Health Care Passes House

[delldude]

I think the damage done by Reagan was more long term such as getting much closer to the religious right and the deficit he started to run up.

Bush Jr did exactly what he was accused of doing. He willfully lied to get us into a war with Iraq with no forethought as to how it would end. He neglected Afghanistan to the point where it will take us much longer to get that mess settled and he ran up the deficit over 4$4 trillion dollars. Were it not for him, Obama would probably not be in office.

How's that working out BTW?

 

[SparrowHawk]

I think the damage done by Reagan was more long term such as getting much closer to the religious right and the deficit he started to run up.

Bush Jr did exactly what he was accused of doing. He willfully lied to get us into a war with Iraq with no forethought as to how it would end. He neglected Afghanistan to the point where it will take us much longer to get that mess settled and he ran up the deficit over 4$4 trillion dollars. Were it not for him, Obama would probably not be in office.

I'm growing tired of this "Bush ran up the debt" as in some ways it's patently false if you look at the debt as a percentage Gross Domestic Product what you'll see is a very different picture.

Year GDP-US Gross Public Debt-fed
1918 75.8 19.25
1919 78.3 34.98
1920 88.4 29.36
1921 73.6 32.58
1922 73.4 31.29
1923 85.4 26.17
1924 86.9 24.45
1925 90.6 22.64
1926 96.9 20.27
1927 95.5 19.38
1928 97.4 18.07
1929 103.6 16.34
1930 91.2 17.75
1931 76.5 21.96
1932 58.7 33.20
1933 56.4 39.96
1934 66 40.99
1935 73.3 39.16
1936 83.8 40.31
1937 91.9 39.64
1938 86.1 43.16
1939 92.2 43.86
1940 101.4 42.37
1941 126.7 38.64
1942 161.9 44.73
1943 198.6 68.83
1944 219.8 91.45
1945 223 116.00
1946 222.2 121.25
1947 244.1 105.81
1948 269.1 93.75
1949 267.2 94.60
1950 293.7 87.63
1951 339.3 75.22
1952 358.3 72.32
1953 379.3 70.15
1954 380.4 71.31
1955 414.7 66.16
1956 437.4 62.36
1957 461.1 58.67
1958 467.2 59.15
1959 506.6 56.20
1960 526.4 54.39
1961 544.8 53.04
1962 585.7 50.91
1963 617.8 49.51
1964 663.6 46.97
1965 719.1 44.12
1966 787.7 40.61
1967 832.4 39.19
1968 909.8 38.20
1969 984.4 35.93
1970 1038.3 35.72
1971 1126.8 35.33
1972 1237.9 34.51
1973 1382.3 33.14
1974 1499.5 31.68
1975 1637.7 32.56
1976 1824.6 34.00
1977 2030.1 34.42
1978 2293.8 33.64
1979 2562.2 32.26
1980 2788.1 32.56
1981 3126.8 31.91
1982 3253.2 35.10
1983 3534.6 38.96
1984 3930.9 40.00
1985 4217.5 43.23
1986 4460.1 47.65
1987 4736.4 49.62
1988 5100.4 51.02
1989 5482.1 52.12
1990 5800.5 55.74
1991 5992.1 61.17
1992 6342.3 64.09
1993 6667.4 66.17
1994 7085.2 66.23
1995 7414.7 67.08
1996 7838.5 66.66
1997 8332.4 64.97
1998 8793.5 62.84
1999 9353.5 60.47
2000 9951.5 57.02
2001 10286.2 56.46
2002 10642.3 58.52
2003 11142.1 60.88
2004 11867.8 62.18
2005 12638.4 62.77
2006 13398.9 63.49
2007 14077.6 63.99
2008 14441.4 69.15
2009 14258.2 83.29
2010 14623.9 94.27

From the beginning of the Clinto Era until this very day we have seen the debt grow to a level that will soon be unsustainable regardless of who is in power. For me the danger of Obama Care is if their extremely rosey projections fail to materialize and whatever ends up as the final law can't meet those financial projection, we are in real deep poop in regards to bond ratings, taxation and a host of smaller issues.

Does anyone here realize that just the debt service on the existing debt is roughly 10% of the federal budget? Think about your household and imagine having to pay 10% of your take home on just the interest on your credit cards.

We are at the crossroads, we either step back from the headlong rush to socialism and economic stagnation or we move to join our bloated bureaucratic allies in Europe and wallow in mediocrity.

As the debt increase we are more likely to be Third World Banana Republic then a World Power.

 

[Garfield1966]

I know my math is not the best but in 2001 when Bush Jr took over the ratio was 56%. When he left office in 2009, the percentage was 83%. That is an increase of almost 30% right? The debt was at about $5 trillion and he left with at close to $9 trillion. I am pretty sure 9 is bigger than 5 and 83 is bigger than 56. What part of this shows that Bush did not increase the debt?

Looks like the debt level decreased from 92 to 2000. Just saying.

 

[SparrowHawk]

I know my math is not the best but in 2001 when Bush Jr took over the ratio was 56%. When he left office in 2009, the percentage was 83%. That is an increase of almost 30% right? The debt was at about $5 trillion and he left with at close to $9 trillion. I am pretty sure 9 is bigger than 5 and 83 is bigger than 56. What part of this shows that Bush did not increase the debt?

Looks like the debt level decreased from 92 to 2000. Just saying.

Oh I agree with your observation as far as it goes. HOWEVER when you look at the ratios during the Great Depression, everyone from Eisenhower forward has grossly over spent and raised the debt.

Look at the ratios during the Viet Nam era. UNDER 40% and this includes the new social programs under Johnson/Nixon. It should come as no surprise that those mandates have been responsibe for the massive expansion of government and the exploding debt.

This to me is what makes the Health care bill a clear and present danger to our future standard of living. If the projections are even slightly of, the country is doomed

 

[southwind]

I know my math is not the best but in 2001 when Bush Jr took over the ratio was 56%. When he left office in 2009, the percentage was 83%. That is an increase of almost 30% right? The debt was at about $5 trillion and he left with at close to $9 trillion. I am pretty sure 9 is bigger than 5 and 83 is bigger than 56. What part of this shows that Bush did not increase the debt?

Looks like the debt level decreased from 92 to 2000. Just saying.

So in essence Garf, your saying since Bush ran up the the deficit, it's OK for Nobama and his Posse to quadruple that deficit ?

It's time to stop blaming Bush and look at what the "Annointed One" has in store for us !

 

[SparrowHawk]

So in essence Garf, your saying since Bush ran up the the deficit, it's OK for Nobama and his Posse to quadruple that deficit ?

It's time to stop blaming Bush and look at what the "Annointed One" has in store for us !

If you take your ditto head hat off for just a half second and look at the 92 years of debt to GDP you'll notice that BOTH parties suffer from a lack of fiscal restraint. We don't have the manufacturing base we used to have in the years prior to 1980 to support the debt through rising productivity and steady growth/

In 1984 the debt to GDP rose to 40% never to go below that figure. I picked that year for a reason. IIRC the old Fannie Mae Guidelines for mortgage lending was total debt to income couldn't exceed 40%.

Look what happened in the mortgage market! The old guideline went out the window creating a real estates bubble that has crippled the nation's economy. We now have debt amounting to nearly 100 percent of GDP and that can not be a good thing. In fact the only time is was higher was during WWII and our efforts in Iraq & Afchanistan pale by comparrison as once the debt rose above 40% we're merely rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic

 

[Garfield1966]

So in essence Garf, your saying since Bush ran up the the deficit, it's OK for Nobama and his Posse to quadruple that deficit ?

It's time to stop blaming Bush and look at what the "Annointed One" has in store for us !

Post #46 asked and answered

You really need to work on your short term memory. Republicans were blaming Clinton for 8 years and and some are still blaming Carter for crap. Bush has been gone for all of a year and a few months and your thinking nothing he did has any affect on what's happening mow?

 

[777 fixer]

Did Jr actually do what the left claimed or did America buy into a progressive sales campaign?

The 2006 and 2008 election results show that someone was not happy.

 

[southwind]

Post #46 asked and answered

You really need to work on your short term memory. Republicans were blaming Clinton for 8 years and and some are still blaming Carter for crap. Bush has been gone for all of a year and a few months and your thinking nothing he did has any affect on what's happening mow?

I'm in no way excusing the Republicans for the deficit they've created! They've made their bed and now they're lying in it !
Just getting tired of of 2 main excuses being used for Obama........................Bush and the Race Card ! It's time for him and his posse to take responsibility for their actions, which I'm sure will come this Nov.

Adding entitlement programs, when the country is going broke is not fiscally responsible. If he pressed the economy and job issues in this country half as hard as he did Obama-Care Tm, this country would be in far better shape !

My main concern is what is happening "Now" , not a year and half ago!

 

[Garfield1966]

I'm in no way excusing the Republicans for the deficit they've created! They've made their bed and now they're lying in it !
Just getting tired of of 2 main excuses being used for Obama........................Bush and the Race Card ! It's time for him and his posse to take responsibility for their actions, which I'm sure will come this Nov.

Adding entitlement programs, when the country is going broke is not fiscally responsible. If he pressed the economy and job issues in this country half as hard as he did Obama-Care Tm, this country would be in far better shape !

My main concern is what is happening "Now" , not a year and half ago!

A politician accepting responsibility? You need to go into stand up.

Also, I believe it's laying, not lying. And no I am not picking on your grammar. Just pointing it out as a FYI.

 

[southwind]

A politician accepting responsibility? You need to go into stand up.

Also, I believe it's laying, not lying. And no I am not picking on your grammar. Just pointing it out as a FYI.

However you would like to spell it, I think you get the point .

"Lying" 6.to be placed or situated: land lying along the coast.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lying

 

[Garfield1966]

However you would like to spell it, I think you get the point .

"Lying" 6.to be placed or situated: land lying along the coast.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lying

I always thought grammatically it was laying. Like I said, was not picking on your grammar. Yes I got the point but a politician will always blame someone else. Bush blamed Clinton, Omaba will blame Bush, and who ever follows Obama will blame him. It is not in the genetic nature of a politician to accept blame.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Let me get this straight

we're passing a health care plan written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it,
passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it,
signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes,
all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese,
financed by a country that's broke.


What the hell could possibly go wrong????

 

[nuclearfission]

Let me get this straight

we're passing a health care plan written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it,
passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it,
signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes,
all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese,
financed by a country that's broke.


What the hell could possibly go wrong????

Now I think that post says it all in a nutshell !!

And now that the Marxist Demorat party is losing the information war about the bill, proving they don't have barely a clue of what it was they voted on, They are now turning to a typical left wing tactic........distraction! "Threatening" phone calls(unhappy constituents/citizens fed up??).....posters made of some members with bulls eye rings(your "targeted" in Nov. maybe??).......No, not these left wing groupies. They want this portrayed in the news, to consume the news, as those mean, nasty, anti-govnt right wing fanatics, Tea drinkers and such, as against "the change" YOU voted for. They do this to turn the spotlight away from their inability to effectively govern!

GOOD DAY!!

 

[southwind]

Let me get this straight

we're passing a health care plan written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it,
passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it,
signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes
funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes,
all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese,
financed by a country that's broke.


What the hell could possibly go wrong????

Perfect !