SWA has new postings just listed

[swamt]

Hey guys, another posting just posted. 19 new positions. 9 for Dallas graves C- check, and 10 for graves structures. It opened 6-21. It closes 6-29. When these end up going unfilled, watch southwest.com for new hires.
Be patient guys, I still have not heard word for the last 5, however, they may already have enough for that group. With this 19 new positions being posted, there should be another external hiring spree. But no matter what, check the site numerous times daily. When I hear, I will post here. Good luck my brothers and sisters...

 

[Bob Owens]

AA is sitting on a valuable assett in that they have a large number of mechanics but they have convinced the Union treat it like a liability.

When DAL and NWA mereged they kept all their mechanics, when UAL ans CO merged they kept all their mechanics, when WN and Air Tran merged they kept all their mechanics. Mechanics and pilots will be in short supply in the coming years and AA is trying to lock in a deal that will keep our wages super low into the next decade.

Thanks for the info. Locally we have had dozens quit, recently the NYC MTA put an ad in the papers looking for A&P mechanics to work on busses and subway cars.

 

[FWAAA]

When DAL and NWA mereged they kept all their mechanics, when UAL ans CO merged they kept all their mechanics, when WN and Air Tran merged they kept all their mechanics. Mechanics and pilots will be in short supply in the coming years and AA is trying to lock in a deal that will keep our wages super low into the next decade.

That's because NW reduced its mechanic ranks from about 4,500 mechanics prior to the strike to fewer than 1,000 by time NW and DL merged. 3,500 jobs gone. The dirty work was already done by NW before the merger. In 2001, NW had about 8,500 mechanics and only 4,500 at the time of the strike. In just over five years, NW went from 8,500 to fewer than 1,000.

AA's announced plans include headcount reductions of over 4,000 mechanics, so each person who leaves voluntarily is one less to be furloughed.

 

[Buck]

Yet you have yet to touch on how many of those 4000 are A&P mechanics and the percentage that are related. Due to the structure of industrial unionism A&P mechanics are going to hit the street and related, while very important, are going to fill those slots. I cannot wait to see the company scramble to fill vacated machinist positions at TUL with the equivalent of OSM's.

 

[amt66]

You can't compare those airlines to AA we have over 9k mechanics. They will keep some maybe 3k

 

[Buck]

You can't compare those airlines to AA we have over 9k mechanics. They will keep some maybe 3k

While we have over 9000 mechanics today, if the company drops 4000, there will be 5000, but as I stated many will be machinist and or OSM's. At what point does the union and the company believe the mechanics pay will be low enough?

 

[FWAAA]

While we have over 9000 mechanics today, if the company drops 4000, there will be 5000, but as I stated many will be machinist and or OSM's. At what point does the union and the company believe the mechanics pay will be low enough?

Dunno how you know when the pay is "low enough" but it's easy to tell when the pay has sunk too low: that will be evident when AA can no longer attract job applicants at the contract wages and when far too many experienced mechanics quit because the pay is no longer enough to motivate them to show up for work. Up to this point, nearly seven months after AA filed for bankruptcy, the pay has been sufficient to keep people coming to work each day.

AA's AMT pay in Tulsa is still far better than the pay at most rural-location MROs. Where AA's AMT pay is far too low already is in NYC, BOS, WAS, ORD, MIA, SAN, LAX and SFO. The cost of living is much higher in those places than in Tulsa or Fort Worth, two very affordable areas.

Yes, the AMT pay in Tulsa sucks compared to what it was in early 2003 before the concessions and where it would be now if the concessions had never happened and where it would be if you had received decent percentage COLAs over the past nine years, but it's still better than the pay at AAR in Indy or the pay at TIMCO in North Carolina.

 

[Hopeful]

Dunno how you know when the pay is "low enough" but it's easy to tell when the pay has sunk too low: that will be evident when AA can no longer attract job applicants at the contract wages and when far too many experienced mechanics quit because the pay is no longer enough to motivate them to show up for work. Up to this point, nearly seven months after AA filed for bankruptcy, the pay has been sufficient to keep people coming to work each day.

When airlines can no longer attract qualified applicants because no one will come into this field, airlines will simply force the government agencies overseeing airlines to reduce required licensing requirments. You, see, the famous "MARKET DEMAND" argument that applies to those at the top does not apply to the rest of us.

AA's AMT pay in Tulsa is still far better than the pay at most rural-location MROs. Where AA's AMT pay is far too low already is in NYC, BOS, WAS, ORD, MIA, SAN, LAX and SFO. The cost of living is much higher in those places than in Tulsa or Fort Worth, two very affordable areas.

Good point! But our union never supported GEO pay to the point where the BASE was happy to agree to it.

Yes, the AMT pay in Tulsa sucks compared to what it was in early 2003 before the concessions and where it would be now if the concessions had never happened and where it would be if you had received decent percentage COLAs over the past nine years, but it's still better than the pay at AAR in Indy or the pay at TIMCO in North Carolina.

I don't understand why the base is not willing to have a separate agreement to maintain as much OH work as possible. I sympathize with the fact that the OH folks will bear a brunt of the job losses...
So why not negotiate a separate deal to perserve as many jobs as possible.

 

[Bob Owens]

Yet you have yet to touch on how many of those 4000 are A&P mechanics and the percentage that are related. Due to the structure of industrial unionism A&P mechanics are going to hit the street and related, while very important, are going to fill those slots. I cannot wait to see the company scramble to fill vacated machinist positions at TUL with the equivalent of OSM's.

He also ignores the fact that the LBO knocked the 4000 down to 2000 and through normal attrition AA would lose around 3000.

 

[2ndGENAMT]

The combined United Continental has approx. 9100 mechanics supporting their fleet and I don't believe they use OSMs.. Not sure what extent of outsourcing they have for heavy maintenance..

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203899504577129022155501022.html

 

[FWAAA]

The combined United Continental has approx. 9100 mechanics supporting their fleet and I don't believe they use OSMs.. Not sure what extent of outsourcing they have for heavy maintenance..

http://online.wsj.co...2155501022.html

All UA heavy airframe overhaul (D checks) are outsourced; UA still overhauls engines at SFO. CO outsources all D checks as well.

 

[2ndGENAMT]

That is what leaves me scratching my head.. Granted that 9100 probably includes facilities maintenance, if you combine AAs Title I & II it comes to about 11400 and a slighty smaller fleet so why does Horton want to cut so deeply into our maintenance headcount if it takes UA/CO 9100 with so much outsourcing?.?.

 

[FWAAA]

That is what leaves me scratching my head.. Granted that 9100 probably includes facilities maintenance, if you combine AAs Title I & II it comes to about 11400 and a slighty smaller fleet so why does Horton want to cut so deeply into our maintenance headcount if it takes UA/CO 9100 with so much outsourcing?.?.

According to UA, it had 8,516 "Technicians and Related" on 12/31/11 to maintain 701 mainline airplanes.

On 12/31/11, AA reported having 608 mainline airplanes.

If we adjust for the fleet size difference, AA has about 4,000 extra M&R compared to the combined UA/CO. Isn't that roughly the size of TULE and approximately the number of M&R let go in the term sheet?

 

[Bob Owens]

According to UA, it had 8,516 "Technicians and Related" on 12/31/11 to maintain 701 mainline airplanes.

On 12/31/11, AA reported having 608 mainline airplanes.

If we adjust for the fleet size difference, AA has about 4,000 extra M&R compared to the combined UA/CO. Isn't that roughly the size of TULE and approximately the number of M&R let go in the term sheet?

Fleet age has to be factored in as well.

 

[Bob Owens]

That is what leaves me scratching my head.. Granted that 9100 probably includes facilities maintenance, if you combine AAs Title I & II it comes to about 11400 and a slighty smaller fleet so why does Horton want to cut so deeply into our maintenance headcount if it takes UA/CO 9100 with so much outsourcing?.?.

He doesn't, he just wants us ti think he does in order to get us to agree to work for somewhere between MRO and airline wages.