TWU/IAM Association Poll

[usairways_vote_NO]

There is zero, zip, zilch, nada and no chance you or anyone else will overrule ANY ruling that comes down from the NMB. Watch
 
 
Might as well add that AMFA has the same chance as above of winning an election and being certified. Just the messenger.

 

[WeAAsles]

They truth is you have zero, zip, zilch and nada chance of overturning a NMB representation certification.

 

[SIZE=x-large]Zero in other languages[/SIZE]​

​

Portuguese  :  zero
Italian     : nullità 
French      :  zéro
German      : null
Spanish     :  cero 
Danish, Indonesian  : nol
Dutch       : nul
Finnish     : nolla
Hungarian     ; zero
Norwegian   : null
Swedish        : noll

Words similar or closer to meaning of  zero  are  cipher,  aught,  nought, naught, not, nil, null, nothing, none.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

There is zero, zip, zilch, nada and no chance you or anyone else will overrule ANY ruling that comes down from the NMB. Watch
 
 
Might as well add that AMFA has the same chance as above of winning an election and being certified. Just the messenger.

 
And Again ...
 
You're RIGHT!  .... if they follow their rules as published.
 
If a vote on the alliance is held after a 30 day window allowing for the filing of an intervenor all per Section 19 of the NMB representational manual, I agree, there is  zero, zip, zilch and nada chance of overturning the NMB representation certification

 

[Bob Owens]

Maybe the power of the afl-cio is pushing for the alliance and therefore it WILL happen.

 

The AFL-CIO is not a governing body over member Unions, Unions come and go as they please such as the SEIU and the IBT, it does not meddle in the Internal affairs of Unions and only serves as a means where Unions can collectively assert political influence. Sure they may come out with a statement in support of the Association but thats only because the two members in order to gain credibility with their members asked them to and they are trying to capitalize on the common misperception of what the AFL-CIO really is. While they have certain guidelines as far as raids they have no means of enforcing them other than giving them back their per capita and telling them they are no longer in the federation. The fact is this deal flies in the face of Unionism, its a product of business unionism because its obvious that the intent of the structure has nothing to do with uniting the members, in fact it does the opposite. 

 

[MetalMover]

The AFL-CIO is not a governing body over member Unions, Unions come and go as they please such as the SEIU and the IBT, it does not meddle in the Internal affairs of Unions and only serves as a means where Unions can collectively assert political influence. Sure they may come out with a statement in support of the Association but thats only because the two members in order to gain credibility with their members asked them to and they are trying to capitalize on the common misperception of what the AFL-CIO really is. While they have certain guidelines as far as raids they have no means of enforcing them other than giving them back their per capita and telling them they are no longer in the federation. The fact is this deal flies in the face of Unionism, its a product of business unionism because its obvious that the intent of the structure has nothing to do with uniting the members, in fact it does the opposite. 

Trunks should have stayed out of it.
 
http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2013/04/iam-twu-agree-to-put-together-their-seniority-lists-by-date-of-hire-in-the-us-airways-american-airlines-merger.html/

 

[CMH_GSE]

And from that article, the truth about what is going on is mentioned in the very last sentence.

“Spending large sums of money from your organizations on combat that will not add a single unorganized worker to our ranks is truly unproductive.”

It's all about the dues and the continual flow of money to the internationals. It shouldn't be about "adding workers to the ranks" , it should be about what is best for the workers currently in the ranks.

 

[Vortilon]

AMFA is done.... Thanks for participatng

 
Really?  I have heard that same thing for my 29 years at AA now.  Stick to throwing bags, and take that d-bag weasles with you.

 

[WeAAsles]

Really?  I have heard that same thing for my 29 years at AA now.  Stick to throwing bags, and take that d-bag weasles with you.

Not to mention others who were hearing it for 22 years before you even started in the company. 51 years of trying in total seems like one hell of a pipe dream.

 

[WeAAsles]

And from that article, the truth about what is going on is mentioned in the very last sentence.

“Spending large sums of money from your organizations on combat that will not add a single unorganized worker to our ranks is truly unproductive.”

It's all about the dues and the continual flow of money to the internationals. It shouldn't be about "adding workers to the ranks" , it should be about what is best for the workers currently in the ranks.

I fundamentally feel that Unions should not fight other Unions. All it does is serve to weaken the labor movement as a whole and creates animosity between the groups that can and will absolutely be used by those who are out to dismantle the entire ideology of workers rights.

But what I do have a problem with in all honesty when it comes to the Association is Paragraph 5, Appendix A. I don't care for that piece in the slightest because the only thing that serves IMO is exactly that, making sure the dues are maintained for either side that may lose a proportionate amount of members in the future. "Maintaining the Ratio" Someone used the term "Horse Trading" in one of those back and forth letters a few months ago and this "could" wind up being the biggest form of horse trading there is?

That was the main issue that the new leadership of the TWU wanted to discuss with the IAM and hopefully since we now have a letter that they're moving forward that part has been modified or even scratched? Appendix B on the other hand is fair and should have been the only writing involved in the situation if either side loses "significant" members for whatever reasons in the future. 

Otherwise if the NMB does in fact rule that we need to vote on the Association and the choices are only between it and no Union, I will absolutely support the Association over the no union or even write in option. I don't think any write in option whoever people like will have much of a chance so why would I dilute the vote count and give the no union option a chance to gain any ground or traction, just in case. What other people want to do is their business, but that's my choice.   


 http://www.twu.org/Portals/0/TWU-IAM-Joint-Council.pdf

 

[WeAAsles]

Sure let's just keep on continuing to fight each other and meanwhile.

Washington, D.C. – Congressman Steve King released the following statement after introducing the National Right to Work Act, in the 114th Congress. The bill would repeal the provisions in federal law that make “forced dues” the default labor law of the country. This bill currently has 76 Original Cosponsors.

http://theiowarepublican.com/2015/king-introduces-national-right-to-work-act/

 

[CMH_GSE]

Weaasles :
"Otherwise if the NMB does in fact rule that we need to vote on the Association and the choices are only between it and no Union, I will absolutely support the Association over the no union or even write in option"


Talking about mechanic groups only here:
Just can't see an election that includes the association unless they can produce signed cards of at least 50% of the members.
There isn't any contract with said "association" to point to so there really isn't a valid "showing of interest" for anything other than the TWU at this point.
The total IAM membership doesn't equal 50% of total mechanics.

So unless someone comes forward with cards, it will probably be TWU , IF the rules are followed.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weaasles :
"Otherwise if the NMB does in fact rule that we need to vote on the Association and the choices are only between it and no Union, I will absolutely support the Association over the no union or even write in option"


Talking about mechanic groups only here:
Just can't see an election that includes the association unless they can produce signed cards of at least 50% of the members.
There isn't any contract with said "association" to point to so there really isn't a valid "showing of interest" for anything other than the TWU at this point.
The total IAM membership doesn't equal 50% of total mechanics.

So unless someone comes forward with cards, it will probably be TWU , IF the rules are followed.

I do understand your point CMH but the reality is that the TWU agreed to dual representation so the question is does the TWU as the governing body have the right to file and agree that an association is in the best interests of the members they represent?

The ruling whenever it finally comes by the NMB will be interesting to say the least.

 

[Bob Owens]

Sure let's just keep on continuing to fight each other and meanwhile.

Washington, D.C. – Congressman Steve King released the following statement after introducing the National Right to Work Act, in the 114th Congress. The bill would repeal the provisions in federal law that make “forced dues” the default labor law of the country. This bill currently has 76 Original Cosponsors.

http://theiowarepublican.com/2015/king-introduces-national-right-to-work-act/

And as Union leaders like Jim Little and Buffy conspire to remove accountability and Democracy from the process it only makes nut jobs like King more likely to succeed. Just think of what an easy argument against "forced dues" they can make when members are forced to pay dues for an Association they never voted for and are locked into for two years. 

 

[WeAAsles]

And as Union leaders like Jim Little and Buffy conspire to remove accountability and Democracy from the process it only makes nut jobs like King more likely to succeed. Just think of what an easy argument against "forced dues" they can make when members are forced to pay dues for an Association they never voted for and are locked into for two years. 

Hard to argue against this point I have to say. Being honest.

 

[CMH_GSE]

I do understand your point CMH but the reality is that the TWU agreed to dual representation so the question is does the TWU as the governing body have the right to file and agree that an association is in the best interests of the members they represent?
The ruling whenever it finally comes by the NMB will be interesting to say the least.

Everything I've read says there has to be a "showing of interest" to be considered.

The TWU leadership, by themselves, without a showing of interest by the membership that they now want to change the representation dynamic, does not have the authority to make any "agreement" to dual representation. That is what the NMB does, and they are governed by rules that lay out what a valid "showing of interest" is.

The ONLY valid "showing of interest" in the mechanic case is TWU members under contract number over 50% of the total mechanic numbers.
No other group approaches that, to date.

The more I looked into this, the more black and white it seems to me, with no gray area at all.

All of that said, I can't for the life of me figure out why the NMB needs 6 months to comprehend their own guidelines.