Temporary Injunction against USAPA filed today

[700UW]

Pilots can do whatever they want to do with their assets...The lawsuit was not against them but the union who represents them..

If the union has to asses their members the pilots are liable for the damages, as they are the union.

And where did you get your law degree?

Go ask Sharon Levine, one of the top fraud and bankruptcy attorneys in the US who explained what it is.

 

[SparrowHawk]

Actually that is illegal, if they see you have transfered assets after a major lawsuit has been filed, its against the law and you will be subject to criminal charges with more financial penalties.

We went over this before and during when US filed Chapter 11. It's called fraudulent conveyance.

Well that's interesting because has a lawsuit been filed? Is US is seeking damages at this juncture? If not then there would be no fraudulent conveyance which was kind of my point. If you make your moves RIGHT NOW it's much harder to prove.

Plus do you really think US Airways and the Federal Government has the time, money or inclination to track down someone to enforce a civil judgement? This is why every pilot needs to talk to professionals! NOT internet wise guys like me. It's like the referee says at the beginning of a boxing match "Protect Yourself at ALL Times" now would be a time to heed that sage advice.

Here in the Upper Midwest we have a sorta junior Bernie Madoff. Similar crimes but not quite on the scales of Mr Madoff. Here however this turd is fighting the charges tooth and nail and the way things are going he is likely to get convicted but until all appeals are exhausted he's out of jail and could very well pass before he is sentenced. So while you are absolutely correct regarding the law, however how, when, where it's applied is very different.

 

[nic4us]

We had 10 write-ups on a ### the other morning (Now I am reluctant to put what plane I am on for fear of retribution). All I did is put what the F/As handed me on a sheet of paper into the FDML. I guess we are going to have to use our smart phones and photograph every broken item as a potiential defense in a lawsuit. I resent the westies and the company's assertation on this. The west and Tempe have sunk to the lowest of low with this issue; they are willing to overlook safety to keep the schedule going. Photo it and write it up...maybe a new lanyard slogan?

You resent the Westies and the company's assertion????

Are you for real ?? It seems you are saying that you personally have not engaged in any of the behavior of which usapa has been accused. Good, you got nothing to worry about. Fly safe!!

The company is not asking you to overlook safety to keep the schedule. The company is telling you if you support the unobtainable crusade usapa has embarked on, and you do it through illegal methods, the people charged with the employment of 32,000 employees are going to clip you like an ingrown toenail.

 

[700UW]

They said they were $400 Million in damages and yes it is the Federal Marshall's and local sheriffs are the ones by law that enforce judgements, go ask Bernie Madoff, and ask the NY Mets who are being sued for $1 billion and Madoff even deposed said the Mets had no idea of the ponzi scheme.

And if they sued for a TRO, there will be damages sought to finally kill of USAPA and its failed leadership.

You can appeal all you want, when they padlock your doors and seize your assets an appeal doesnt mean squat.

 

[Pi brat]

Could be you don't have the big picture or even a small torn corner of a poor copy of the big picture. All the pissed off pilots doing the worst job they could can't hold a candle to the piss poor job the management? of this company is doing.


Bob

Amen brother Bob!

Here's a story from....a friend, yeah a friend. At another airline, but it's similar to some cases here. B)

He was sch for a 17:54 eastern hub-western hub flt. Sch arr. western hub 19:17. Now it was an A32x, and the crew is supposed to be ready to board that airplane :35 min prior to dept. The A/C was towed to the gate :40 min prior to dept, so crew was supposed to board, check equip, brief in 5 min, except that the gate agent(only one on gate) didn't see the A/C at the gate until the captain pointed it out so she could move the jetway. With me? It gets better. So, on the A/C about :30 prior to sch and capt opens FDML to find that there are two open write ups! Yep, A/C sat on hardstand all day long with 2 open write ups. One of which was a biggie. Capt confers with dispatcher and dispatcher finds another A/C-at the other end of the airport. Everyone hike the eastern hub airport! Things are still okay though. There is a rare tailwind and capt and dispatcher agree to load extra fuel and fly a little fast, in keeping with the other airlines 1)safety 2) passenger comfort 3) SCHEDULE hierarchy, in order to make connections. Things go really well from there on out and they arrive at the gate in the western hub only about :20 min late! Great, right, the whole team working together for our customers. Nope, not so fast. No jetway driver. They block in at 19:43 and gate agent announces that no one with a 20:00 connection will make it. Not even the extra F/A that was to DH to XXX, because the flights were closed out :10 early.

It's a good thing that didn't happen at US Airways because someone would have been accused of a job action!!!!!!!!!

 

[Pi brat]

The company is not asking you to overlook safety to keep the schedule.

That this Court further order that the Defendants take all reasonable steps within
their power to prevent the aforesaid actions and to refrain from continuing the aforesaid actions
if commenced, including, but not limited to, the following:
a. Instructing all pilots represented by Defendant USAPA and employed by
Plaintiff to resume their normal working schedule and practices and
providing Plaintiff a copy of all such instructions;
b. Notifying all pilots represented by Defendant USAPA and employed by
Plaintiff, by the most expeditious means possible, of the issuance,
contents, and meaning of this Preliminary Injunction and providing
Plaintiff a copy of all such notices;
c. Including in such notice a directive from USAPA to US Airways’ pilots
not to engage in a concerted refusal to perform normal pilot operations,
including but not limited to, slow taxiing, writing up maintenance items,
calling in fatigued, delaying flights, refusing to answer a call from the
scheduling, refusing to fly an aircraft that meets legal requirements for
flight, or refusing to accept voluntary or overtime flying, and to cease and
desist all such activity and to cease and desist all exhortations or
communications encouraging same, upon pain of fine, suspension, or other
sanction by USAPA;
Case 3:11-cv-00371-RJC -DCK Document 1 Filed 07/29/11 Page 41 of 43
- 42 -
d. Posting the notice described above on Defendant USAPA’s internet
websites and providing Plaintiff a copy of the notices;
e. Including the contents of such notice on all recorded telephone hotlines
under control of Defendants, until such time as the Court has acted on
Plaintiff’s Motion for a Permanent Injunction, and providing Plaintiff a
copy of all such messages; and
f. Distributing the contents of such notice through all non-public
communication systems maintained by Defendants, including any
telephone trees, text message lists, pilot-to-pilot communication systems,
or similar systems, and providing Plaintiff a copy of the notices.
3. That this Court further order that the Defendants are prohibited from including in
such notices (or distributing contemporaneously with such notices) any statements that are
intended or could reasonably be interpreted to mean that pilots should continue to engage in the
previously-described conduct notwithstanding the Preliminary Injunction including:
a. Any assertion that the Preliminary Injunction does not prohibit individual
pilots from making voluntary decisions to engage in such actions; and
b. Any explanation of circumstances in which it would be appropriate or
necessary for pilots to engage in such actions prohibited by the
Preliminary Injunction.
4. That this Court further order that Defendants report to the Court by 5 p.m. on the
day immediately following issuance of the Preliminary Injunction, by sworn affidavit, the
methods used to effect the notice described above to all USAPA-represented pilots, and furnish
Case 3:

 

[toganoflex]

Could be you don't have the big picture or even a small torn corner of a poor copy of the big picture. All the pissed off pilots doing the worst job they could can't hold a candle to the piss poor job the management? of this company is doing.


Bob

Are your referring to a work action Bob?

 

[toganoflex]

Management had the ability to solve or even prevent this years ago! Those chose not to. They are reaping what they have sown.

So did the east pilots.

And they're paying for it with LOA 93. Years and years of LOA 93.

 

[Pi brat]

Are your referring to a work action Bob?

Are you accusing US management of a work action?

 

[SparrowHawk]

They said they were $400 Million in damages and yes it is the Federal Marshall's and local sheriffs are the ones by law that enforce judgements, go ask Bernie Madoff, and ask the NY Mets who are being sued for $1 billion and Madoff even deposed said the Mets had no idea of the ponzi scheme.

And if they sued for a TRO, there will be damages sought to finally kill of USAPA and its failed leadership.

You can appeal all you want, when they padlock your doors and seize your assets an appeal doesnt mean squat.

Here's the thing though. The $$$ amount is what drives the level of enforcement activity. Truth is if you've ever gotten a divorce, you've hidden assets from the ex and had little if any consequence even if caught. Now based upon your knowledge of this, it would play out this way:

US Airways is granted an Injunction
US Airways is Granted a permanent Injunction and sues USAPA for Damages to the tune of $400 million
US Wins a substantial damage award of say $300 Million
US begins collection proceedings against USAPA
USAPA in turn Assesses their members (Those employed at time suit was filed correct?)
USAPA then initiates collection proceedings against members who can't don't or won't pay

That would mean if I were a pilot I would have to evade a bankrupt union, with no substantial assets available to pursue me and however many others or do I have this wrong? If I'm correct, I'd be moving assets tomorrow because USAPA, paper tiger that it is doesn't have the money to chase me and several hundred others. Not trying break stones here I am really curious

 

[Pi brat]

So did the east pilots.

And they're paying for it with LOA 93. Years and years of LOA 93.

I've done the math and captain on LOA 93 is better than F/O on the Kirby, and I don't have to fly with guys like you! That's worth a small fortune!

As I told hp retiree, I disagreed with the majority opinion on the path to take, but I can not imagine a contract that the company would have given that would have made me vote for a contract with the Nic in it.

 

[toganoflex]

I'm sure the pilots can explain it better than me but when you have 600 plus take-offs a day you're going to have a line of aircraft waiting to take-off. And with the banks that the company has created....that line can get long.

The company has created this hot mess.

OK idiots, I'll type slowly - again.

If you have a one hour taxi for a given flight at a given time of day and you do this for a certain period of time you establish a trend.

When you start seeing consistent and sustained deviations over a period of time you have a deviation of the norm.

Its pretty easy to pick out.

Now quit being stupid.

 

[wasone]

They said they were $400 Million in damages and yes it is the Federal Marshall's and local sheriffs are the ones by law that enforce judgements, go ask Bernie Madoff, and ask the NY Mets who are being sued for $1 billion and Madoff even deposed said the Mets had no idea of the ponzi scheme.

And if they sued for a TRO, there will be damages sought to finally kill of USAPA and its failed leadership.

You can appeal all you want, when they padlock your doors and seize your assets an appeal doesnt mean squat.

You know as a crew member I think most of us have always(even before ANY mergers) tried do a good job safely, cover our butts and be decent people,but if crap continues there is going be alot of us out of a job and aviation jobs are hard to find now. This sounds more and more like The late great Eastern "We're to big we're never shut down"Airlines.

 

[toganoflex]

I think our management? is trying to blame things on others that is their fault.


Regards,


Bob

And this coming from an east guy.

Your whole career at US Airways has been about blaming everyone else.

 

[toganoflex]

Are you accusing US management of a work action?

No dumbass.

Try reading the entire post.