Rumour- E170 Ops

[Light Years]

There's a rumour that the 170 Division will be "absorbed" fully into mainline in June.

Does that mean it will just remain a fenced operation with seperate contracts, but without seperate management and the whole pretending it's an Express carrier called MidAtlantic? That seems more likely than getting into the mess of incorporating it into the rest of the flying, re-furloughing people and using the higher cost contracts (US isn't giving up those terrible agreements anytime soon).

Has anyone else heard about this? Apparently they are already eliminating higher positions at MAA to transition to using the same supervisors etc as the regular operation.

I think US got what it wanted. It confused thier employees enough to create a second, cheaper mainline with all of thier talk of "RJs", "Express", "MidAtlantic Airways" "regional" "soft landing" etc. Now that they have secured mainline people operating mainline planes at bottom-of the-barrel commuter contracts, they can stop pretending it's anything other than US, as it's now confusing thier customers, not to mention the FAA. It makes sense to do it before the E190 comes.

Four years ago, US Airways operated a sizable fleet of 97 seat F100s. Now they will be operating a fleet of 97 seat E190s (an F100 with an Airbus makeover), using the same people and facilities, but under commuter contracts. Considering they had around 400 planes compared to 279 "mainline" now, they effectively re-created half of the airline, which is pretty genius.

 

[justaumechanic]

There's a rumour that the 170 Division will be "absorbed" fully into mainline in June.

Does that mean it will just remain a fenced operation with seperate contracts, but without seperate management and the whole pretending it's an Express carrier called MidAtlantic? That seems more likely than getting into the mess of incorporating it into the rest of the flying, re-furloughing people and using the higher cost contracts (US isn't giving up those terrible agreements anytime soon).

Has anyone else heard about this? Apparently they are already eliminating higher positions at MAA to transition to using the same supervisors etc as the regular operation.

I think US got what it wanted. It confused thier employees enough to create a second, cheaper mainline with all of thier talk of "RJs", "Express", "MidAtlantic Airways" "regional" "soft landing" etc. Now that they have secured mainline people operating mainline planes at bottom-of the-barrel commuter contracts, they can stop pretending it's anything other than US, as it's now confusing thier customers, not to mention the FAA. It makes sense to do it before the E190 comes.

Four years ago, US Airways operated a sizable fleet of 97 seat F100s. Now they will be operating a fleet of 97 seat E190s (an F100 with an Airbus makeover), using the same people and facilities, but under commuter contracts. Considering they had around 400 planes compared to 279 "mainline" now, they effectively re-created half of the airline, which is pretty genius.

[post="245277"][/post]​

They are planning on fully integrating the E170/E190 division into Mainline.

Currenty MidAtlantic Employee's in any group other than the pilots will be furloughed in favor of Mainline Employee's..

All part of the comapny plan.

The pilots are unaffected due to a flow down flow up agreement in their contract.. No such agreement with any other working group.. MidAtlantic Employee's, thanks but your history..

 

[umech]

They are planning on fully integrating the E170/E190 division into Mainline.

Currenty MidAtlantic Employee's in any group other than the pilots will be furloughed in favor of Mainline Employee's..

All part of the comapny plan.

The pilots are unaffected due to a flow down flow up agreement in their contract.. No such agreement with any other working group.. MidAtlantic Employee's, thanks but your history..

[post="245298"][/post]​

this is great news, this means " PIG PEN" is out of usairways

sorry for the rest.

iam :down: :down:

 

[pitguy74]

So Just,

Are they going to pay the "Mainline" F/A's their higher rates to work the 170? You think that makes sense? Explain your business thoughts with more clarity. I have no doubt that the two will become one, but I think it's just to make the FAA happy. MidAtlantic is just getting a "free ride" on Mainline's certificate. I believe that it is just going to become the Embraer 170/190 division, NO MidAtlantic. Pay scales and work rules, for the most part, will differ somewhat from their mainline counterparts. It would cost U money to relinquish 70% of MidAtlantic's workforce to have Mainline take over without curving operations. Again, can you explain your business logic? I am just trying to make sense of this strong rumor

 

[noluv]

light.. are you serious. i believe you because i have never seen you quote anything that has not come true. can i just ask, where you got this info. if you can disclose. if you cannot i understand. i have been reading these boards and i cannot believe that the company would displace maa employees and disrupt their lives and then lay them off once again. where is the maa union president? is this person going to allow this without a fight? or did he/she already agree to this unbeknowst to his/her fellow employees? if so...that is horrible and this person needs to be voted out.

 

[Light Years]

They are planning on fully integrating the E170/E190 division into Mainline.

Currenty MidAtlantic Employee's in any group other than the pilots will be furloughed in favor of Mainline Employee's..

All part of the comapny plan.

The pilots are unaffected due to a flow down flow up agreement in their contract.. No such agreement with any other working group.. MidAtlantic Employee's, thanks but your history..

[post="245298"][/post]​

Hmmm... well, the F/As have a flow thru and flow back agreement as well. The only way MAA F/As would be affected would be if more senior furloughees who did not return to MAA were offered a "mainline recall", which at this point isn't that many people.

Pilots, I don't know about, but I can't see a W/O MAA flow thru pilot finding themselves on a mainline plane before a furloughed mainline pilot, which seems to be what you are saying.

Although it should all be one, US Airways is not going to, for grins and giggles, furlough all of the junior folks who have been forced into but lived with cheapie contracts in favor of using the senior, topped-out full-mainline employees and making it expensive to run the thing. They see dollar signs, and the $17 F/A with the garbage contract is still more cost effective than the $40 F/A with the princess contract (relative to the MAA/AE contract). Don't know if anyone else has noticed, but they don't exactly have a hard on for mainline employees (unless they have been MAA'd or Expressed).

I think it's just going to be a disappearance of Express signage, the MidAtlantic name (which doesn't appear anywhere in manuals anyway), and a fenced operation sharing the same management instead of having thier own- kind of like the ITD was. Otherwise it doesn't make sense, unless they are ready to renegotiate the contracts to include all US Airways flying under one agreement per profession, which would be revolutionary, but highly unlikely.

 

[noluv]

light...please disreguard what i previously asked. i did not understand the contract that the f/a have reguarding flow through. thank you for your input.

 

[Light Years]

light.. are you serious. i believe you because i have never seen you quote anything that  has not come true. can i just ask, where you got this info. if you can disclose. if you cannot i understand. i have been reading these boards and i cannot believe that the company would displace maa employees and disrupt their lives and then lay them off once again. where is the maa union president? is this person going to allow this without a fight? or did he/she already agree to this unbeknowst to his/her fellow employees? if so...that is horrible and this person needs to be voted out.

[post="245333"][/post]​

noluv,

It's been a pretty open rumour around MAA for the past two weeks, with even management discussing it with employees, though no one has details.

The furloughing 170 folks in lieu of replacing them with full-mainliners is something I've not heard, and it's really a little too funny to worry about. If anything, more full-mainline F/As may find themselves with the option of becoming an EMB-mainline F/A or hitting the road.

The MAA AFA president is wonderful, but I think this would be a mainline issue. Keep in mind the MAA F/As had no say in thier contract- the mainline people agreed to it while the employees who would work under it were still furloughed. AFA ML could certainly fight it if the company wanted F/As to perform "mainline" flying (Airbus or Boeing) with MAA pay scales, but nothing can really stop the company from paying MAA F/As ML pay if they were used for that flying as far as I can tell, while using the MAA contract for Embraer flying. Messy, but that could be what they are trying for.

Mainline F/As really don't have a say in the Embraer flying at this point. They scoped it out with basically no restrictions, so that really any company's F/A, union or not, could work on a 100 seat US Airways branded jet. PSA can operate 90+ seaters, and even an affiliate carrier can under certain conditions. They can't come back now and reclaim it as thier flying, bumping out thier own junior counterparts who were lucky enough to get a small slice of the outsourcing pie.

It will be interesting to see how it pans out. I really think it's nothing more than taking the misleading and confusing signage off the planes and eliminating a few redundant positions, which makes sense. It won't be much of a change for F/As- you never hear anyone say "I work for MidAtlantic Airways", much less hear them welcome you aboard "US Airways Express".

Again, it's all rumour and speculation (albeit a strong one) at this point. Either way it opens up a million questions for everyone, whichever division, active or furloughed.

 

[MAABoss]

There's a rumour that the 170 Division will be "absorbed" fully into mainline in June.

Does that mean it will just remain a fenced operation with seperate contracts, but without seperate management and the whole pretending it's an Express carrier called MidAtlantic? That seems more likely than getting into the mess of incorporating it into the rest of the flying, re-furloughing people and using the higher cost contracts (US isn't giving up those terrible agreements anytime soon).

Has anyone else heard about this? Apparently they are already eliminating higher positions at MAA to transition to using the same supervisors etc as the regular operation.

I think US got what it wanted. It confused thier employees enough to create a second, cheaper mainline with all of thier talk of "RJs", "Express", "MidAtlantic Airways" "regional" "soft landing" etc. Now that they have secured mainline people operating mainline planes at bottom-of the-barrel commuter contracts, they can stop pretending it's anything other than US, as it's now confusing thier customers, not to mention the FAA. It makes sense to do it before the E190 comes.

Four years ago, US Airways operated a sizable fleet of 97 seat F100s. Now they will be operating a fleet of 97 seat E190s (an F100 with an Airbus makeover), using the same people and facilities, but under commuter contracts. Considering they had around 400 planes compared to 279 "mainline" now, they effectively re-created half of the airline, which is pretty genius.

[post="245277"][/post]​

Light Years,
MidAtlantic VP is leaving in a few weeks. The Inflight Manager now reports to Mainline Higher Ups. There is no "assigned" President for MAA for the moment.
No one can make decisions there without scratching their heads and taking weeks to think about it. On the flip side, MAA has accounted for 12% growth for Mainline in the past 10 months. MAA falls under the same accounting umbrella as Mainline.

Although MAA is a division of Mainline, a/c's continue to come in with "express" on them. 3 a/c were on PIT property Monday, and 3 more are in brazil in various stages of production. June 1 is emergence from BK, so the other 3 a/c in brazil will begin delivery in late July early August.

The E190's coming in will go to PSA. MAA is staying with the E170's.

 

[Phoenix]

...

The pilots are unaffected due to a flow down flow up ...

[post="245298"][/post]​

Flow up?! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

 

[Crzipilot]

The E190's coming in will go to PSA. MAA is staying with the E170's.

[post="245345"][/post]​

Seriously doubt E190's at PSA....CRJ-900's maybe....but not the 190's...

 

[E-TRONS]

"There's a rumour that the 170 Division will be "absorbed" fully into mainline in June."

You expected something different because you had an agreement??? You ain't seen nothing yet.

When you make a deal with the devil......snake-eyes-you LOSE!!!!

 

[Winglet]

I think U will be fully absorbed by it's creditors by June.

 

[TBONEJ4J]

I have been hearing that the MDA operation, or at least the equipment, is in play to go to Piedmont. I was told that Managment approached Piedmont ALPA in January asking what could be done to get the Embraer operation to Piedmont. More Games?:unsure:

If that's not the case, why should it be a big deal to be absorbed into Mainline? As it stands it is Mainline - albeit the Embraer Division. <_<

 

[Light Years]

The E190's coming in will go to PSA. MAA is staying with the E170's.

[post="245345"][/post]​

PSA does not operate any Embraer aircraft. They operate the CRJ200 and the CRJ701, and have approval to fly the CRJ900. Tha's what they will be getting, not E190s.

I pity the 90 or so pax that have to stuff themselves into that dreaded skinny tube for whatever routes U puts it on. The comfort level on the Ejets is night and day with the CRJs, but Airways seems to think they are one and the same.