openview said:
The only thing foolish is your asinine posts defending the undefendable management that is running U into an abyss. Too bad robots are not perfected, that what you and they want.
Operational Meltdown Thoughts
- Thread starter USA320Pilot
- Start date
The only thing foolish is your asinine posts defending the undefendable management that is running U into an abyss. Too bad robots are not perfected, that what you and they want.
I want nothing except to pass along some first hand knowlegde of my 14 years there. I no longer work for US. Management changes perpetually-new faces, logic, technology- and certainly more so in this last decade.
What hasn't changed throughtout this time are the unions involved, the players and mentality. You have conceeded money for the last decade as employees, all the while paying dues, and you don't question that logic? You don't demand the worst, most inefficient is eliminated from your labor pool, yet you demand it of mgmt.
That is robotic thinking. Those that enjoyed the holidays faking sick while getting paid for it thank you. And thanks for your december dues.
I put 15 years in, so what!openview said:
I can see you have a good head on your shoulders for paying dues to an organization you hate, brilliant.
Don’t even tell me you had no choice, we all do, ever last one of us that live under freedom.
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
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USA320Pilot said:
The whole piece has been picked apart enough, so I'll only tackle this part.....
#1 - In the 1113 filing, the company based their projections on $44 per barrel of fuel, not oil - a distinct difference.
#2 - Today, heating oil (the closest thing to jet fuel that's widely traded and which more accurately corresponds to the spot price of jet A than oil) closed at $1.3830 per gallon - that's over $158 per barrel.
Jim
BoeingBoy said:
Jim, don't confuse him....
, FWIW, Heating oil went up much more than oil and gasoline during the recent spike (remember the good old days when diesel was cheaper than regular, instead of more expensive than premium? Good thing Cuomo bulldozed a brand new nuke plant on Long Island and replaced it with diesel powered turbines... but I digress...)I think you meant $1.28 for the daily close (it peaked up around $1.50 when crude (WTI) hit $55, and was as low as $1.20 just a few days ago). Ironically, other grades of oil (heavier sulfer laden middle east varieties) trade in the low $30's with a spread between them and West Texas Intermediate approaching $15 a barrel (up from the traditional $3-$5 a barrel) The reason? Not enough refining capacity. Good thing the greens haven't allowed any new refineries in the U.S. since the Carter administration...
Using the price of a barrel of oil to indicate fuel costs is about the same as using cattle cost to comment on the price of a leather jacket. Some merit, but definately not the complete picture.
http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/
- Thread Starter
- #53
700UW:
It's my understanding that not much has changed in negotiations between the IAM's three units and the company.
700UW said: "And I Guess you still can't get it through your thick skull, if any contract is abrogated, there will be a strike by the IAM and/or AFA and the ATSB will pull the loan and the company will cease to operate."
USA320Pilot comments: How do you know that? The company's motion and a judge's order could prevent "self help". Many legal observers believe the RLA act takes precedent, there could be a PEB, and Congress could intervene. Moreover, the Bush Administration does not like labor and Judge Mitchell has ruled on virtually every company motion.
700UW said: "And you also said it first that US Airways was going to buy United, that did not happen."
USA320Pilot comments: When did I say that? I commented on a corporate transaction, which David Bronner discussed in four separate interviews. The deal did not happen because the SARS epidemic and the Iraqi War ended too soon. If United had missed there DIP requirements RSA was prepared to buy United assets, according to Dave Siegel who eventually admitted the transaction could have occurred on my jumpseat in front of the copilot (I guess I can say that now that Siegel is gone).
700UW said: "And you also said it first that you were quitting because Your MEC let Dave steal your pension, but alas you are still here sticking your nose in everyone else's business."
USA320Pilot comments: When did I say that? After evaluating the contract I elected to remain. By the way, would you work for my labor groups previous or current contract, if you had the skills?
700UW said: "You also said six months ago the company was going to inflict the "painful" clause on the IAM."
USA320Pilot comments: How much more pain do you need? The IAM has the largest pay cut percentage out of any labor group, which will likely be the longest too. The company is seeking to outsource all utility, currently outsources not only A320 but A330 heavy maintenance too, and is seeking even more outsourcing. If taking the largest pay cut out for the longest amount of time for any labor group, plus the other issues surrounding the IAM is not painful enough, I do not know what is.
700UW said: "You also said the company was going to close PIT and CLT base and move it to an undesirable location."
USA320Pilot comments: Did you miss the S.1113 filings and news media reports. maybe you should do more cut and pasting to get your facts straight. By the way, the maintenance facilities have not been closed yet, but guess what...
700UW said: "You also said the IAM would lose the airbus arbitration."
USA320Pilot comments: Yes I thought the company would win the arbitration hearing and I was wrong, but not the result. Can you tell who does not only A320 but A330 heavy maintenance too on US Airways aircraft? Moreover, how many A320 family aircraft heavy maintenance overhauls has US Airways' mechanics performed.
700UW, it's my understanding that it's possible but unlikely that there will be a TA with the IAM-M. There has been some progress with the IAM-Trainers and IAM-FSA, but the recent sick calls has strengthened the company's "imposition" case.
The IAM has shot itself in the foot again and there is no support for employees who call in sick and do not have a legitimate excuse. Imposition could occur in about 1-week, with painful ramifications.
It's too bad to see what's happening to some very good people. It will be interesting to see if the company permits the union to provide meaningful concessions or just eliminates most of the malcontents.
Remember, it's only a job.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
It's my understanding that not much has changed in negotiations between the IAM's three units and the company.
700UW said: "And I Guess you still can't get it through your thick skull, if any contract is abrogated, there will be a strike by the IAM and/or AFA and the ATSB will pull the loan and the company will cease to operate."
USA320Pilot comments: How do you know that? The company's motion and a judge's order could prevent "self help". Many legal observers believe the RLA act takes precedent, there could be a PEB, and Congress could intervene. Moreover, the Bush Administration does not like labor and Judge Mitchell has ruled on virtually every company motion.
700UW said: "And you also said it first that US Airways was going to buy United, that did not happen."
USA320Pilot comments: When did I say that? I commented on a corporate transaction, which David Bronner discussed in four separate interviews. The deal did not happen because the SARS epidemic and the Iraqi War ended too soon. If United had missed there DIP requirements RSA was prepared to buy United assets, according to Dave Siegel who eventually admitted the transaction could have occurred on my jumpseat in front of the copilot (I guess I can say that now that Siegel is gone).
700UW said: "And you also said it first that you were quitting because Your MEC let Dave steal your pension, but alas you are still here sticking your nose in everyone else's business."
USA320Pilot comments: When did I say that? After evaluating the contract I elected to remain. By the way, would you work for my labor groups previous or current contract, if you had the skills?
700UW said: "You also said six months ago the company was going to inflict the "painful" clause on the IAM."
USA320Pilot comments: How much more pain do you need? The IAM has the largest pay cut percentage out of any labor group, which will likely be the longest too. The company is seeking to outsource all utility, currently outsources not only A320 but A330 heavy maintenance too, and is seeking even more outsourcing. If taking the largest pay cut out for the longest amount of time for any labor group, plus the other issues surrounding the IAM is not painful enough, I do not know what is.
700UW said: "You also said the company was going to close PIT and CLT base and move it to an undesirable location."
USA320Pilot comments: Did you miss the S.1113 filings and news media reports. maybe you should do more cut and pasting to get your facts straight. By the way, the maintenance facilities have not been closed yet, but guess what...
700UW said: "You also said the IAM would lose the airbus arbitration."
USA320Pilot comments: Yes I thought the company would win the arbitration hearing and I was wrong, but not the result. Can you tell who does not only A320 but A330 heavy maintenance too on US Airways aircraft? Moreover, how many A320 family aircraft heavy maintenance overhauls has US Airways' mechanics performed.
700UW, it's my understanding that it's possible but unlikely that there will be a TA with the IAM-M. There has been some progress with the IAM-Trainers and IAM-FSA, but the recent sick calls has strengthened the company's "imposition" case.
The IAM has shot itself in the foot again and there is no support for employees who call in sick and do not have a legitimate excuse. Imposition could occur in about 1-week, with painful ramifications.
It's too bad to see what's happening to some very good people. It will be interesting to see if the company permits the union to provide meaningful concessions or just eliminates most of the malcontents.
Remember, it's only a job.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
This is not traditional section 6 negotiations, no PEB can stop a stike as PEB only applies to Section 6.
And Mitchell does not have the power to issue an injuction to stop a strike.
Once a contract is abrogated they cannot force anyone to work, this is the USA last time I checked people had rights.
But myself, CluebyFour and many other even your own ALPA attorney who you annoited god-like status has written papers on a union's power to seek self-help after an abrogation.
See it happened at CAL and the ONLY thing that has changed is that the company has to follow steps in an abrogation instead of an instant one that happened at CAL in 1982.
Keep trying there buddy.
And only time will tell if anyone reaches a T/A in the IAM, but at least I know what is going on and you don't.
And the outsourcing is temporary and the company violated the judge's orders and there will be a hearing on something in regard to the 330, just wait and see.
Hmm Siegel flying jumpseat, interesting, he is not qualified, maybe we need to call the FAA and inform them, or is it more of your cockpit chronicles and I doubt Siegel would violate SEC regulations and tell you anything secret that US was looking into.
Last time I checked the 1113 c hearings are over all the testimony has been presented and news reports are exparte evidence and the judge can only rule on what has been presented to him, not watching TV or reading a Newspaper and adding that to evidence.
You never cease to amaze me.
Keep up the speculation there buddy 10-4 over and out.
And Mitchell does not have the power to issue an injuction to stop a strike.
Once a contract is abrogated they cannot force anyone to work, this is the USA last time I checked people had rights.
But myself, CluebyFour and many other even your own ALPA attorney who you annoited god-like status has written papers on a union's power to seek self-help after an abrogation.
See it happened at CAL and the ONLY thing that has changed is that the company has to follow steps in an abrogation instead of an instant one that happened at CAL in 1982.
Keep trying there buddy.
And only time will tell if anyone reaches a T/A in the IAM, but at least I know what is going on and you don't.
And the outsourcing is temporary and the company violated the judge's orders and there will be a hearing on something in regard to the 330, just wait and see.
Hmm Siegel flying jumpseat, interesting, he is not qualified, maybe we need to call the FAA and inform them, or is it more of your cockpit chronicles and I doubt Siegel would violate SEC regulations and tell you anything secret that US was looking into.
Last time I checked the 1113 c hearings are over all the testimony has been presented and news reports are exparte evidence and the judge can only rule on what has been presented to him, not watching TV or reading a Newspaper and adding that to evidence.
You never cease to amaze me.
Keep up the speculation there buddy 10-4 over and out.
USA320Pilot said:
In one sentence malcontents the next best regards.
FYI on schizophrenia
Disorganized Symptoms include confused thinking and speech, and behavior that does not make sense. For example, people with schizophrenia sometimes have trouble communicating in coherent sentences or carrying on conversations with others; move more slowly, repeat rhythmic gestures or make movements such as walking in circles or pacing; and have difficulty making sense of everyday sights, sounds and feelings.
- Thread Starter
- #56
700UW:
The IAM is the only union without a new CBA or TA and has taken the largest pay cut out of any employee group.
Why do you think it has taken the company about two weeks to respond to the IAM-M's December 16 proposal with the "imposition" pending? Could it be that the company no longer wants a deal with your union.
After all, the airline has had about 1-year to plan for the upcoming judicial order and guess what, the ATSB, DOT, GE, and the creditor's committee have all been briefed on the company's intentions. Moreover, the creditor's committee wrote the court a letter supporting "imposition", if necessary.
The question is can the IAM meet the cost cut target, like every other union, and in the aftermath of the IAM sick out, will the company permit the "concession stand to be opened"?
Let's just agree to disagree, but I guarantee you this...there will be more to this story and I believe there will be even more IAM pain due to failed union leadership. It's too bad, but that's the union's choice.
Remember, it's only a job.
I'm going to bed -- have a nice evening and day tomorrow.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
The IAM is the only union without a new CBA or TA and has taken the largest pay cut out of any employee group.
Why do you think it has taken the company about two weeks to respond to the IAM-M's December 16 proposal with the "imposition" pending? Could it be that the company no longer wants a deal with your union.
After all, the airline has had about 1-year to plan for the upcoming judicial order and guess what, the ATSB, DOT, GE, and the creditor's committee have all been briefed on the company's intentions. Moreover, the creditor's committee wrote the court a letter supporting "imposition", if necessary.
The question is can the IAM meet the cost cut target, like every other union, and in the aftermath of the IAM sick out, will the company permit the "concession stand to be opened"?
Let's just agree to disagree, but I guarantee you this...there will be more to this story and I believe there will be even more IAM pain due to failed union leadership. It's too bad, but that's the union's choice.
Remember, it's only a job.
I'm going to bed -- have a nice evening and day tomorrow.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
Merry New Year to you too.
And it was CCY who called the NC back to Washington, this coming Monday and the counter came across last week and it seems the company has moved.
Lets just hope you are wrong like usual.
One thing, you seem to take enjoyment at "pain" imposed on the IAM and the last time I checked the AFA and CWA members are still having 21% paycuts, judge has to approve the CWA TA and AFA has not ratified. Hate to burst your logic.
And it was CCY who called the NC back to Washington, this coming Monday and the counter came across last week and it seems the company has moved.
Lets just hope you are wrong like usual.
One thing, you seem to take enjoyment at "pain" imposed on the IAM and the last time I checked the AFA and CWA members are still having 21% paycuts, judge has to approve the CWA TA and AFA has not ratified. Hate to burst your logic.
BoeingBoy said:
Kudos for being in the 1% that knows there is only 42 gallons per barrel (instead of 55)....
Explain to me how a "judge's order" could have prevented what happened last weekend.USA320Pilot said:
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