m&r profit sharing

[fanlube]

First off i'm glad the west got something. The west m&r like the east earned it because of what the m&r have to put up with.

No hard feelings BUT its coming out of the east pockets for the sake of what?????

I do not have in the contract that i work under the sick pay, 4day work week and so forth that the west has in their IBT contract.

Under the contract i work under i am garunteed profit sharing. The contract that is supposed to be overseen by the union I pay dues to.
Now that same union is not only taking dues from me but also taking profit sharing.

Its just wrong, take it from the strike fund or the company drunk fund. But not the rank and file.

No bones to grind against the west guys. Again im glad the west got something. (I know what its like to get nothing, or hosed)

Have to agree with you completely just another example of the Good Ol Frightening Machinists screwing their dues paying members, with allowing the payout to come from the East's portion of the profit sharing and not from a Union account of some sort they just told all the guys on the East, "SCREW YOU" we dont care what you think we are going to do what we want to. Now the question is what are we the members going to do in return! All you East guys who didnt sign teamsters cards, How do you like your IAM now!

 

[Docker]

All you East guys who didnt sign teamsters cards, How do you like your IAM now!

I for one am glad the decision was made and I am still glad to be with the IAM. I am sure there are those on both sides that feel the west should have received it for the whole year and some not at all. But lets move on and get under one transitioned agreement. We've had enough of this east vs. west. We shouldn't expect the transition agreement to fix all the short commings of our current contract just so it transitions and while doing so adjust a few things.

 

[aquagreen73s]

The pilots have a joint negotiating committee as do all the unions on the property.

So going to ignore the rest of my post?

So come on and tell me about the arbitration you said occured that did not.

What about the ZW and RP investment?

Who did Seabury work for?

For the third time, don't let the facts get in your way.

700UW (or should I call your USA320?):

Pilots just concluded the seniority integration arbitration. The arbitrator is George Nicolau. East and West each had about two weeks to present their cases. During the East presentation, there was no evidence proffered suggesting anything close to what you allege - that money was available and ready to finance an exit from BK. Rather, the West used several days to present SEC filings and expert testimony which directly discredits any notion that East was in any position other than terminal death, with no hope for financing. The West strategy was designed to refute the East's argument concerning career expectations. Essentially, the West argued (persuasively) that there weren't any on the East. Then, there was no substantive rebuttal to the West evidence. Case closed. But according to you, that's all wrong? Didn't know the East negotiators were so incompetent. I thought they did the best they could with the hand they were dealt and my hat is off to them. In hindsight, however, I guess they should have called 700UW!!!

 

[700UW]

It is illegal for dues money to be paid to members for profit sharing.

Funny I was at CCY during negotiations, saw all the confidential financial data that the IAM requested.

The ATSB and GECAS were calling the shots when it came to the money.

ZW and RP had all ready invested before the merger talks became serious.

And John Luth of Seabury and Associates was able to obtain all the financing for the merger, funny he was working for Lakefield and US Airways, not Doogie the drunk and HP.

But once again you were not there, not privy to the information so like I say, "Don't let the facts get in your way".

PS. ALPO all ready reached a TA before US filed bankruptcy so they were not meeting nor negotiating with the company.

 

[aquagreen73s]

It is illegal for dues money to be paid to members for profit sharing.

Funny I was at CCY during negotiations, saw all the confidential financial data that the IAM requested.

The ATSB and GECAS were calling the shots when it came to the money.

ZW and RP had all ready invested before the merger talks became serious.

And John Luth of Seabury and Associates was able to obtain all the financing for the merger, funny he was working for Lakefield and US Airways, not Doogie the drunk and HP.

But once again you were not there, not privy to the information so like I say, "Don't let the facts get in your way".

PS. ALPO all ready reached a TA before US filed bankruptcy so they were not meeting nor negotiating with the company.

I don't know what else to tell you other than East presented nothing of substance to support anything close to what you allege. I know it's easy for you to hide behind anonymity and throw out cute cliches like "don't let the facts get in your way," but the reality of the matter is that there has been an arbitration. This is the only arbitration for any sort of seniority integration. This is the first (and probably only time) that the issue of East's health will be litigated on the merits. A central issue in the pilot seniority integration was career expectations and that goes straight to the financial condition of the respective carriers. AWA had challenges but nothing close to the condition of East. East was all but dead.

Each pilot group had more than a year to prepare for the arbitration and millions were spent on either side for preparation. Our rule of law requires that arguments be supported by facts. You can't make the facts fit your argument. Rather, the tribunal requires nothing less than complete candor from the litigants - the facts must speak for themselves. From that the trier of fact makes a determination. Since what you allege was not presented, and since the evidence would have been very helpful to the East position but was not presented, then the only logical deduction was that no facts existed to support the conclusion that money was ready to finance an exit. Rather, evidence was presented from the West that there was concern in Tempe that even with the Wall Street promises to fund the transaction, East would nevertheless run out of money before September, 2006. If anything, the difficulty the West had was which evidence to choose to present because there was so much of it to support the West's career expectations argument. The concern was at what point would the West negotiators cross the line from presenting a solid case to beating a dead horse. The arbitrator has retired and will publish his opinion in three months. Nobody knows for sure what the decision will be, but what can be said is that life was a lot better for the West negotiators than the East because the East had such an uphill battle. They did a fine job with what they had too.

 

[flynomore]

In my years of ALPA work if I had a dollar for every utterance of career expectations, I would have not a care in the world for what happens to "U" or "LCC" or whatever we all end up working for at the end.

Funny things happen in arbitration but I have not seen any one in an ALPA-ALPA merger that does in any way reflect the MEC importance placed upon career expectations. If AWA ALPA wanted to enshrine those expectations, then saving famous Dave would not have been an issue. Instead your MEC chose a strategy that will place good ole Dave ahead around January 1988 hires of US Air. Those pilots were flying trips for the airline, and dues paying union members before "Dave" took his flight flight lesson.

Don't let the facts interfere, indeed. How quaint.

 

[aquagreen73s]

In my years of ALPA work if I had a dollar for every utterance of career expectations, I would have not a care in the world for what happens to "U" or "LCC" or whatever we all end up working for at the end.

Funny things happen in arbitration but I have not seen any one in an ALPA-ALPA merger that does in any way reflect the MEC importance placed upon career expectations. If AWA ALPA wanted to enshrine those expectations, then saving famous Dave would not have been an issue. Instead your MEC chose a strategy that will place good ole Dave ahead around January 1988 hires of US Air. Those pilots were flying trips for the airline, and dues paying union members before "Dave" took his flight flight lesson.

Don't let the facts interfere, indeed. How quaint.

Then the 1988 hires should have thrown in the towel and gone with a carrier that wouldn't end up furloughing 40% of the list. They chose to stay . . .

 

[700UW]

I hope you are hungry aqua, here is your crow, first course:

US Airways gets $125M for restructuring
The Business Journal of the Greater Triad Area - February 21, 2005

US Airways Group Inc. has received a $125 million funding commitment from an investor group to help it restructure under Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

Eastshore Aviation, an investment entity owned by Air Wisconsin Airlines Corp., is providing a $125 million credit facility in the form of a debtor-in-possession term loan. US Airways (OTCBB: UAIRQ.OB) can access $75 million following approval by the U.S. Bankruptcy Court, and later receive two $25 million increments.

Under the agreement, the $125 million infusion will convert to equity in US Airways after the airline emerges from bankruptcy. US Airways provides 33 daily nonstop flights out of Piedmont Triad International Airport.

"US Airways has done a remarkable job in its restructuring efforts and has built a solid foundation from which to grow," says Eastshore Principal Richard Bartlett. "We and Air Wisconsin look forward to the opportunity to be part of its success."

Air Wisconsin, based in Appleton, Wis., is the nation's largest privately held regional airline.

Second Course:

Republic Airways Holdings Announces Agreement with US Airways for the Commitment to Affirm Chautauqua Airlines Jet Service Agreement
Business Wire, March 15, 2005

Find More Results for: "republic holdings invest in US INDIANAPOLIS -- Deal Includes Potential New Jet Service Agreement for the Operation of Embraer 170 and 190 Aircraft, a Conditional Equity Commitment for $125 Million and up to $110 Million in Asset Related Financing

Republic Airways Holdings Inc. (NASDAQ/NM:RJET), announced today that along with its majority shareholder Wexford Capital LLC, it has reached agreement with US Airways Group, Inc. on an omnibus agreement which includes provisions for the affirmation of an amended Chautauqua Airlines Jet Service Agreement (JSA); a potential new jet service agreement with a Republic subsidiary for the operation of Embraer 170 and 190 aircraft; a conditional $125 million dollar equity commitment and up to $110 million in asset related financing.

Terms of the agreement are being filed by US Airways Group, Inc. with the U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Eastern District of Virginia in Alexandria, and US Airways will seek the court's approval at the next monthly omnibus hearing scheduled for its case, which is set for Thursday, March 31 at 9:30 a.m.

Third Course:

How does this filing impact US Airways’ guaranteed loan from the Air Transportation Stabilization Board (ATSB)?

US Airways is committed to repaying the ATSB loan. US Airways will present to the Court an agreement with the ATSB that protects the interests of the ATSB and the other lenders on the loan. That agreement will allow US Airways to use a portion of the $750 million in cash – which serves as one component of the collateral supporting the loan guaranteed by the ATSB – as working capital. The Company’s current cash position is approximately $1.45 billion in cash, cash equivalents and short-term investments. The outstanding portion of the ATSB loan guarantee is $717.6 million, of which 10 percent (or $71.8 million) is owed to the Retirement Systems of Alabama Holdings LLC (RSA) and Bank of America N.A. The Company will present to the Court an agreement to use its cash in a measured, conservative approach.

Fourth Course:

How US Airways/America West merger got off the ground
Talks between airlines began in 2003, but didn't get serious until this year
Sunday, May 22, 2005

By Dan Fitzpatrick, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

The on-and-off, 18-month courtship between US Airways and America West Airlines finally clicked into place May 12 in Washington, D.C., high above the floor of the MCI Center, where executives from both airlines had gathered in US Airways' skybox to watch a Washington Wizards playoff game.

Just minutes before tip-off, with the din of exploding fireworks filling the arena, US Airways adviser John Luth received an e-mail on his BlackBerry from Air Canada Chief Executive Officer Robert Milton. It confirmed that Air Canada's board had approved an investment in the combined airline -- the final piece of a $1.5 billion financing package needed to make the deal work.

Luth waved his BlackBerry, smiled and gave everyone the news. He congratulated Doug Parker and Bruce Lakefield, the chief executive officers of America West and US Airways, and broad smiles broke out throughout the box.

The merger was on.

Announced a week later at the Tempe, Ariz., headquarters of America West, the agreement between the nation's seventh-and eight-largest airlines paired a twice-bankrupt, East Coast legacy carrier with a younger, smaller, low-cost airline that does much of its flying on the West Coast.

If they can win a slew of antitrust, shareholder and bankruptcy court approvals, US Airways and America West together would surpass discount king Southwest Airlines in size, becoming the No. 6 carrier in the nation. Together, they also could usher in an era of consolidation in the troubled airline industry, which has lost more than $30 billion since 2001.

But there were several twists along the way, according to people familiar with the events. America West was not the only carrier to express interest in US Airways, nor was America West the only partner US Airways pursued.

The search for a deal began in the fall of 2003, when David Siegel was still US Airways' chief executive officer. Siegel had led US Airways through its first bankruptcy and wrested more than $1 billion in concessions from the company's labor unions. But even as the carrier completed a painful round of cost cuts and emerged from bankruptcy, Siegel knew US Airways was still too small and too inefficient to compete against discounters such as Southwest, which had already announced plans to start service in Philadelphia, a US Airways' hub.

Siegel was convinced that for US Airways to avoid the fate of failed carriers such as Eastern Airlines and Pan Am, both of which liquidated in the 1980s, he would have to bring US Airways' costs down further and position the airline for consolidation with another carrier. He explored several options.

Acquire United Airlines, the nation's No. 2 carrier. That option was code-named "Project Minnow," with US Airways as the small fish gobbling the bigger one.

Combine with British entrepreneur Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic, which was interested in US Airways' Washington-Boston-New York shuttle, along with slots and gates in the Northeast.

Split the airline in two and merge the Philadelphia and Charlotte, N.C., hub-and-spoke network with one carrier and its slots and gates in Washington, Boston and New York with another.

But US Airways ultimately rejected those options. United did not have any interest in a deal and was too distracted by its own struggles in bankruptcy. Virgin Atlantic wanted lots of US Airways assets -- gates, planes, airport equipment -- to help launch a new U.S. airline, but all it would offer in retrun was the Virgin brand name. US Airways also turned down several inquiries from other carriers -- including Southwest, JetBlue Airways and AirTran Airways -- about acquiring the company's assets but not its employees.

In the end, only America West wanted both.

Siegel made the initial connection. He knew Parker and Executive Vice President Scott Kirby at America West. Their first face-to-face meeting was in October 2003, over dinner in a Washington, D.C., restaurant. They were joined by then-US Airways Chief Financial Officer Neal Cohen.

But the talks ended several months later. At the request of US Airways' board, Siegel departed from the company in April 2004. According to Parker, the first round of discussions failed because US Airways' costs were still too high. Siegel had started a campaign to lower union costs further, but labor leaders refused to deal with him, contributing to his ouster.

Retired Lehman Bros. executive Bruce Lakefield, a friend of US Airways chairman David Bronner, replaced Siegel and sought to save US Airways. He asked unions to help with another round of concessions. When that failed, Lakefield took the company into bankruptcy again and squeezed another $1 billion in concessions from the unions, using the power of the U.S. Bankruptcy Court to hammer home new contracts modeled after America West's labor agreements.

In January, with fuel prices at a record high and doubts aired about US Airways' survival after its Christmas baggage meltdown in Philadelphia, Lakefield picked up the phone and called Parker, suggesting that "maybe we should begin those talks again," according to Parker.

But America West did not have enough cash to lift US Airways out of bankruptcy. It was up to Luth, the US Airways adviser, to find enough investment money to piece the deal together and give the combined company a fighting chance to thrive in the battered airline industry.

Luth and US Airways had serious discussions with more than a dozen investors. They all requested shared participation in a merged airline -- no one wanted to take on all the risk. The Retirement Systems of Alabama, which rescued US Airways from its first bankruptcy in 2003 with a $240 million investment, stands to lose it all if US Airways emerges from bankruptcy and issues new stock.

Luth went after the companies that had something to gain from an investment in US Airways and America West. Aircraft maker Airbus agreed to provide $250 million in exchange for US Airways' pledge to buy dozens of A320 jets in the future. Regional commuter carrier Air Wisconsin Airlines made a $125 million investment in exchange for a jet services partnership. The Appleton, Wis.-based airline will fly for the merged carrier on a contract basis.

Credit card companies may provide $300 million in order to reach new customers. And once-bankrupt Air Canada offered $75 million, good for a 7 percent stake in the new company, in exchange for the rights to bid on the maintenance contract for the new carrier's fleet of 361 jets.

Air Canada was the last in line.
Once its approval came last Thursday, employees at both airlines scrambled to obtain approval from their boards of directors. US Airways' directors signed off Wednesday, over the telephone. America West's board approved it Thursday, in Tempe.

Labor leaders were briefed, and a press release was sent out. Parker and Lakefield spent much of Thursday night explaining the deal to reporters before Lakefield took a red-eye flight back to Washington. Parker, who has been tapped to lead the merged airline, met with employees and went home. Before going to bed, he explained the deal in one final live shot with local TV, from his house.
-----------------------------------------------------------
(Dan Fitzpatrick can be reached at dfitzpatrick@post-gazette.com or 412-263-1752.

Fifth Course:

US Airways, GECAS, and GEES Reach Agreement on Aircraft Fleet and Financing Package

Airline Would Gain Short-Term Liquidity, Aircraft Debt Service and Lease Savings, Regional Jet Leasing, and Preserve Vast Majority of Existing Fleet

ARLINGTON, Va., Nov. 26 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- US Airways Group Inc., GE Capital Aviation Services (GECAS), and GE Engine Services (GEES) have reached a comprehensive agreement on aircraft leasing and financing, and engine services, which will provide the airline with short-term liquidity, reduce debt, lower aircraft ownership costs, enhanced engine maintenance services and leases for new regional jets, while preserving the vast majority
of US Airways' mainline fleet owned by GECAS.

If approved by the U.S. Bankruptcy Court and all conditions are met, the transaction will provide US Airways with $140 million in interim liquidity through a new bridge facility and the deferral of aircraft debt and lease payments coming due over the next six months. In total, US Airways expects the agreement to provide over $80 million in annual cash savings and aircraft ownership and engine maintenance costs. In addition, GECAS will lease up to 31 new 70 and 90-seat regional jet aircraft to US Airways over the next three years, and US Airways would return 25 of its 281 mainline aircraft over the same time period. The agreement calls for the return of 10 Airbus 319s in 2005, and 15 Boeing 737-300s in 2006 and 2007.

In exchange for these significant commitments by GECAS and GEES, upon successful emergence from Chapter 11, US Airways would issue to GECAS a 15-year convertible note for between $125 and $216 million, depending on future lease options selected by US Airways.

The agreement was filed with the U.S. Bankruptcy Court of the Eastern District of Virginia today and requires court approval by Dec. 17, 2004. In addition to court approval, the agreement requires that by Jan. 14, 2005, the
company achieve a series of cost reductions and restructuring milestones, and it must complete its judicial restructuring and exit Chapter 11 by June 30,
2005.

Shall I continue?

Funny did not see you at CCY, at the meeting with Glass, McKeen, Ben B and the finance people.

 

[aquagreen73s]

The bulk of what you post is after AWA entered the picture. None of what you posted was of any help to change the inevitable outcome - East was flatlined and had no hope of raising money. There was widespread concern that even with the Wall Street enthusiasm stemming from the AWA proposal that it might not be enough to save the East. The East pilot negotiators had nothing to work with. You are welcome to believe whatever you like. However, there are very very few who subscribe to your interpretation (invention is a better word) of the facts. The record of the pilot integration arbitration says it all: East had no hope beyond an AWA transaction.

 

[flynomore]

Then the 1988 hires should have thrown in the towel and gone with a carrier that wouldn't end up furloughing 40% of the list. They chose to stay . . .

=================================================

Hey Marty,

When you are done with the DeLorean, can I borrow it? I promise that I won't use up all of the plutonium.

I just need to check out which airline I should choose and how the seniority works out.

 

[700UW]

Spin spin spin.

The ATSB, GECAS, ZW and RP investments were before HP entered the picture.

Apparently you have a comprehension problem ALL the money was raised by EAST, not West.

Seabury and Associates' John Luth was working for US Airways not America West.

Keep trying.

 

[700AW]

Spin spin spin.

The ATSB, GECAS, ZW and RP investments were before HP entered the picture.

Apparently you have a comprehension problem ALL the money was raised by EAST, not West.

Seabury and Associates' John Luth was working for US Airways not America West.

Keep trying.

try this, maybe, just maybe, all of those investors :were on Board" with some knowledge of what was to happen before most others, that since hp and us had been talking for 18 months or so, i believe the last bk was planned by both sides to get r' done with due diligence, luth may have been an adviser to us but if he had been hired by hp then it would alert others to what was happening.
It stills stands to ask this, if luth got the financing in place, then why did hp need to aquire us to make it happen? if the investors had already given the money us would not have needed hp.
until that can be answered and proven to be correct then we have to think that it was hp's involvement that brought the funds in....

those are the facts

 

[700UW]

Apparently you have comprehension problems too, go back and reread the article.

 

[700AW]

Apparently you have comprehension problems too, go back and reread the article.

thanks, i missed something

"In exchange for these significant commitments by GECAS and GEES, upon successful emergence from Chapter 11, US Airways would issue to GECAS a 15-year convertible note for between $125 and $216 million, depending on future lease options selected by US Airways

this must mean that as long as the bk plan makes it thru ( that is the bk plan for hp to aquire us), they will be putting money into the "new" us, that is with hp, where does it say they would invest in us alone, with out hp?????

 

[700UW]

Novemeber 26, 2004.

Do the math and figure it out yourself.