Ladies and Gentlemen:How do we best fix this mess?

[USA320Pilot]

Bob,

I understand your logic, but the much of the top of the seniority list is retiring and they do not have a dog in this fight. In July 130 pilots are being recalled and they are younger and junior than the top of the list and they will fight even harder.

Furthermore, many US Airways pilots are currently receiving meaningful pay raises. For example, when a reserve goes from reserve to blockhoder they get paid either 72 or 76 hours per month up to 95 hours (can be flexed 5 hours more) per month by fling a full line, which is about a 25% pay raise.

When First Officers move to Captain their pay rate on a norrowbody goes up $39 per hour.

When narrwobody pilots move to widebody jobs (dependent on whether it’s a B757/B767 or A330) their pay jumps and when a B757/B767 pilot goes to the A330 their pay jumps too.

By keeping the two pilot groups separate a very large number of US Airways pilots can make more money than merging the lists together and they would have significantly better quality of life.

Meanwhile, the AWA pilots would be stuck with no growth and no additional pay until they go through the Section VI process, mediation, a possibly 30-day cooling off period.

Doug Parker has stated many times that he can run the company with two separate pilot groups and the East pilots are willing to do so because they would be better off.
__________

TechBoy,

Unless the list is set aside then the Arbitrators Award is binding, but the US airways pilots have the legal right to block its implementation by simply living under its current contract and Transition Agreement. That is the US Airways pilot’s right. A fence would preserve pre-merger career expectation for both pilot groups.
_______

Autofixer said: The more I think about it, this could easily be fixed. 5 to 7 year fence East and West. Split new flying 50/50. Negotiate a new and fair contract. Otherwise the alternative is bad.

USA320Pilot comments: I do not think the majority of the East pilots would object to your thoughts, except your fence is too short. It would need to be a longer time frame. The US Airways pilots are willing to share growth opportunities like the A340 or EMB-190, create equal scope protections, and negotiate a new contract. Autofixer, you’re right, without some sort of agreement between the parties the alternative is bad and nobody wants that.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

I bet USA320 is only upset because the first west guy was not put in behind the last 757 east captain, who coincidently was behind himself, just as he recently pontificated could likely be the case.

If that little slight were taken care of, everyone else east be damned, I bet he would be silent. As others have noted before, his transparency and self serving motives are obvious.

 

[Bear96]

The US Airways pilots are willing to share growth opportunities like the A340 . . .

Gee, how generous. Being "willing to share" flying on a type that's not even on the property yet and that right now NOBODY at East is flying. 🙄

 

[safety stud]

Hey I got a novel idea how about standing by your word so you can look your children in their eyes and tell them you are an honorable man and that a person's word means something.

Sorry Charlie...

Your words hurt people...
I've read many of your posts...
Most if not all intale ridiculing most everyone on here unless they have the same view as you...
Your opinions are YOUR opinions...
Bringing morality into this is just plain foolish...

Emotions have been running on overload the last couple of days...
Everyone on here has something to say...
What effects them may not effect you...
That doesn't mean they are wrong...it means it's effecting them differently than you.
To know the difference means you can understand the difference...

Kapish...

Just my opinion...

 

[USA320Pilot]

Most US Airways pilots are not arguing the legality of the Arbitration or the Award, they believe the Arbitrator did not follow the intent of the Merger Policy by not implementing meaningful fences. By not having meaningful fences the no bump, no flush provision has been mitigated and the America West piltos get an enormous windfall.

There is a way out of this mess and Autofixer's comments are germane. What needs to be done is to reach a negotiated settlement that provides a meaningful fence, maintains the no bump, no flush, provision and permits the parties to integrate.

If this is not done I know that every MEC member and the majority of the East pilots are wiiling to go to war and the AWA pilots will lose.

Meanwhile, I was just called by an MEC member is there is some very encouraging news regarding the US Airways East May 21 presentation to the ALPA Executive Council.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

Here is the bottom line.

The US Airways East pilots will never agree to the Then, another fight would likely erupt with the desertification of ALPA on the East property gaining a lot of momentum. Once this is complete, if the two companies were to integrate and combine pilot groups, the NMB would need to hold an election to see what union would represent the pilots and then a new union could be imposed on the America West pilots.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

Wrong once again, the NMB declared single carrier status, any card signing and/or election will include the HP ALPA.

Don't let the facts get in your way.

 

[b737fo]

Charlie,

The AWA pilots have an option. Either agree to a negotiated settlement or have the US Airways pilots exercise their legal rights.

The path is clearly worse for the America West pilots than for the US Airways pilots if this is not resolved.

If you want to live under your current contract and Transition Agreement for years to come, enter into Section 6 negotiations, have no growth up the seniority list, have virtually no seniority list movement, see no widebody flying, no EMB-190 opportunities, face union representation imposition, and enormous operational and employee turmoil, which will financially hurt the company, then do not look for a solution to this problem.

I will NOT be blackmailed by the east pilots in this fashion. I will not negotiate with a group that threatens with such a tone. Impose what representation you will, but I will not cave to the threats made in such a manner. I never thought I would have widebody flying or EMB-190 opportunities when I was hired here so I can live without them.

 

[Charlie_Tuna]

Sorry Charlie...

Don't be sorry We all have opinions and I can state mine just as anyone else can and I can hurt like anyone else. But I won't fall for your guilt trips.


That being said one thing I have been saying that is the truth and NOT an opinion and as you and everyone else knows is that both East and West used ALPA's Merger Policy to it's fullest extent and went together willfully into binding arbritration where an award was finally rendered. It doesn't matter what anyone's opinions are about that award whether they agree with it or not, whether they find it was a windfall or not or whether they think the arbitrator needed to follow and abide by the Merger Policy or not. The award is legally binding upon both parties plan and simple and the sooner you and everyone else gets over it and stop with the attempted blackmailing the better.

 

[FWAAA]

Gee, how generous. Being "willing to share" flying on a type that's not even on the property yet and that right now NOBODY at East is flying. 🙄

$20 says the current A330s and 762s on the property are the largest and longest range widebodies flown by US for the next 10 years. Won't most US East pilots have retired by 2017?

 

[Charlie_Tuna]

Most US Airways pilots are not arguing the legality of the Arbitration or the Award, they believe the Arbitrator did not follow the intent of the Merger Policy by not implementing meaningful fences. By not having meaningful fences the no bump, no flush provision has been mitigated and the America West piltos get an enormous windfall.

See post 109 for rebuttal

 

[b737fo]

There is a way out of this mess and Autofixer's comments are germane. What needs to be done is to reach a negotiated settlement that provides a meaningful fence, maintains the no bump, no flush, provision and permits the parties to integrate.

If this is not done I know that every MEC member and the majority of the East pilots are wiiling to go to war and the AWA pilots will lose.

You had the chance to get out of this "mess" when the arbitraitor gave both sides one last chance to negotiate before ruling but obviously that was a wasted opportunity by both sides.

Again with the threats of "war"? I can never consciously deal with a person who comes to me with threatening language like that.

 

[safety stud]

Don't be sorry We all have opinions and I can state mine just as anyone else can and I can hurt like anyone else. But I won't fall for your guilt trips.
That being said one thing I have been saying that is the truth and NOT an opinion and as you and everyone else knows is that both East and West used ALPA's Merger Policy to it's fullest extent and went together willfully into binding arbritration where an award was finally rendered. It doesn't matter what anyone's opinions are about that award whether they agree with or not, whether they find it was a windfall or not or whether they think the arbitrator needed to follow and abide by the Merger Policy or not. The award is legally binding upon both parties plan and simple and the sooner you and everyone else gets over it and stop with the attempted blackmailing the better.

See Charlie...
I was trying to be nice...
Not make you feel guilty...
The guilt...you see... is from you...
You read my post about you... and didn't get a thing from it...Your opinions are just that...
Now for the meat of the matter...
Being nice and all...

If you want to "Stir the Pot"...
Feel free...
If you want to "Acuse everyone who doesn't share your opinion as Blackmailers"
Feel free..

That's the best part of this message board.
We all will make our own minds up...
Regardless of what you say...

Just my opinion...

 

[US1YFARE]

The award is legally binding upon both parties plan and simple and the sooner you and everyone else gets over it and stop with the attempted blackmailing the better.

The award is the award and it speaks for itself. Getting around the award is a different story. That is what negotiations are all about--and there are different ways to negotiate--it is not blackmail--it is exercising your legal rights. It happens everyday--just because the jury awards $20M doesn't mean the defendant is going to pay it.

 

[safety stud]

The award is the award and it speaks for itself. Getting around the award is a different story. That is what negotiations are all about--and there are different ways to negotiate--it is not blackmail--it is exercising your legal rights. It happens everyday--just because the jury awards $20M doesn't mean the defendant is going to pay it.

Here Here...
Thanks US1
Couldn't have said it better...

 

[Charlie_Tuna]

The award is the award and it speaks for itself. Getting around the award is a different story. That is what negotiations are all about--and there are different ways to negotiate--it is not blackmail--it is exercising your legal rights. It happens everyday--just because the jury awards $20M doesn't mean the defendant is going to pay it.

You seem to forget that binding arbitration was brought into use in lieu of using the court for settling differences. You agree to give up your right of appeal and agree to abide by the arbitrator's award. It has nothing to do with negotiations. You left that phase behind when you agreed to binding arbitration.

Try to spin it anyway you want but you are wrong