Flight Attendant Schedulers

[operaations]

which Schedulers need help and any suggerstions on how to help them help you. No need for any names just a bas designation will do. I am just curious on how we can better our relationship.

I know NHBB and other people not associated with flight attendants and their schedules will try to start trouble please refrain. I am not trying to start any flames just an honest attempt to better ourselves

 

[silverbirdFLL]

HUM,very pointed question Ops. As a f/a for 15yrs I can say this,I have seen where you work and that was on a GOOD day-🙂 I think there needs to be an understanding of just how the SYSTEM works on both ends of the telephone.
I'll give my example of my "maddest" exp.w/crew sked. Picture it ORD in the winter and I am Purser on the A300 comming in for what is supposed to be a nice short (12hrs back then) l/o then one leg home (MIA). I give the thumbs up and the 1L door opens & I am greeted w/a reasignment. NOW I and I alone l/o in ORD for 24 hrs (still at the a/p hotel) to DHD to DFW w/a 30 min conx to be Purser from DFW-SCL l/o work back to DFW then DHD back to MIA. Reason given-IDF was out od Purser's so they trnfrd the seq. to IOR whoom inturn used a very valuable IMA Purser to cover the trip so IOR skedualing wouldnt have to use one of there Purser's.Yadda yadda yadda later w/o my misspelled details I didnt make the DFW-SCL flight because we were late lvg. ORD however I was told in no uncertan terms was I going back to base. "That trip still doesn't have a qualifyed Purser on it so your l/o in DFW to dhd to SCL the next nite to l/o 12hrs in SCL and WORK back to DFW." Why was I mad? I was not on reserve. I was on a 2 day trip. I packed for such. I might have been at the time Purser & IMA but IMA (at the time) NEVER "spared" a Intl./Purser. IMA has always been tight when it came to Pur.
So,what I am getting at and suggesting is that as a skedulr looks at the screen and see's the seq. that Sabre as built or maybe one that he/she is doing manually take a glance think about the HUMAN BEING that is REALLY that seq. I know when your tight your tight and I can appreciate that but now more thenever those seq./trips are not just letters and numbers on a screen they have to be seen as what they REALLY are-human beings.
Other then that Ops. I think you all do what I expect you to do. Your job and proper phone etiquite(sp) would really go along way,both sides of the phone I am sure.
Peace
SB
MIA

 

[flydcoop]

I made it to STL with a 1hr callout thanks to Mark. I would do anything for him.

However, on "tracking" I had to deal with Angie or Tracie, not sure I will "kill myself" again.

We left STL knowing our return flight was cancelled. 2 of us had a seven day legality (that you moved our moveable days for).

Originally, we were to layover in DFW on our 7th day and DHD back. I was told, by scheduling, that this was legal on RSV. You know, get me back by noon the next day, blah, blah, blah.

I've read the contract, it states that Article 7.I applies regarding RSV, same as a line holder, same as AVBL. :angry:

If I am wrong, please state the Article.

Coop

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

"Hey Coop, Whats Happenin', good to see you" !!!!!!!

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Operations;
I won't start any trouble.

But one answer to your valid question is,
UNDERSTAND that this work group(F/A's) are Unionized, and protected by an agreement, that bears 2 signatures.
1. APFA
and
2. "THE COMPANY"

which means that when you become frustrated on a "bad hair day", take your frustrations out on the COMPANY, not a F/A, who's "working to rule"
(for you non union folks, that means "working by the book")

Sick calls, come to mind.

NH/BB's

 

[chisprings]

How about this?

There was a scheduler named Treasure. The first time I ever talked to her - I asked if was Treasure as in Treasure Chest. She was not amused. Well I did quite a few favors for Treasure including taking a trip off of standby after my 6 hours were over one night at 11:30PM in ORD to prevent a flight canceling with minimum crew - no other avail f/a was at the airport. Well the very next week I needed a favor from Treasure who was anything but helpful. I vowed that day never ever never ever ever to help scheduling again. I have met quite a few f/a's who have experienced the same thing. I am always polite when I have to call in - but I am done with scheduling. I think that each workgroup has a problem because they don't understand what each other does. Schedulers don't always seem to understand how much impact they have on our life - and they get nasty with us and treat us like we're numbers. On the other hand, I know quite a few f/a's that are just as nasty in return.

This is the way it has been and will be - not just at AA - every large carrier experiences this. All f/a's share their loathing of schedulers when we chat with each other on hotel vans - including B6, WN, UA, CO, DL......etc..

Thank the Lord for unions and work rules!!!!!!!

 

[operaations]

How about this?

There was a scheduler named Treasure. The first time I ever talked to her - I asked if was Treasure as in Treasure Chest. She was not amused. Well I did quite a few favors for Treasure including taking a trip off of standby after my 6 hours were over one night at 11:30PM in ORD to prevent a flight canceling with minimum crew - no other avail f/a was at the airport. Well the very next week I needed a favor from Treasure who was anything but helpful. I vowed that day never ever never ever ever to help scheduling again. I have met quite a few f/a's who have experienced the same thing. I am always polite when I have to call in - but I am done with scheduling. I think that each workgroup has a problem because they don't understand what each other does. Schedulers don't always seem to understand how much impact they have on our life - and they get nasty with us and treat us like we're numbers. On the other hand, I know quite a few f/a's that are just as nasty in return.

This is the way it has been and will be - not just at AA - every large carrier experiences this. All f/a's share their loathing of schedulers when we chat with each other on hotel vans - including B6, WN, UA, CO, DL......etc..

Thank the Lord for unions and work rules!!!!!!!

That is the main reason I do not do any favors. Because they will always turn around and bite you in the a$$. If I was in that situation I would not have asked you to stay later than your scheduled sby time. If i could not have found a legal re assignment than that plane would just have to wait.

I do not ask a flight attendant for any favors. All i expect from them is the job hired to do. There are work rules and contract rules for a reason. If i am fair across the board than there is no reason to dislike me. I understand if we are a little more understanding on the phone it would help. But pass along there is only so much we can do. We are not allowed to let our personal feeling get in the way. That is why alot of us do not want to hear it. The day we let personal feeling get in the way of our job is the day some other flight attendant turns me in for favoritism.

It is a lose lose situation.

thanks for the input

 

[LiveInAHotel]

Well the very next week I needed a favor from Treasure who was anything but helpful. I vowed that day never ever never ever ever to help scheduling again.

Thank the Lord for unions and work rules!!!!!!!

chrisprings,

Have you ever heard the term "backstabbing?" Screw Schedulers are known for this type of behavior. They will never do us a favor. If they don't get that trip covered it's their a$$, not ours. You screwed yourself by taking a trip that signed in after your 6 hours on stand-by. Follow your contract, carry your contract and challenge anyone who thinks they can make you do something and legally you can't! My advice to you, READ YOUR CONTRACT, UNTIL YOU KNOW IT LIKE THE BACK OF YOUR HAND!

If you look up the word backstabbing in the dictionary, the first definition you will see is American Airlines Crew Schedulers!


Regarding your last quote...LIVE BY IT!

 

[operaations]

Well the very next week I needed a favor from Treasure who was anything but helpful. I vowed that day never ever never ever ever to help scheduling again.

Thank the Lord for unions and work rules!!!!!!!

chrisprings,

Have you ever heard the term "backstabbing?" Screw Schedulers are known for this type of behavior. They will never do us a favor. If they don't get that trip covered it's their a$$, not ours. You screwed yourself by taking a trip that signed in after your 6 hours on stand-by. Follow your contract, carry your contract and challenge anyone who thinks they can make you do something and legally you can't! My advice to you, READ YOUR CONTRACT, UNTIL YOU KNOW IT LIKE THE BACK OF YOUR HAND!

If you look up the word backstabbing in the dictionary, the first definition you will see is American Airlines Crew Schedulers!


Regarding your last quote...LIVE BY IT!

Isnt it just like Liveinhotel to start name calling. I did not start this thread to start calling eachother names. I do agree carry your contract know your contract and by all means do not let anyone tell you to do something that is not legal or contractual. Crew schedule should not do any favors and you should not expect them.

 

[jimntx]

If nothing changes, nothing changes. I would like to believe that operaations was trying to start an honest dialogue about ways that the relationship between schedulers and flight attendants could be improved. Nothing will ever be changed if we always start from a rehash of the sins of a particular scheduler committed against a particular flight attendant on a particular day at a particular time in a particular base, and vice versa.

Let's try to begin again with the following parameters.
1. Rather than relate at length the problem you had, specify briefly the solution you think would work. I.e, no attempted contact of standby flight attendants after expiration of the duty period. If the other "side" needs specifics to take to management/the union/whoever, he/she can email you on the side or ask you to post the details in order for all to discuss.
2. No name calling. Yes, I mean you, too (whoever you are and no matter how justified you think you are).
3. If your solution would require contractual changes, try to find the particular part of the contract that applies/needs to change/etc.
4. Accept the fact that neither all schedulers nor all flight attendants are at fault/evil to the core/deserving of the death sentence.
5. We all work for the same company. We all have the same vested interest in the long-term survival of the company. We are all trying to do the best job we can do as a contribution to said long-term survival.
6. There is a solution. If we honestly try, it is possible to change the existing relationship and reduce or even eliminate the animosity between the two work groups.

 

[jimntx]

My first suggestions.

For Schedulers:
1. No calls between the hours of 2300 and 0600 for any reason if the sign-in for the trip is after 1200.
2. No assigning a flight attendant to a sequence until the sequence has been tested against the computer for legality. I.E., no waiting until after take-off to enter the sequence.
3. No letting a sequence with an early sign-in sit in open time for hours for all to see and then waiting until the middle of the night to assign it.
4. Treat the flight attendant as you would like to be treated. What your Mother told you when you were three still applies--Please and Thank You are powerful words.

For Flight Attendants:
1. Quit acting like the scheduler has no purpose in life other than to ruin your life. Reserve is part of the job. Grow up!
2. No claiming a contract violation based upon what someone said in the galley about what they think is legal. As Liveinahotel said, it is YOUR responsibility to know your contract. Besides, you will get found out. The schedulers have a copy of the contract also.
3. Don't lie to Scheduling on your own behalf or anyone else's. The scheduler is just trying to do a job.
4. Treat the Scheduler as you would like to be treated. What your Mother told you when you were three still applies--Please and Thank you are powerful words.

 

[chisprings]

I understand what operaations is trying to do. I applaud his/her effort. I still believe that the relationship between crew members and schedulers will never change - esp in an airline as large as AA. It would be nice - but it won't happen.

Yes I know I shouldn't have taken the trip off of my standby - but I do feel some loyalty to AA and its success. I saved a trip from getting canceled. I do not regret it.

The favor I asked for the next week was simple:

I received an option II trip from Miss Treasure..she thanked me for my help the week before. I really wans't doing her a favor that night it was AA I did a favor fon. ..she asked me if i wanted position 3 or 5....I figured it was a 757 so I said 5. Well I checked Sabre when I got off the phone and realized I just signed up to be the F/C galley on a widebody that I was qualified for - but never worked on in 8 years. I called her back and asked if I could have position 3 and she told me she gave it to a reserve....and it was still 3:30 - before any reserve called in. I knew I could have pursued it - but I just wasn't in the mood to deal with Greg Fritz who was the senior on duty.

The previous month Greg Fritz personally reassigned me all around the west coast on reserve when I realized that scheduling had flown me over my legalities on reserve. He got into an argument with me when I called him from t/a in a base city that had standbys. When he realized I was right - he told me to go to the hotel and enjoy my lavover. DHD home to ORD next morning - yeah right...I was reassigned for 2 more days to fly all around the west coast. It took the intervention of my base manager and APFA to get me home on the 6th day. Every single f/a has horror stories like this. Yes we may be difficult to deal with - but the decisions schedulers make - and behaviors such as this - have maor effects on our life. Yes on your computer screen I am SEQ12312 FA02 that can fly 14hours days with 8 hour rest for as many days as I am legal - but we are human. I can't tell you how many f/a's have been burned by waving there options or 7/30 just to help out.

I know repeating stories doesn't offer a solution - but the sad part is - there is no solution. As much as our contract protects us - schedulers and AA use the work rules to fly us as much as possible like we are machines. I have spent time in SOC when I worked EPT's. I appreciate the hard work everyone does there - but other than just being polite to each other and resepecting each other's job - nothing will change.

 

[operaations]

I for one think things can change. When the flight attendant knows his or her contract and obides byt it things are so much easier. There are plenty of schedulers that make mistakes. Big ones for that matter. But nobody will fault you if you are told to do something and you think it is not legal then by all means walk off the plane and leave. But when a scheduler points out the page, the paragraph, and the line number it is on and some people still think we are lying it is hard. I have been proven wrong more than I care to admit. And I freely accept it. I am not ashamed to admit wrogdoing. But I will only do it once. I will not break the contract for the Company or Management. It is there for a reason.

I hate saying this but most of us are not there to make friend we are there to do a job. There are plenty of flight attendants who do the same thing. We all need to walk a mile in eachothers shoes to fully understand what we all go through. I think I know what yall go through and I would not want that job. It is too stressfull to tiring and too much drama.

But i will repeat what i said earlier. We can make things better

 

[AAviator]

Doesn't the computer recognize when someone is legal or illegal ?

I've got no complaints from pilot crew skeds. I say that only because my exposure is limited due to being a line holder. My experience has been good.

 

[chisprings]

operaations,

I applaud you. I try all the time to be part of the solution. I am informed and try to make sure my flying partners are too. Our job, by its nature, has a lot of people who are not interested. It is so easy to come to the airport 4 times a month, walk to the gate, sign in, and get on the plane and push a cart around and go home. Most f/a's are disconnected from the company. We have not seen our supervisor in years, we don't read company mail, we don't read union mail. It is because it is so easy to just come in and go home unnoticed. You don't know your flying partners, you don't know the cockpit, you don't know the agents, you do your service, chat with a few passengers, catch some sleep in the hotel and go home. On most layovers the crew all go their separate ways. F/A's are so disconnected. I have blamed management all these years for not figuring out an acceptable way to make the F/A's feel connected to the company. The company most F/A's work for - is a whole different one than the agents/HDQ work for. Working with schedulers has an important role in our lives at times, but most f/a's dont think about it 99.9% of the time. Since it is your job (I assume) you feel a lot of interest in making things right. The problem is - only 1% of f/a's want to make it right because it is not an issue to the other 99%. Those that have an interest are probably not f/a's you have a problem with in the first place.

I would love for things to improve. The 1st step is for AA in some way, to make F/A's feel connected. I personally think Laurie Curtis will be good for us. Jane Allen turned people off for many years. She is now wreaking her havoc on the poor F/A's at UAL as if they have not been through enough already.

In the current climate, post-RA - APFA divided - The TWA'ers staple job - it will be hard to think of a way to make f/a's care. When the majority are so tired on the airplanes and so disenchanted - there is a lot of work ahead for everyone. Sometimes I wish I would just wake up and it was all a dream.

 

[chisprings]

Doesn't the computer recognize when someone is legal or illegal ?

I've got no complaints from pilot crew skeds. I say that only because my exposure is limited due to being a line holder. My experience has been good.

Yes the computer does if you are flying sequence to sequence. But there are paper legalities that exist if you are coming off of training or SA. In this case, the f/a needs to inform scheduling of any conflicts. You just hope the senior doesn't reassign you as* all around the country or the carribbean to be vindictive. Although I am sure that is a rare occurence.

When I was fortunate enough to be off of reserve for long stretches, I may have gone years w/out talking to a scheduler. I usually HISND them - it is easy that way.