TWU's reputation with other unions on property

[Bob Owens]

You're the one who claimed to have read letters from both the APA & APFA stating support for the TWU against an AMFA or AMP raid. With regard to your comment on FA wages and benefits, again, I'll call BS on you. My wife is a FA, and up until this year - I used her medical - as it was exactly half the cost the TWU negotiated for us AMTs. As far as FA pay vs the industry - always in the top 3. AA AMTs; on the other hand, DEAD LAST - IN NOT ONLY PAY, But everything else as well!

I believe that its true that the other unions at AA signed a letter supporting the TWU. The IBT signed one as well, yet now they are raiding.
Don't know if they asked their members first.


The TWU has done a fairly good job with Fleet, Stores, Dispatch etc. In some cases those members remain close to their peers and most are well above USAIR. Mechanics are a completely different story, we are behind everybody in total compensation, even USAIR which has better Vacation, Holidays, work rules and OT rules than we do. The week of vacation and Holiday pay alone puts them thousands of dollars ahead of us per year. You are right, we are DEAD LAST.

 

[Bogey]

Where in my post did I state that any of the other unions at AA give a crap about what union the AMTs at AA have? Try to comprehend.

In fact, most pilots I run into, when the subject comes up - ask "when are you mechanics gonna get rid of the TWU.

There in your post.

 

[767 mechanic]

Iceman is just another twu stooge. AMPs cons was based on the pilots cons. So why would they oppose AMP? AMFA is a craft union,just like the APA and APFA. I remember when the APA and APFA had a march on headquarters. When jim little showed up and attempted to speak they booed him at the podium. Sounds like a good working relationship to me right!!!!!!!!!!!!! Jim was doing the companies work for them at this time so he didnt inform the membership to show up.

 

[CIO]

I believe that its true that the other unions at AA signed a letter supporting the TWU. The IBT signed one as well, yet now they are raiding.
Don't know if they asked their members first.


The TWU has done a fairly good job with Fleet, Stores, Dispatch etc. In some cases those members remain close to their peers and most are well above USAIR. Mechanics are a completely different story, we are behind everybody in total compensation, even USAIR which has better Vacation, Holidays, work rules and OT rules than we do. The week of vacation and Holiday pay alone puts them thousands of dollars ahead of us per year. You are right, we are DEAD LAST.

Bob;

Could part of the problem be the lack of negotiation skills and your demeanor have anything to do with us receiving less pay as you continue to claim? Keep working on dividing us and it will continue.


In Solidarity;
CIO

 

[TWU informer]

Bob;

Could part of the problem be the lack of negotiation skills and your demeanor have anything to do with us receiving less pay as you continue to claim? Keep working on dividing us and it will continue.


In Solidarity;
CIO

Please explain this statement also, I don't understand your point?

 

[Vortilon]

In fact, most pilots I run into, when the subject comes up - ask "when are you mechanics gonna get rid of the TWU.

There in your post.

What does the phrase "when the subject comes up" mean? Nothing more.

 

[Vortilon]

I believe that its true that the other unions at AA signed a letter supporting the TWU. The IBT signed one as well, yet now they are raiding.
Don't know if they asked their members first.


The TWU has done a fairly good job with Fleet, Stores, Dispatch etc. In some cases those members remain close to their peers and most are well above USAIR. Mechanics are a completely different story, we are behind everybody in total compensation, even USAIR which has better Vacation, Holidays, work rules and OT rules than we do. The week of vacation and Holiday pay alone puts them thousands of dollars ahead of us per year. You are right, we are DEAD LAST.

Bob, really - why pander to these a$$ clowns? No argument on the TWU taking care of Sim Techs & Dispatch. Fleet Service has always remained in the top 3 in pay and benefits. Then, there is the AMTs at AA - the bane of the TWU. An anti AMFA letter from the APA or APFA - in support of the TWU - why haven't we seen it?

 

[TWU informer]

Now I thought about this awhile, it just so happens that the TWU worshippers who claim the "other unions" on AA property love the TWU may very well be accurate. I mean think about, having the most docile union in the industry on the property, and one that always gives away the farm simply leaves more for the other work groups. Who wouldn't love that? If I was a Pilot or Flight Attendant I would love the TWU also because they always leave behind a piece of the pie.

 

[767 mechanic]

Looking at it that way I would have to agree with you and so would my bank account.

 

[Realityck]

#22
Vortilon
Posted Today, 08:06 AM
Veteran

Registered Member

858 posts


Bob Owens, on 11 March 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

I believe that its true that the other unions at AA signed a letter supporting the TWU. The IBT signed one as well, yet now they are raiding.
Don't know if they asked their members first.


The TWU has done a fairly good job with Fleet, Stores, Dispatch etc. In some cases those members remain close to their peers and most are well above USAIR. Mechanics are a completely different story, we are behind everybody in total compensation, even USAIR which has better Vacation, Holidays, work rules and OT rules than we do. The week of vacation and Holiday pay alone puts them thousands of dollars ahead of us per year. You are right, we are DEAD LAST.

Bob, really - why pander to these a$$ clowns? No argument on the TWU taking care of Sim Techs & Dispatch. Fleet Service has always remained in the top 3 in pay and benefits. Then, there is the AMTs at AA - the bane of the TWU. An anti AMFA letter from the APA or APFA - in support of the TWU - why haven't we seen it?


Not accurate. Neither AA pilots, flight attendants, or ramp are in the top three in the industry in pay and, at present, the pilots are even further behind the Delta/UAL average than we are, depending on equipment. As the APA and APFA will tell you, they will have as much if not more to gain by the industry standard snap up in 2015 as the mechanics. As a general matter, with the exception of those TWU groups which ratified agreements before the AA bankruptcy (MCT and Instructors) AA work groups are behind those work groups at the other majors which have not been in bankruptcy or have been able to negotiate and ratify contracts since their companies emerged from bankruptcy. AA pilots are still significantly ahead of US Airways pilots in pay because, unlike US Airways mechanics and flight attendants, they have not negotiated a post bankruptcy contract due, I believe, to the six year dispute over seniority between the east and west sides. As for the letters of support from APA and APFA that the TWU has received over the years against AMFA and AMP, they have been posted on this board many times. If you need to review them again I will try to dig them up and post them again.

 

[JAFI]

The bad blood with the senior F/As has nothing to do with the TWUs mechanic representation. TWU once represented the F/As, until they voted them out. F/As as a whole, not those married or dating mechanics, pretty much could give two fucks about mechanics let alone mechanic representation. They use us for chum to bloody the waters and keep the company from feeding on themselves. Same for pilots.

The only people who care about us is....US. Problem is we are too busy tearing each other apart to do anything but be chum. Even the raider union representatives tear us apart the minute you disagree with anything but their dogma. #### em all.

 

[Vortilon]

#22
Vortilon
Posted Today, 08:06 AM
Veteran

Registered Member

858 posts


Bob Owens, on 11 March 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

I believe that its true that the other unions at AA signed a letter supporting the TWU. The IBT signed one as well, yet now they are raiding.
Don't know if they asked their members first.


The TWU has done a fairly good job with Fleet, Stores, Dispatch etc. In some cases those members remain close to their peers and most are well above USAIR. Mechanics are a completely different story, we are behind everybody in total compensation, even USAIR which has better Vacation, Holidays, work rules and OT rules than we do. The week of vacation and Holiday pay alone puts them thousands of dollars ahead of us per year. You are right, we are DEAD LAST.

Bob, really - why pander to these a$$ clowns? No argument on the TWU taking care of Sim Techs & Dispatch. Fleet Service has always remained in the top 3 in pay and benefits. Then, there is the AMTs at AA - the bane of the TWU. An anti AMFA letter from the APA or APFA - in support of the TWU - why haven't we seen it?


Not accurate. Neither AA pilots, flight attendants, or ramp are in the top three in the industry in pay and, at present, the pilots are even further behind the Delta/UAL average than we are, depending on equipment. As the APA and APFA will tell you, they will have as much if not more to gain by the industry standard snap up in 2015 as the mechanics. As a general matter, with the exception of those TWU groups which ratified agreements before the AA bankruptcy (MCT and Instructors) AA work groups are behind those work groups at the other majors which have not been in bankruptcy or have been able to negotiate and ratify contracts since their companies emerged from bankruptcy. AA pilots are still significantly ahead of US Airways pilots in pay because, unlike US Airways mechanics and flight attendants, they have not negotiated a post bankruptcy contract due, I believe, to the six year dispute over seniority between the east and west sides. As for the letters of support from APA and APFA that the TWU has received over the years against AMFA and AMP, they have been posted on this board many times. If you need to review them again I will try to dig them up and post them again.

By all means, dig em up. Nice spin on the AA AMT pay vs the industry. Your statement regarding the other work groups pay and benefits at AA vs their industry peers - loses any merit with the phrase "at present". I'm talking about since 2003.

 

[CIO]

"Divide and Concur". Is the normal theme for the likes of Amfa!!! They are Managements best tool at suppressing our wages and benefits in the industry. The best money corporations have spent!!! Now we have the Teamsters doing the samething.

Are they our savor or our demise?

In Solidarity,

CIO

 

[767 mechanic]

Its a good thing that you are retired because you would clearly need to be drug tested after that lie.

 

[Bob Owens]

By all means, dig em up. Nice spin on the AA AMT pay vs the industry. Your statement regarding the other work groups pay and benefits at AA vs their industry peers - loses any merit with the phrase "at present". I'm talking about since 2003.

Typical spin from TeAAm Videtich note how with the pilots he doesnt want to just look at "all in top pay", he says we have to look at where they are in their career, OK fair enough but with mechanics he doesnt want to use the same criteria. What is the lowest starting wage in the M&R contract book and how does that compare to our peers? What about guys who were knocked down to OSMs? Look at our vacation, Holidays and sick time, thats all compensation but he doesnt want to look at that. He claims we saved thousands of jobs yet ignores the fact that the TWU says we should be down to 6325 in M&R by 2017, thats less than four years from now. Not all that reduction will be from attrition, thats why they took away system protection. We are talking about an approximate 50% headcount loss from when they filed for BK till the contract becomes amendable in 2018, could be more. Like I said why do you think they took away system protection?