New Hire Questions

[galleyguy4u2]

Hi guy's, I am a furloughed TWA/AA f/a and have a few questions for you.

1: How many days off do you have on reserve and what do the spreads look like..i.e 4-4-4- or other?

2. What is the $1500.00 phase two? Is this a sign on bonus? This is not very desrciptive in the application process.

3. Will UA pay for housing or is this now a personal expense because of the BK?

4. And most important will UA require those of us from AA or other airlines to resign?

5. Will UA give first right of hire to those of us who are on furlough? Perhaps someone could ask a AFA rep. about this.

Thank you.

Furloughed after 20yrs of service from TWA/AA.

 

[seajay]

Galleyguy, I'm in management so will have to rely on a flight attendant to answer question 1.

2. It is similar to a sign-on bonus. It is being described as a payment for completion of Phase I (the complete classroom and training flight portion). If you are successful, you are invited to continue on to Phase II (the initial operating experience flight) and to become an employee. You do get flight pay for the OE trip. It's not a lot, mathematically it is $250 a week for 7 weeks, and is taxable. But it will be something..since you then don't actually get your first paycheck (which includes the OE) for a couple of weeks. This is the first time UA has done this, and it was decided because other hiring carriers (jetBlue and CO, for example, pay either a small amount or a stipend for F/As in training).

3. Yes, UA pays for housing and food.

4. I don't know. I'll check around and see if I can find out.

5. No, although there is a letter of agreement which provides some preferential treatment for furloughed flight attendants from AFA-represented airlines only.

I'll see if I can find an answer for 4, too.

 

[galleyguy4u2]

Galleyguy, I'm in management so will have to rely on a flight attendant to answer question 1.

2. It is similar to a sign-on bonus. It is being described as a payment for completion of Phase I (the complete classroom and training flight portion). If you are successful, you are invited to continue on to Phase II (the initial operating experience flight) and to become an employee. You do get flight pay for the OE trip. It's not a lot, mathematically it is $250 a week for 7 weeks, and is taxable. But it will be something..since you then don't actually get your first paycheck (which includes the OE) for a couple of weeks. This is the first time UA has done this, and it was decided because other hiring carriers (jetBlue and CO, for example, pay either a small amount or a stipend for F/As in training).

3. Yes, UA pays for housing and food.

4. I don't know. I'll check around and see if I can find out.

5. No, although there is a letter of agreement which provides some preferential treatment for furloughed flight attendants from AFA-represented airlines only.

I'll see if I can find an answer for 4, too.

Thank you very much for the answers. TWA was not AFA but we were AFL-CIO members. I would hope that UA would entertain the former TWA/AA employees. United would be very lucky to employ some of the best f/a's in the industry with a great history.

Again, thank you very much for trying to get answers to my questions.

 

[mmahpeel]

I believe applicants will have to terminate employment at any other airline. Whatever the official answer is, make sure you don't try and slip it past UA.

During the mid-90's there were several flight attendants hired at UA who came from CO. Many of them didn't resign from CO and went to training with UA, some of whom were taking sick-leave time and pay from CO. UA fired every single one of them - this was after a lengthy investigation and several months after graduating.

Good luck...

 

[galleyguy4u2]

I believe applicants will have to terminate employment at any other airline. Whatever the official answer is, make sure you don't try and slip it past UA.

During the mid-90's there were several flight attendants hired at UA who came from CO. Many of them didn't resign from CO and went to training with UA, some of whom were taking sick-leave time and pay from CO. UA fired every single one of them - this was after a lengthy investigation and several months after graduating.

Good luck...

My situation is different I am furloughed with a five year recall that runs out in 2008. I am not able to use any of my sick bank until I am recalled. The CO f/a's that were using their sick bank while in training or on the line were double dipping and UA had every right to fire them and so did CO.

 

[Bear96]

Hi galleyguy

I am a (recently) ex-UA F/A.

Sadly, reserves currently have only 11 days off per month now. Used to be 12 but went down to 11 during the concessionary agreements. However, one thing that UA seems to have going for it is that reserve days are untouchable. They can't knowingly pre-schedule you to work into a day off (with maybe one or two extreme exceptions) and they can't make you come in on a day off.

The patterns vary but expect three to six days in a row on, with varying amounts of days off in between to get to the 11. 12 was nicer since there were lots of 4 on / 3 off patterns (although even those used to have a block of 6 on at either the beginning or end of the month generally) but that is hard to do with only 11 days to work with.

There is also a rotating reserve system at UA. After five years, if you still are on reserve at your domicile, you are then guranteed to be off reserve every other month if you choose.

A suggestion for #5, you might want to contact someone at the AA F/A union and have them contact AFA / UA. Maybe AFA can talk with and persuade UA to do what you are saying. I can't find the side letter seajay is talking about (I know it exists and what he says is true; I remember reading it at some point, but I wanted to reread it to see the exact wording but can't find it at the moment) but maybe AFA and UA can agree to maybe give furloughed AFA F/As priority, then other furloughed F/As, or something like that, before hiring people with no experience. Just a thought.

Good luck to you. The post - 9.11 changes to the job plus the pay cuts made the F/A job one that no longer appealed to me, but UA is a great company to work for and is about as good as it can get to be a F/A.

BTW, are you aware that this time they are supposedly hiring only people who live in the DCA and ORD areas (maybe SFO too?), where they will be based? I don't know the details of that policy or how they will enforce it (i.e., require you to have a local address in one of those cities) (and maybe seajay can explain) but just make sure you are willing and able to comply with that if they are strict about it, before you get your hopes up too much.

 

[JAMAKE1]

Gallyguy4u2:

Just to add to what Bear 96 already stated, reserves have off a minimum of 11 days per month, but with duty rigs factored in, I would venture to guess that reserves more typically have 14-15 days off. For example, here in SFO, if you are on reserve and assigned to a Hawaii-turn (something new in our concessionary agreement), one has to have 24 hours free of duty after a turn that goes over 10:00 flight time. Most island turns go over the 10:00 with the exception of HNL, which sometimes blocks in just under the 10 hr rule. So if a reserve is assigned an OGG turn, then they would be off the next day (or more correctly, for 24 hrs).

In spite of our concessions, we still enjoy 5 paid holidays (down from 10 in the good old days) and other pay factors such as holding, understaffing, and purser pay. To fly purser on a wide-body aircraft, you have to be purser-qualified, but when scheduling is short F/A's as they are now, reserves will often get slotted into the position (keep in mind our most junior reserves have about 5 years seniority).

The personal irony of it for me, is that I went to school throughout most of my flying career and flew as little as possible (60-70 hrs average). I recently returned from a 2 year voluntary furlough and am earning more than I have ever brought home in 10 years with United. I'm now flying 90 hours a month, mind you, but the earnings potential is there if one chooses to opt and fly the quarterly maximum (the number escapes me, but is in the neighborhood of 300 hrs/quarter).

I've been very happy at United because I have made the job work for me. I happen to be purser qualified which has allowed me to dodge reserve during my reserve month (we have a rotating reserve system up to a certain seniority percentage of each base). For me, it's still a good gig at the moment.

Lastly, I am pretty certain that United will force you to resign your position from AA. It's a gamble, but as the saying goes, one door closes and another one opens. Best of luck.

Warmly,

Jamake1

 

[seajay]

Gallyguy4u2:

Lastly, I am pretty certain that United will force you to resign your position from AA. It's a gamble, but as the saying goes, one door closes and another one opens. Best of luck.

**************

Yes, that's correct, I got the definitive answer. They will ask you to write a letter of resignation to your previous carrier. At the end of training, if you are successful, United will mail that letter for you. The nice thing is that you can wait until you successfully complete training. But you do have to resign.

 

[wepas]

Something else you can count on when figuring out your earning potential...although your hourly rate will be $17.22/hour, you get an extra $2.00/hour on reserve (it's called "reserve override"). So count on making $19.22/hour. And you can fly up to 100 hours a month (when you are on reserve you definitely will fly 85-90 hours...that's without opting to fly extra). The bad news is that you only get 50 cents an hour extra for flying international if you are under the 5 year mark (it goes up to $4 when you are on A scale) but it's an easy way to get hours in and the layovers are good. (about 24 hours in European destinations). I have talked to some Regional f/a's who were afraid of reserve...but when I found out what they have to go through on reserve, United is a dream! 4 hour airport standby (and you get paid the full 4 hours!) and 4 hour call-out are big pluses. As was mentioned before in this thread, it's not a bad gig if you can make it work for you.

 

[galleyguy4u2]

How does rotating reserve work at UA? Does this apply to new hires or are we stuck on reserve? AA is one on one off when you are a new hire.

Thank you all for the information you are providing for furloughed f/a's.

 

[trollydolly]

How does rotating reserve work at UA? Does this apply to new hires or are we stuck on reserve? AA is one on one off when you are a new hire.

Thank you all for the information you are providing for furloughed f/a's.

Reserve at UAL works like this...

As a new hire, you will be on straight reserve. This all depends on the senority of the base, and the amount of new hire transfers coming in behind you. If it is a junior base, and there are many new hires behind you, then it is perhaps possible that you could hold a line. If the base is a senior base, then the chances are that even with many NH FA behind you, you will most likely still be on straight reserve. This all changes once you merge or hit A scale. That happens after 5 years of service. Then you, the merged FA is on A/B rotation. One on, one off.

There are some other factors that might help you after a few years of service escape being on straight reserve. One is being language qualified, and the other is being purser qualified. Although there was a time that every new hire had to speak another language, so there are many junior FA that are multi-lingual. The purser program (I think,) must be given to those in seniority order and I do believe there are plenty of senior FA that are lined up to become qualified.

Hope this helps, and good luck!

 

[Tim Thorpe]

My only response to the question of new hires at United is "ARE YOU NUTS"

 

[dc3fanatic]

My only response to the question of new hires at United is "ARE YOU NUTS"

To United or the new hires?

 

[brightflyer]

Hi - I'd be relocating from NY if I applied (w/o a car), and I've heard that the base in DC may be rough w/o a car. Can you tell me if there are a percentage of f/a's there that manage w/o a car, and if so, preferable places to stay either near Dulles, or w/shuttle service to the a/p. Thanks.

 

[Bear96]

DC is VERY tough without a car, especially as a reserve (which is what you would be), because you have to cover all three airports (IAD, DCA, BWI). I don't think any place near IAD would have shuttles to DCA or BWI (and vice versa).

As to an actual percentage of F/As there without a car, I don't know, but I would imagine it is very small. There are a lot of commuters out of DC but they are generally more senior lineholders who have the seniority to choose which airport they want to fly out of. But as a reserve you really need a car for DC.