. Looking at the preponderance of evidence against the CLT reps, and the absolute total failure of that recall, there is slim to no chance a recall of any Officer or Rep will succeed going forward. The APA will just love this turn of events.

Greeter

 

[3dtv]

I hold out zero chance DuBarry can win, and he is a good, reasonable man. But just looking at the votes that went for "Paul squared" I assume most of those votes will go the "other" guy, who I do not even know.

I understand your position on the NIC, just will never agree. Good luck on your upcoming grievance. Monday?

Greeter

The "other guy" is a blind follower of CLT. Better hope Duberry can get support.

 

[nevergiveup]

Just shows your lack of understanding what is meant by seniority. If Us airways had liquidated and you all were looking for a job. You can take all that experience and flight hours and start over a that flea bag outfit. Any idea how much seniority you would have on day one at the flea bag outfit where you just started over?

US airways was never the best at anything except maybe self destruction and in fighting.

What was AWA ever the best at? Oh I don't know a little detail like not crashing airplanes and killing PAX. How much experience does that take?

Your comments show your true lack of experience as well as intellect!

 

[A320 Driver]

Just shows your lack of understanding what is meant by seniority. If Us airways had liquidated and you all were looking for a job. You can take all that experience and flight hours and start over a that flea bag outfit. Any idea how much seniority you would have on day one at the flea bag outfit where you just started over?

US airways was never the best at anything except maybe self destruction and in fighting.

What was AWA ever the best at? Oh I don't know a little detail like not crashing airplanes and killing PAX. How much experience does that take?

You truly have NO class whatsoever. You and whoever high fived your post.

 

[usa1]

Just shows your lack of understanding what is meant by seniority. If Us airways had liquidated and you all were looking for a job. You can take all that experience and flight hours and start over a that flea bag outfit. Any idea how much seniority you would have on day one at the flea bag outfit where you just started over?

US airways was never the best at anything except maybe self destruction and in fighting.

What was AWA ever the best at? Oh I don't know a little detail like not crashing airplanes and killing PAX. How much experience does that take?

You are an idiot?