Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[cleardirect]

I don't think the APA is dumb at all. I think they are infinitely smarter than Marty and his "knights." DOH with restrictions and fences. They are smart enough to know that, properly done, they have no worries from the east. And the west threat of DFR is irrelevant since unions are given wide latitude and DOH is historically within that scope.

Lawsuit, shmawsuit. No one cares about you "dire wolves" or your incompetent lawyer anymore.

Don't you GET IT YET?

Properly done. Sure and in your mind a fence that no one can cross for 5-7-10 years is proper?

Do you seriously think that the APA is going to lock themselves out of 4 bases and cut themselves out of opportunities that this merger will bring? You guys better think about this. What did Parker do to the west? Drove all of the flying to the cheaper part of the airline, that is also where the country starts the day.

Have you ever heard Parker talk about his dream hubs? That if he had DFW, ORD or ATL he could pay us better. Guess what he now has ORD, DFW. If you believe your own BS that is where the profits will be made. All Parker has to do is shift flying from CLT and PHL to DFW and ORD. You boys have locked yourselves INTO those bases not just everyone else out. Enjoy your stagnation.

Don't think it can happen. Think again. Hope you like those 190's. East coast shuttle shuffle for all you east coast bases.

After the MOU expires and you got base fences instead of equipment fences. Parker takes the WB and moves them to the profitable hubs leaving you on the other side of the fence you wanted.

No thinks I would rather be part of the largest airline in the world with all of the opportunites and benefits instead of thinking small and protecting a tiny portion left over from a BK airline.

 

[Beancounter]

Properly done. Sure and in your mind a fence that no one can cross for 5-7-10 years is proper?

Do you seriously think that the APA is going to lock themselves out of 4 bases and cut themselves out of opportunities that this merger will bring? You guys better think about this. What did Parker do to the west? Drove all of the flying to the cheaper part of the airline, that is also where the country starts the day.

Have you ever heard Parker talk about his dream hubs? That if he had DFW, ORD or ATL he could pay us better. Guess what he now has ORD, DFW. If you believe your own BS that is where the profits will be made. All Parker has to do is shift flying from CLT and PHL to DFW and ORD. You boys have locked yourselves INTO those bases not just everyone else out. Enjoy your stagnation.

Don't think it can happen. Think again. Hope you like those 190's. East coast shuttle shuffle for all you east coast bases.

After the MOU expires and you got base fences instead of equipment fences. Parker takes the WB and moves them to the profitable hubs leaving you on the other side of the fence you wanted.

No thinks I would rather be part of the largest airline in the world with all of the opportunites and benefits instead of thinking small and protecting a tiny portion left over from a BK airline.

C'mon Clear, don't you know how valuable their attrition is? Forget being part of the largest, possibly best airline out there, forget about higher pay (they sat on LOA 93 willingly for how long?), it's the precious attrition. It's like watching Golem in the Lord of the Rings isn't it? "My precious, my precious," attrition. Mine, mine, allllll mine.

Bean

 

[nevergiveup]

It's one airline, not two. The fool that posted we are not merged is just that, a fool.

You know darn well why the west still has furloughed pilots, the east purposely avoided a contract to keep the pilot groups separate. From a scheduling standpoint, it makes sense to have more pilots based out east and they fly for bankruptcy wages to boot.

DOH is a staple, it's in USAPA's constitution, look it up.

Bean

DOH is their first salvo, but one liked by many of the American pilots. Doubt it will happen, but we will see some time after Christmas.

 

[nevergiveup]

Grab a mirror then and tell that to yourself, since DOH is in fact, a staple job. None on the west are young anymore. I WAS one of the youngins and I just turned 40, remember we've been at this for a while.

Bean

40 is quite young! Any under 45 has got it made, even with DOH.

 

[Pi brat]

In order to make your argument work. To keep what we brought. The west would have to get back 250 pilots and 24 aircraft. Upgrade about 80 pilots. In order for the east top keep what you brought you would have to shrink about 250 pilots. Moving all of you backwards. Furlough as bunch. Lose all of the 190 flying and hand over a few 330 and a 757.

Are you going to keep repeating stupid crap or understand what you are really saying?

You do realize that the east is down about 50 A/C since that day in May 2005 and many are low paying 190's don't you?

 

[Beancounter]

40 is quite young! Any under 45 has got it made, even with DOH.

NIC or DOH, I'll be towards the bottom of the list. Hopefully one day, like you said, I'll have it made. I'm strongly against DOH, because I think it is a windfall for the east furloughed pilots and a total screw job for the west senior pilots.

Bean

 

[mrbreeze]

Grab a mirror then and tell that to yourself, since DOH is in fact, a staple job. None on the west are young anymore. I WAS one of the youngins and I just turned 40, remember we've been at this for a while.

Bean

40? So you have been at it for a max of 17 yrs? Good for you....looks like you guys are gonna be ok. I started flying in 1978....you were about 5 yrs old. I have been at this job for 27 yrs now.

Ah, to be young again.....I got 20 yrs on you.

Just think, in another 4.5 yrs, one of you boys can have my seat and live under the new AA contract for the next 20 yrs.....enjoy!

I am thrilled to at least get 4.5 yrs to pay down the bills before retirement. 🙂

breeze

 

[Pi brat]

I'm strongly against DOH, because I think it is a windfall for the east furloughed pilots and a total screw job for the west senior pilots.

Bean

I can see how you would see it that way. So surely you can see what a screw job the Nic is for the senior west pilots and most of the east. How about neither and a 3 way process? Does that seem more fair from your POV?

 

[cleardirect]

You do realize that the east is down about 50 A/C since that day in May 2005 and many are low paying 190's don't you?

How does that math work? Down 50 A/C but up 300 additional pilots.

The west is down 24 A/C and down 300 from the merger?

Besides I am not the one continually saying I just want what I brought, that would be your boys. Now if that statement were true you guys would be giving back a whole lot of stuff. But that is OK you will soon learn what it is like to be out of favor with flt ops management and being the more expensive and less profitable hubs.

Doug found some new best friends he can make money with. DFW and ORD.

 

[cleardirect]

40? So you have been at it for a max of 17 yrs? Good for you....looks like you guys are gonna be ok. I started flying in 1978....you were about 5 yrs old. I have been at this job for 27 yrs now.

Ah, to be young again.....I got 20 yrs on you.

Just think, in another 4.5 yrs, one of you boys can have my seat and live under the new AA contract for the next 20 yrs.....enjoy!

I am thrilled to at least get 4.5 yrs to pay down the bills before retirement. 🙂

breeze

Imagine what you could have paid off if you have not thought like an east pilots (emotional) and accepted what you are gong to get with the Nicolau 5 years ago.

 

[Beancounter]

I can see how you would see it that way. So surely you can see what a screw job the Nic is for the senior west pilots and most of the east. How about neither and a 3 way process? Does that seem more fair from your POV?

Thanks for asking, but what I think is fair won't make the Nic go away. The Nic is the only existing list. It may not have been implemented yet, but it's still there. Can USAPA come up with something else? According to the ninth they can, but whatever it is will be held up against the Nic. I don't know how you would get a three way unless that is what an arbitrator decided. There in no one left to negotiate for the west. USAPA can't represent the west and east in a three way fairly. The APA is in the drivers seat and the majority of American pilots I've talked to favor arbitration.

Bean

 

[mrbreeze]

Imagine what you could have paid off if you have not thought like an east pilots (emotional) and accepted what you are gong to get with the Nicolau 5 years ago.

Well Clear,

I'm not going to get tangled up in another night of your daily insanity.

Ya know, you remind me of Sheldon on Big Bang Theory. You are just full of all these theories and what if's, and actually sound fairly intelligent on occasion......but son, you ain't got a lick of sense. 😉
breeze

 

[mrbreeze]

According to the ninth they can, but whatever it is will be held up against the Nic.

Sorry Bean,

But that is just an opinion that the west has conjured up.

Good luck to ya.
breeze

 

[Pi brat]

How does that math work? Down 50 A/C but up 300 additional pilots.

The west is down 24 A/C and down 300 from the merger?

Besides I am not the one continually saying I just want what I brought, that would be your boys. Now if that statement were true you guys would be giving back a whole lot of stuff. But that is OK you will soon learn what it is like to be out of favor with flt ops management and being the more expensive and less profitable hubs.

Doug found some new best friends he can make money with. DFW and ORD.

The east was massively understaffed on May 19, 2005. Then the other other staffing issues we've talked about like replacingy 737s with 330s on min fleet. Don't trust me, it's all in the Nicolau opinion and award. I dare you to prove me wrong or admit youre wrong.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Sorry Bean,

But that is just an opinion that the west has conjured up.

Good luck to ya.
breeze

Lol. That's the beauty of what the 9th wrote, plenty for both sides to conjure up. Gotta love it.

The only thing worse than brother pilot against brother pilot is our hacked up legal system.

Actually it's not funny, but rather sad.