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Remember this in 2005? Union leaders bad or good?

They didnt pay me, I was on workers comp, if I didnt have a CBA I would have been fired as I was out of work for over two years on and off.

If I was non-union after 90 days I would have been terminated.

Send your kid off to the factory or coal mine at 7.

You people have no clue.
Who do you think pays the state workers compensation program? So do you think the amount paid to WC is perhaps one of the components found in the total payroll number that is then in turn used to calculate worker productivity? They did pay you via payroll tax dollars that were confiscated by the state and then paid back to you. So, how exactly did your two-year time off from work contribute to total productivity? And you say I have no clue. :lol:
 
Unemployment is taxable, your wrong again, lol. Why do CEOs get rewarded for failure and employees and/or tax payers bail them out?

Actually US if self-insured, I never recieved a check from the state, it was from Kemper insurance, gee your wrong again, how can that be?

I wasnt off for two years, I was off and on for two years and almost died from an infection after one of the knee surgeries.

So should it be like the old days, when I got hurt from work, they cast me off to die?

No wonder why this world is screwed up because of how people like you think.

Go look up Haymarket, or the GM or Ford incidents, or who the Pinkertons were and Maetwan.

Maybe you will actually learn something.
 
700 if you read carefully (and I know you can), I acknowledged what unions have accomplished IN THE PAST. In today's current situation, they are not changing to adapt their mission to protect jobs and assure FAIR wages and benefits for all. Your argument does not hold water. YOU and the unions who want to maintain the status quo are the ones in the dark ages. Would it be fair to say we should have a CBA so I and the company have a set of rules to follow. Not trying to flame

You will also note I blame management too for allowing the unions to get their workers such uncompetitive and job killing contracts...

In the case of US, however, nothing will improve until management changes their view toward employees in general, and then customers. These are ASSETS not LIABILITIES...and until you realize that E, you will not see any improvement. People who hate to come to work do not do well--for themselves OR the company.

Times have changed--union goals have not. They need to or they will become an anachronism...left in the dust.

And I am NOT defending management by any stretch, I am merely saying that your mission has changed, so get with the program....it will cost BOTH sides to make things right again, so enough of the temper tantrums on BOTH sides and get on with it.
 
Would it be fair to say we should have a CBA so myself and the company have a set of rules to follow. Not trying to flame
 
Unemployment is taxable, your wrong again, lol. Why do CEOs get rewarded for failure and employees and/or tax payers bail them out?

Actually US if self-insured, I never recieved a check from the state, it was from Kemper insurance, gee your wrong again, how can that be?

I wasnt off for two years, I was off and on for two years and almost died from an infection after one of the knee surgeries.

So should it be like the old days, when I got hurt from work, they cast me off to die?

No wonder why this world is screwed up because of how people like you think.

Go look up Haymarket, or the GM or Ford incidents, or who the Pinkertons were and Maetwan.

Maybe you will actually learn something.
You're funny with all of your trivial distinctions which don't change a thing and I certainly am not wrong, as usual.

I've never been on unemployment so I wouldn't have any personal experience in that area. However, I do know that it is a very well reported fact that the bottom 47% of families that file tax returns, in terms of taxable income, pay almost no federal income taxes and most pay nothing at all. You may have money subtracted from a paycheck or insurance check, but if you are in the group that earn less than about $33k/year then your group contributed less than 3% of the total taxes paid in America. Further, if you are on unemployment, are you really paying taxes? Couldn't the state or federal government just pay you less and then not "tax" you on unemployment wages? But please again try to explain how sitting at home and drawing benefits from an insurance agency or a government entity contributes to worker productivity.

Who Pays Taxes

US being self-insured changes nothing. They are required to pay for workers compensation claims which is no different than a business paying the state and having the state act as the insurance company. US cannot just decide not to pay WC premiums because it is detrimental to productivity can it? You are really reaching to find a way out on this aren't you? Of course I don't know your specific situation, but I do know where the money comes from to pay the benefits you received - American businesses via workers compensation laws.

I never said someone should be cast off to die. I simply stated that there is no way that the unions or the laws they lobbied to have instituted have increased productivity. You want to distract from the fact that programs like workers compensation are a drain to business productivity. Its a pure and simple fact and only those willingly blind to the facts refuse to accept that.

The world is screwed, as you say, because we have long ago disregarded the notion of personal responsibility. People don't like the wages they are paid so they want someone else to fix it for them instead of bettering themselves to earn more or starting their own business. People think other people owe them a paid retirement program and a health care program and on and on because they don't want the responsibility of putting money away to care for themselves or they are too proud to ask their family, friends or church for assistance when they fall on hard times. The mathematics of this approach are bankrupting virtually every developed nation on the planet, most of which are in debt beyond their means to pay it back and they are too scared to tell people the truth lest they get accused of wanting people to die in the streets or want seven-year-olds working in sweat factories.

You are spinning your "facts" because you don't want to hear the truth. You talk like going back to the days before we had income taxes, Social Security Taxes, Medicare Taxes, Workers Comp laws and a national debt equal to our GDP is a bad thing. these programs are all a house of cards waiting to fall down as soon as China or whoever loses confidence in our ability to pay off our massive debt. I would much prefer to go back to a time when personal responsibility meant something and our national debt was limited to savings bonds or war bonds that served a legitimate purpose rather than a futile attempt to transfer wealth, which has never worked and has only served to weaken our nation and the American businesses which are the lifeblood of the economy we all have to live off of.
 
Would it be fair to say we should have a CBA so myself and the company have a set of rules to follow. Not trying to flame
You don't need a CBA to have established rules to work from. Ninety percent of American workers get along just fine with their employers without a CBA. With all of the productivity losses and non-productive costs associated with having a unionized work force, most companies would gladly pay more in wages and ensure fair work rules are present if the alternative means the work force will vote to be represented. Of course there are many, not all but many, companies who offer world-class pay and benefits even though they are not under threat of being unionized. These companies pay over-market wages and bonuses and have very satisfied employees because their business philosophy drives them to do so.
 
Ask the ramp and customer service about how that worked out for them in 92 when they were non-union.
 
700 go to this link and see how out of the top 20 contributers to Politcal parties over the last 20 yeasr 15 are unions and it is not even close!

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php

BTW your probably don't understand this but Democrats are union freindly not labor friendly.
 
Ask the ramp and customer service about how that worked out for them in 92 when they were non-union.
You have to go back almost twenty years for a rebuttal! I don't know the circumstances and I really don't care. Supply and demand market forces should be at play in worker wage discussions. If the there is an oversupply of labor willing to work for less, then wages can and should go down. If there is a shortage of labor, then the company must increase wages in order to meet its demands. These are really very easy concepts to understand.
 
700 go to this link and see how out of the top 20 contributers to Politcal parties over the last 20 yeasr 15 are unions and it is not even close!

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php

BTW your probably don't understand this but Democrats are union freindly not labor friendly.
Worse than being labor unfriendly. National labor unions use their memberships as pawns in their quest for money, power and prestige. In the case of government labor unions they are really running a powerful and sophisticated money laundering scheme where they use tax payer dollars, to which are channeled to workers who must pay union dues, to directly fund and support liberal democrat politicians which in turn sponsor more disastrous economic policies which result in more democrat and union money and power. The cycle of fraud and corruption using tax payer dollars just keeps on going while then American economy suffers at the hands of these self-serving power brokers. No wonder we are $14 trillion in debt and adding trillions more each year at this rate.
 
OK - It's time for you guys to come out of the SUN and turn off the AM radio. Yes, it's time to say "good night" to "RUSH" and "SEAN" for the day. Besides your looking a little redder and talking a little crazier than normal. Please come inside before the DESERT SUN completely dehydrates and fries what little cerebral function you may have left (or in this case Right - FAR RIGHT).

Much like everything in life - there are excesses and exceptions involving every organization and individuals. Stereo typing everyone that believes or participates in organized labor or a union as an __________ is stupid, It's about as intelligent as stereo typing everyone that holds ultra right wing beliefs and lives in PHX as an _________.

Nobody wins. And you look really petty and ignorant......just like on FOX.

What gets me is the the anti-union, anti-labor, GDI rhetoric BS - these types usually:

1. have never been in a union - so really don't know what they are talking about
2. are in a union, but despise the fact - but not the money they earn as a result of a CBA
3. jealous for not earning comparable wages as their union peers
4. have been told from birth that unions are bad - and one step away from socialism
5. that unions are responsible for everything that is wrong in business
6. Ignorant or simply not informed.

Unions are not perfect by any stretch - as is no company.....and this company in particular. I wouldn't trust Tempe and Company as far as I could throw them. If most of us could give Doug a present for his 50th - most of us would opt to be giving him one-way buddy passes outta here. Since that's probably not going to happen (we can always hope) looks like we are still stuck with a weak and divisive management team for the foreseeable future. Work smart and do your best, while your at it - refuse to be played like a violin by management (even in a bad economy).
Eventually it will get better.

Personally I would rather have collective bargaining on my side than Doug and Jerry any day. There is a whole lot of blame to go around at this place - but the anti-unionism crap is getting rather old. Wake up people - if you want to know what a horse (or company) will do? Look at it's record. Your can't really be that myopic or have that bad a memory can you? Wow, then you guys really do need to come out of the SUN.
 

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