No Difference Between Twu/amfa !

fix_airplanes

Member
Dec 1, 2002
68
0
www.usaviation.com
--------------------
United, mechanics agree on retiree benefit cuts
--------------------

Other labor groups holding out

By Melissa Allison
Tribune staff reporter

May 22, 2004

United Airlines has reached an agreement with its mechanics' union to
reduce retiree benefits, but the carrier said Friday that it is
struggling to come to similar terms with other labor groups.

In a U.S. Bankruptcy Court filing, United said resistance from the other
unions has, in some respects, been "a throwback to the uncooperative era"
before the company's last labor negotiations.

Meanwhile, the union representing United's flight attendants issued its
own statement saying, "Any goodwill that existed a year ago has been
squandered."

The labor union that agreed to the retiree benefit changes, the Aircraft
Mechanics Fraternal Association, represents nearly 7,400 United retirees.
United did not disclose details of the agreement, and mechanics' union
representatives were unavailable Friday.

But in recent months, United has sought roughly $55 million in annual
benefit cuts from retirees as part of its overall effort to reduce costs
by $5 billion a year by 2005. The airline says its retiree medical costs
are the highest in the industry.

In its court filing, United says that retirees at AMFA "have done their
part by agreeing to pay a more equitable share of the costs for their
medical benefits, and the rest of United's retirees have no good cause
for refusing to follow suit."

Representatives of six of the seven remaining retiree groups do not see
it that way. They sent a letter to United Chief Executive Glenn Tilton
saying the company has not negotiated in good faith and calling the
airline's demands unreasonable.

The cuts reach "far deeper than those demanded of active employees under
the company's restructuring," the letter said. "Unlike any other
stakeholder in United, the company is demanding that retirees make a
sacrifice that is unlimited in time or amount."

The retirees are willing to make concessions totaling nearly $300 million
through 2010, according to the letter.

The six groups represent about 27,000 United retirees, including pilots,
flight attendants, ramp workers, security officers, flight dispatchers,
and salaried and management employees. The representative for United's
engineers did not sign the letter to Tilton.

United responded with a letter saying the cuts requested by the airline
are necessary if it is to reorganize and become competitive.

"It is absolutely clear that our proposed modifications--which deliver
real cash savings, approximately $350 million through 2010--are
necessary, fair and equitable," wrote Peter McDonald, United's executive
vice president and chief operating officer.

"Your proposal significantly overvalues the savings it would deliver, and
it comes nowhere close to delivering the savings we need. Worse, the
savings don't bring our benefits down to competitive levels and provide
only temporary relief," McDonald wrote.

All parties say they plan to continue negotiating. But if agreements are
not reached, the matter is scheduled to be heard in court next month.

The letter from McDonald riled the International Association of
Machinists and Aerospace Workers, which represents United's ramp workers.

The union fired off a message Friday to its United retirees accusing
Tilton of being indifferent to their needs by not replying to their
letter himself. When he joined United in late 2002, Tilton "urged an
effort to begin a new relationship and trust going forward," the union's
message said. Now, the message told union members, "he has chosen to
ignore you and his own words."

At least one union believes the mechanics' union hurt other retirees by
negotiating with United earlier than the other groups. In late April, the
Association of Flight Attendants for United sent a letter to the
mechanics' union warning that it was too early to talk to the airline
about benefits.

"This is a strategic mistake that threatens to undercut the position of
all the other employees, including the flight attendants, in trying to
limit or avoid the company's proposed cuts to retiree medical benefits,"
wrote Greg Davidowitch, head of United's flight attendants' union.

He said three actuarial firms and three financial advisers were still
sifting through tens of thousands of pages of information from United,
and still waiting for more data.

"There can be no possible advantage for your members in going forward at
this time, because the analysis might prove the cuts are not necessary,
or not fair and equitable," Davidowitch wrote.

In court Friday, Bankruptcy Court Judge Eugene Wedoff approved the
unsecured creditors' committee's request to hire a consulting firm to
evaluate United's board of directors. He also approved changes to
United's debtor-in-possession financing, including extending it from June
30 to Dec. 31, and reducing its interest rate by 1 percentage point.


Copyright © 2004, Chicago Tribune
 
!!!!!!!!THANKS (AGAIN) AMFA!!!!!!!!!


AMFA-The sorriest, piece of crap union that exists!!!! Who the hell would not fight harder for the retiress??????? Oh, yeah, that would be amfa!!!! I have tried to be nice up to this point but amfa has failed far too many times. And they want to be the BA at AA????!!!! Let's add up the damage shall we. . . .more layoffs under amfa, more outsourcing under amfa, less representation under amfa, now that there is nothing left they allow their retirees to take a bigger hit!!!! Their name says it all. . . .they are not a union, they ARE AN ASSOCIATION!!!! Only looking out for a few at the top.


Oh, but I forgot. . . ."BANKRUPTCY IS A BETTER ALTERNATIVE"!!!!!!!




Let's see that one more time. . . .
United Airlines has reached an agreement with its mechanics' union to
reduce retiree benefits. . . . . . .
The labor union that agreed to the retiree benefit changes, the Aircraft
Mechanics Fraternal Association
, represents nearly 7,400 United retirees.
United did not disclose details of the agreement, and mechanics' union
representatives were unavailable Friday.


AMFA :down: :down: :down:
 
The labor union that agreed to the retiree benefit changes, the Aircraft
Mechanics Fraternal Association,
represents nearly 7,400 United retirees.
United did not disclose details of the agreement, and mechanics' union
representatives were unavailable Friday.

Well I wonder why Dave didn't cut and paste this item before you fix....HAHAHAHAHAHA..AMFA's history just keeps getting worse. Now I see where the amfa mechanics are stating they personally do not care about the retirees.

No concessions....and I mean it...yeah right.
 
Now I see where the amfa mechanics are stating they personally do not care about the retirees.


Proof is in the puddin' as they say!!!!! Funny how that happens!!!
 
TWU punks and cowards complaining about an early settlement?! How odd is that?

The TWU is always the first to roll over come contract time, and bums like twuer, Drip E. Dick, etal. critizize AMFA?

They don't even know the details and they spew their TeAAm TWU company lAAp dog union crap!


The TWU lAAp dog, sell out union is out the door in '04!
 
Hey Ed, haven't seen you in a while.

I don't think you can criticize your way out of this one!!!! Amfa sucks and we all know it. They keep proving that over and over and over and over and over and over!!!!!!

How will they protect the profession when they can't even protect their own retirees?????

I hear amfa is in pretty hot water over this one!!!! I doubt it will be the last time!!
 
Hey, I have a question. . . .did the retirees get to vote on their future or was this decision made for them by the higher ups??????? Oh that's right we don't give a crap about those who can't vote!!!!!! Who cares if they paved the way for us to have the right to unionize in the first place!!!! Screw the retirees. They have no impact on us!!!!!!



EXPLAIN THE AMFA ACTIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! JUSTIFY OR BETTER YET, SHOW YOUR TRUE AMFA COLORS AND COME BACK WITH ANOTHER QUESTION OR COMPLAINT OF THE TWU!!!!
 
Company: Come on boys, these guys are suckers. we can get what ever we want.

Amfa: Hey what happened? They can't do that, can they?

Company: They will never know what hit em.

Amfa: Hey, they took it wrong, that's not what we meant. you can't do that.

Company: Oh yes we can...you just signed for it sucker. HAHAHAHA
 
Chalk it up to a big dose of inexperience with a little ignorance on the side. While they're learning the ropes (which they should know by now!!) they want the employees at AA to consider them for their bargaining agent!! NOT!!!!, AIN'T HAPPENIN'!!!, NO WAY!!!!, UH UH!!!!, NOT A SNOWBALLS CHANCE!!!

Find another guinea pig. . . .oh wait they have one UAL!!! Wonder what's in store for NWA???? Can't be good!!!
 
Most of United's mechanic and related retiree's were never represented by AMFA when they worked for United. The IAM was their representative and the IAM refused to help their own retirees. AMFA didn't have to represent them, but ,in an act of compassion, AMFA took on the responsibility that the IAM would not.

According to the letter from the so called retiree "coalition" the retirees had already stated they would give 300 million dollars in concessions to United. United wanted 350 million dollars in concessions, a 50 million dollar difference. In the airline world 50 million is "chump change". Now United has made a motion in bankruptcy court to wipe out the retiree plans of the retiree "coalition". Based on previous bankruptcies, the request will probabley be granted. While the retiree coalition is getting their feathers plucked by the bankruptcy court, AMFA has an agreement with United that prevents that from happening to the retired United mechanic and related. If the bankruptcy court does not force the retiree "coalition" to change their retirement plans, I'm sure AMFA has negotiated an escape clause where they will not have to change their retirement plan either.

The big mistake in this mess was made by the retiree "coalition" agreeing to give 300 million dollars in concessions in the first place, now their crying that AMFA has screwed everything up. AMFA was not even asked to be part of this "coalition", so I hope the "coalition" gets plucked!
 
twuer said:
WHERE ARE YOU AMFA????????

You always make such a fuss when we don't respond. Now look who's not responding!!!!
:up: :up: The post by PK is correct. You did not include what the coalition had already agreed to do. I bet when all of this comes around and AMFA represented retirees have it better than the others at United we won't hear one peep about it from you (twuer, drip), but I keep forgetting that YOU ONLY #^%$ OUT WHAT THE SHEEP HERDER FEEDS YOU. :p :p :p
 
Most interesting.

TWU pounds into members heads that it is better to make agreements without going before the BK Judge.

Then when AMFA makes agreement just prior to UAL going to the Judge, the AMFA is the worst union around.

How ironic and two-faced.

Which way does TWU want it to be?
 
A couple of points here;

According to the article Uniteds retirees currently pay nothing, they will now have to pay like current employees.

Uniteds employees do not "prefund" like us. So our retirees have been paying for their benifits since 1989.

So UAL is getting now what we gave up 15 years ago.

The vast majority of the retirees at UAL were never AMFA members.

As far as not responding, I usually only comment on that when days or months have elapsed. Once again I've given you a courtesy to which to do not do in return.