Dec 2012 / Jan 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Claxon]

Okay,,,,you are an azzhole and an idiot!

Mom? Get to bed. I will bring over the cigarettes and brandy later, I was busy.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

The only fault you all have is that you never learned the distinction of a "valid argument" and a "true argument", so you are left with finding wickedness in anyone with whom you disagree. Being ignorant (perhaps willfully) of the distinction you have no means to ascribe good moral intent to your fellow man that exercises means lawfully available to him, if it results in an outcome that you oppose.

"Fair and equitable" was part of the terms that Nicolau had to abide by, and ALPA, right or wrong, provided a means for both sides to be the judge of "fair and equitable" by providing veto authority via a simple majority on either side--even on the smaller side. The result was that, fewer than 25% could reject the ALPA directed outcome. There is nothing morally special about either side. If the shoes where switched the reactions and efforts would have been exactly the same.

I apologize for interrupting your single issue rant. Please carry on.

You live in a fog of Cognitive Dissonance. Be a man, live up to your promises...especially the ones you legally entered into. All these years of ducking and hiding from your ultimate responsibility, what has it got you? Jack Squat.

Honorable people honor their agreements, you wouldn't expect anything else from others, you don't get a pass.

 

[Claxon]

You live in a fog of Cognitive Dissonance. Be a man, live up to your promises...especially the ones you legally entered into. All these years of ducking and hiding from your ultimate responsibility, what has it got you? Jack Squat.

Honorable people honor their agreements, you wouldn't expect anything else from others, you don't get a pass.

It is sort of like travel, scuba diving, astronomy. You never know what you are going to get.

 

[Claxon]

The east pilots have to be tankful for the support the west employees have shown since the beginning. They did not mention saving US Airways in the following web site.

There are three pages of group members, please do not forget to click and explore all three pages.

http://profileengine...crew-you-us-air

 

[high*flyer]

There is your problem. usapa is bound to DOH. M/B arbitration, the company and APA are not. The company is bound by a contract so is usapa. Being bound by DOH is why usapa will not be able to negotiate a list and why it will go to arbitration. Arbitration is not DOH.

Little sayings do not answer my question. I asked for details. How does usapa and the east pilots avoid the Nicolau?


Honestly... If it were me, I would avoid it by embracing it... Use the merger to tack on a 5 year fence between the 3 "separate" pilot groups. Westies have their lollipop back, AAA protected reguardless of an arbitrated MB, and east has what they have wanted all along.... But that's just me... Now back to reality... No way the BPR votes 11-0 for a MOU that includes the NIC...AAA vote was 11-5 without a five year dispute... Just saying.

 

[cleardirect]

Well I am sure the East pilots appreciate a furloughed west pilot like you being able to save them.

As far as your "It was not ALPA national or the AA pilots that got us a DC plan, we already had that." Please proved a quote from your contract, regarding your assertion.

Do your own research. You are just wrong. I am tired of educating the unteachable.

 

[Claxon]

Do your own research. You are just wrong. I am tired of educating the unteachable.

It is difficult to research your "facts", because there is nothing to back it up.

 

[cleardirect]

Is this what you need Claxon:



[color=rgb(13.699000%, 12.199000%, 12.500000%)]SECTION 28 RETIREMENT [/color]

• 
  The Company shall sponsor a 401(k) Plan. This 401(k) Plan shall contain, at a minimum, the plan design features set forth in Appendix D unless the Associa­ tion agrees otherwise. All other features of the 401(k) Plan are subject to Company discretion.

Woop there it is.

Let's review the timeline.

West contract signed Dec 13, 2003
DC starts 01/01/05

Merger announced May 2005. Transition agree signed many months after that.

The AWA ALPA had negotiated a DC plan long before the east pilots jobs were saved. But thanks for the profit sharing. What did the east pilots get in exchange? Must have gotten something or were they just used to giving away things?

Would you care to admit you were wrong and correct your statement Claxon?

 

[cleardirect]

401k is not a DC plan. A 401k match is not a DC plan. I admire you for sticking up for clear, it needs the help.

Have someone read App D to you. Heading "Company non-elective discretionary contributions"

 

[Claxon]

Woop there it is.

Let's review the timeline.

West contract signed Dec 13, 2003
DC starts 01/01/05

Merger announced May 2005. Transition agree signed many months after that.

The AWA ALPA had negotiated a DC plan long before the east pilots jobs were saved. But thanks for the profit sharing. What did the east pilots get in exchange? Must have gotten something or were they just used to giving away things?

Would you care to admit you were wrong and correct your statement Claxon?

Every one has a 401k plan, you had no DC plan. You are denying you are furloughed from america west, correct? Yes or no.

 

[Claxon]

Have someone read App D to you. Heading "Company non-elective discretionary contributions"

Yes, and where is app d sir? If you app n d have if, let me know.

 

[cleardirect]

There is your problem. usapa is bound to DOH. M/B arbitration, the company and APA are not. The company is bound by a contract so is usapa. Being bound by DOH is why usapa will not be able to negotiate a list and why it will go to arbitration. Arbitration is not DOH.

Little sayings do not answer my question. I asked for details. How does usapa and the east pilots avoid the Nicolau?


Honestly... If it were me, I would avoid it by embracing it... Use the merger to tack on a 5 year fence between the 3 "separate" pilot groups. Westies have their lollipop back, AAA protected reguardless of an arbitrated MB, and east has what they have wanted all along.... But that's just me... Now back to reality... No way the BPR votes 11-0 for a MOU that includes the NIC...AAA vote was 11-5 without a five year dispute... Just saying.

You are entitled to your opinion.

Why did it take 3 days to vote the MOU out of the BPR?

Do you honestly think that Parker is going to continue to run 3 separate airline for another 5 years? Think again.

But if you think you are going to get DOH and avoid the Nicolau please explain how you get there?

 

[cleardirect]

It is difficult to research your "facts", because there is nothing to back it up.

You were the one alleging facts. I just told you you were wrong.

The facts are very easy to research, read the contract. But I know how difficult it is for some of you to understand contract language.

 

[Phoenix]

You live in a fog of Cognitive Dissonance. Be a man, live up to your promises...especially the ones you legally entered into. All these years of ducking and hiding from your ultimate responsibility, what has it got you? Jack Squat.

Honorable people honor their agreements, you wouldn't expect anything else from others, you don't get a pass.

Nic4Us must be your grandkid, and Clear your kid. I think I'm on to something.

 

[dca319]

Yes, and where is app d sir? If you app n d have if, let me know.

Don't you have access to wings?


Eligibility Salary Deferral
— Eligible 1st of month following 90 days of Active Service.
— Defer 1% to 50% of eligible compensation on a pre-tax payroll deduction basis (federal and state income tax deferred)
— Subject to annual IRS deferral maximum limitations
— Subject to non-discrimination limitations on Highly Compensated participants (as defined by IRS code).
Catch-up Contributions
— Defer 1% to 50% of eligible compensation on a pre-tax basis, subject to annual IRS limits for catch-up contributions
— Must be at least age 50 during a Plan year in which catch-up contribution is made and must be making regular salary deferrals that year at the maximum amount allowed under the Plan or IRS limits
After-Tax Employee Contributions Company Matching Contributions
— Contribute 1% to 50% of eligible compensation on an after tax basis (subject to annual IRS limits on total annual additions to the Plan)
— Discretionary matching contribution that is 50% of employee contributions (salary deferrals) up to 6% of eligible compensation
— Eligible for matching contributions on applicable salary deferrals the first of the month following 1 year of Active Service
Company Non-elective Discretionary Contributions Vesting Schedule
— Beginning 1/1/05, 7% of eligible compensation (subject to annual IRS limits on total annual additions to the Plan)
— Salary deferrals, catch-up contributions, after-tax contributions, qualified rollovers into the Plan – 100% vested immediately