June - US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Claxon]

Any response from Douche2fodnic4?

 

[nic4us]

Kind of like US

good God that was terrible.....

Check out some real music...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94RHdu3CfSw

check out 2:35

 

[mrbreeze]

A follow up about UAL non-revving....

I have not tried this, but it came from a UAL passline agent over the phone....

go to:

www.ifc.id90.com

select USAirways

username is .....usemp
password is....037...(our ticket stock number)

good luck,
breeze

 

[Zone5]

Yeah!!!! no Merger with AMR APA BOARD APPROVES MANAGEMENT’S OFFER: By a vote of nine to seven, the APA Board of Directors decided this afternoon to approve management’s “final offer” as a tentative agreement, which means it will be submitted to the membership for a ratification vote. Details of management’s offer can be found

As much as I would like to agree with you that the "Merger" is not going to happen, stop and think about this event. There has never been an airline bankruptcy, where the pilots did not come to a negotiated agreement prior to exiting bankruptcy, ever.

That being the case, does anybody think that Team Tempe hasn't anticipated the probability that AMR would cut an eleventh hour deal with their pilots? It changes the dynamics of the deal and will no doubt raise the cost, but it doesn't mean it's not still going to happen, unfortunately.


seajay

 

[Beancounter]

As much as I would like to agree with you that the "Merger" is not going to happen, stop and think about this event. There has never been an airline bankruptcy, where the pilots did not come to a negotiated agreement prior to exiting bankruptcy, ever.

That being the case, does anybody think that Team Tempe hasn't anticipated the probability that AMR would cut an eleventh hour deal with their pilots? It changes the dynamics of the deal and will no doubt raise the cost, but it doesn't mean it's not still going to happen, unfortunately.


seajay

Yes, I totally agree. Just got back from a three-day non-aviation related conference, meaning I've tuned out aviation news for three days. This news about the APA reaching an agreement in no way means a merger is not going to happen. I'm not even sure why so many east pilots are anxious to read that into the recent developments. No American merger means LOA 93 for a looooong time. It seems to me, if anything the east will benefit more from a merger than the west. I think in the long run it will benefit us all because it will add stability and I'd sure like the hourly raise, but I don't look forward to the rest of my contract getting gutted.

Bean

 

[mrbreeze]

oops!

well, while I'm here....keep those ADA donations coming folks.....LOL

 

[nic4us]

Oh Luv9 and MM are all giddy because the APA is going to put their managements offer for a cba to a vote.

It ever occur to you they know the membership might just turn it down?

Anybody know what it says regarding pensions?

 

[EastUS1]

Zone5:As much as I would like to agree with you that the "Merger" is not going to happen, stop and think about this event. There has never been an airline bankruptcy, where the pilots did not come to a negotiated agreement prior to exiting bankruptcy, ever.

Yes, I totally agree. .....This news about the APA reaching an agreement in no way means a merger is not going to happen.

Make that at least three of us here that see no huge game changer within this recent development.

Kudos to the APA folks for working the sad situation pretty well so far.

 

[EastCheats]

Make that at least three of us here that see no huge game changer within this recent development.

Kudos to the APA folks for working the sad situation pretty well so far.

Add another one to the list that sees this as an insignificant development.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Zone5:As much as I would like to agree with you that the "Merger" is not going to happen, stop and think about this event. There has never been an airline bankruptcy, where the pilots did not come to a negotiated agreement prior to exiting bankruptcy, ever.



Make that at least three of us here that see no huge game changer within this recent development.

Kudos to the APA folks for working the sad situation pretty well so far.

May be a game changer in the attitude of the pilots at AA,(provide retirement benefits for its pilot employees and their beneficiaries; and
WHEREAS, the Company and the Association wish to freeze instead of terminate the Pilot DB
Plan; and  Dated Proposal June 25, 2012
 Hourly Rates – aligned effective dates of base pay rate and per diem increases with start
of contractual month.
 A319 Pay Protection – clarified that pay protection only applies to active pilots on
payroll effective Date of Signing.
 Profit Sharing – modified document to reflect a flat five percent (5%) in Profit Sharing,
and eliminated the table.
 Work Rules – clarified Lineholder Projection metric to only count May through August of
each calendar year as the measurement period
 Work Rules – removed modified definition of Credited Projection (PROJ) to reflect
current book.
 Work Rules – modified Daily Standard rate to 2:45 / day for known absences
 Sick Leave – due to complexities of implementing split bank system mid-year, modified
language to reflect split bank start on January 1, 2013.
 Pension – inserted Pension Letter reference as Attachment E.
 Supplement CC – added the words “changes or” in front of closure on second line as a
result of an APA edit.
 Sequence Protection – removed placeholder language from headers (i.e. Move to
Section ...). Also, deleted some contractual references due to uncertainty of contract
rewriting.
 Ratification – aligned Paragraph A to conform with agreed upon MOU by adding
approval of Bankruptcy Court as one of the contingencies.
 Simplified the Industry Comparable Pay Rates and added clarifying examples.
 Settlement Consideration of Bankruptcy Protection letter replaced with updated
language.
 Added new Attachment “Clarification Documents” which include:
o Preferential Bidding System (PBS)
o Trip Trade System (TTS)
o Distance Learning (DL)
o Pharmacy and Deductible Question from APA
o A319 Reschedule / Reassignment GOOD FOR THE AA PILOTS!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

NOT TO MENTION "1. The Company will support before the Unsecured Creditors Committee a claim by the pilots in an
amount of 13.5% of New Corporation equity or equivalent" KUDOS!

 

[Zone5]

Zone5:As much as I would like to agree with you that the "Merger" is not going to happen, stop and think about this event. There has never been an airline bankruptcy, where the pilots did not come to a negotiated agreement prior to exiting bankruptcy, ever.



Make that at least three of us here that see no huge game changer within this recent development.

Kudos to the APA folks for working the sad situation pretty well so far.

True enough, the APA has done a great job of managing their leverage with both Horton and Parker, very impressive! After they get finished squeezing Horton's balls they are going to go after Parkers', they know how bad he wants this deal and that he will pay more to get it. Problem is, at least for us, is that the more it ends up costing Parker, the more it will cost us in the "end" and I mean that both figuratively and literally!

Furthermore, it's not going to be much fun when the APA gets around to dealing with us either. Just ask TWA, Reno Air and Air Cal, MB not withstanding.


seajay

 

[luvthe9]

.

It ever occur to you they know the membership might just turn it down?

Did it ever occur to you they want nothing to do with us and to be a stand alone carrier, if I were them I would take what I could get to avoid this mess that Parker has created here.

 

[Zone5]

May be a game changer in the attitude of the pilots at AA,(provide retirement benefits for its pilot employees and their beneficiaries; and
WHEREAS, the Company and the Association wish to freeze instead of terminate the Pilot DB
Plan; and  Dated Proposal June 25, 2012
 Hourly Rates – aligned effective dates of base pay rate and per diem increases with start
of contractual month.
 A319 Pay Protection – clarified that pay protection only applies to active pilots on
payroll effective Date of Signing.
 Profit Sharing – modified document to reflect a flat five percent (5%) in Profit Sharing,
and eliminated the table.
 Work Rules – clarified Lineholder Projection metric to only count May through August of
each calendar year as the measurement period
 Work Rules – removed modified definition of Credited Projection (PROJ) to reflect
current book.
 Work Rules – modified Daily Standard rate to 2:45 / day for known absences
 Sick Leave – due to complexities of implementing split bank system mid-year, modified
language to reflect split bank start on January 1, 2013.
 Pension – inserted Pension Letter reference as Attachment E.
 Supplement CC – added the words “changes or” in front of closure on second line as a
result of an APA edit.
 Sequence Protection – removed placeholder language from headers (i.e. Move to
Section ...). Also, deleted some contractual references due to uncertainty of contract
rewriting.
 Ratification – aligned Paragraph A to conform with agreed upon MOU by adding
approval of Bankruptcy Court as one of the contingencies.
 Simplified the Industry Comparable Pay Rates and added clarifying examples.
 Settlement Consideration of Bankruptcy Protection letter replaced with updated
language.
 Added new Attachment “Clarification Documents” which include:
o Preferential Bidding System (PBS)
o Trip Trade System (TTS)
o Distance Learning (DL)
o Pharmacy and Deductible Question from APA
o A319 Reschedule / Reassignment GOOD FOR THE AA PILOTS!

The more the unions at AMR sweeten their deal with Horton, the more AMR's stand alone deal pales against Parker's merger plan, simple as that. Parker is right, a merger is in the best interest of both AMR and US Airways. Having said that, for the pilots (at least at US Airways) this merger is going to suck for years. Then again, as has been said many times, a "fair" merger pisses off both sides equally.


seajay

 

[luvthe9]

Starting to look like old Doogie is going to chalk up failure number 5. Sweeten the pot and you might have a chance you can't be cheap!!!!!!