Us Airways And United Airlines Merger Attempt

[Winglet]

With the price of oil, it's unclear if any legacy carrier can survive, especially the bankruupt companies.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

[post="253557"][/post]​

All the legacies will be bankrupt if conditions don't improve quickly and soon.

 

[deltawatch]

If oil prices remain over 50 dollars a barrel change for the ENTIRE US economy is coming fast. The transportation sector will see it first.

BUY GOLD!

 

[usfliboi]

Hey 700 where did that arbitration get you???? You union gave up the rt to be compensated !!!!!!!!! NOW WHAAAT? BTW on a somber note.. when is your job outsourced?

 

[speedbird86]

If oil prices remain over 50 dollars a barrel change for the ENTIRE US economy is coming fast. The transportation sector will see it first.

BUY GOLD!

[post="253587"][/post]​

You got that right. :unsure:

 

[700UW]

It is a $15 Million claim in Bankruptcy court.

 

[mweiss]

US & US have tried to merge 2 times.

And the fact that they failed twice might suggest something.

US chairman David Bronner has said in four public interviews that he is interested in buying UA assets if it makes sense for US.

Of course he is. Anyone would be interested in buying UA assets if it makes sense for them. Buying a company's assets is not the same thing as buying the company.

US & UA have a domestic code share relationship, both companies are in the Star alliance, and both companies have an important business relationship with Air Wisconsin.

UA and DL used to have a domestic code share relationship. Should DL be buying UA instead? US and AA used to have a domestic code share relationship. Should AA be buying US? These relationships are relatively fluid and relatively easy to change.

Ben Baldanza told a colleague of mine about US’ interest in being the surviving business entity

Oh, this one's rich. Do you honestly think that high level executives at UA aren't interested in UA being the "surviving business entity" in any merger in which they are a part?

During the past three weeks three separate airline observers have indicated in news media reports the parties would make a good fit or “industry insidersâ€￾ are talking about another corporate transaction with the buzz for people “to watch for US Airways and United Airlines to resurrect an attempt at a merger.â€￾

Perhaps these three observers spend too much time on a particular Internet bulletin board. :huh:

Glenn Tilton recently said the best option for UA is to merge.

Because it is. However, the best option for UA is not to merge with US.

Bruce Lakefield told me a couple of weeks ago that both companies are currently "in play".

Because they are. US has only been "in play" for about five years, in case your memory has been fading. But that hardly means that US is in a position to be acquiring a popsicle stand, let alone an operation the size, complexity, and, yes, cost of UA. US has been, and remains, in play to be purchased, not to be going on a buying spree.

The only thing your right about is that “neither of them has any cash, the industry is still losing billions of dollars a year, and oil prices are near record levels again.â€￾

In other words, "I'm about to buy that $50M house. The only thing holding me back is that I have no money, am in deficit spending, my wages are falling, and my costs are rising. But I'll get that house soon, just you wait and see!" You make it sound like those facts you outline there are trivial, when in fact they are the key reasons this deal won't happen the way you describe. Now, I wouldn't be shocked to see an entity like Texas Pacific (note the same initials as Transformation Plan...coincidence?) buying both airlines. Who's the "surviving entity" in that world?

 

[North by Northwest]

Oil will effect every aspect of ones life. The transportation of food, clothing, medicine. you name it. If it has to be transported, the cost will increase. Too bad the Bush Family and their cozy relationship with the Saudis and the Kuwaitis can't strike a deal. Let's see, American working men and women pay (from every pay check) to keep them safe while they bank BILLIONS in oil revenue at inflated prices. Damn, those dummies are smart! The Auto industry, and Airline industry will be destroyed...period. On the flip side. These prices may FORCE the American public to finally wake up and get serious about public transport, alternative fuels. The surviving airlines will be the ones with the most advanced hedging systems...end of story.

 

[North by Northwest]

"Glenn Tilton recently said the best option for UA is to merge." I think this man has finally realized that this is NOT the oil industry. and he would like to find the fastest way OUT. The absolut worst thing UAL could have done in a time like this was put a non airline person in charge of saving their life. Their board should be put on triel for murder. No doubt in my mind that had they not ousted Edwards, Ual would be sitting pretty bout now.

 

[funguy2]

Funguy2:

Maybe you should try to get some inside information, instead of being an "armchair" internet analyst, who only attempts to "shoot the messenger". You and Vaughn Cordle would make a good pair if you worked together.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

[post="253521"][/post]​

Oh... Brother... Hello Kettle, I am Pot.

 

[funguy2]

Lark:

It has nothing to do with being challenged, it has to do with trying to discredit the messenger because you do not like the message. Everything I write is true and if I make a mistake i admit it.

Name one time YOU admitted YOU were wrong? I can think of none... But I can think of several times when you were proven wrong by other posters.

People love to come on here and discredit my M&A talk, just like Funguy2, but they are not talking with the parties or key sources close to the discussions.

For one, when you have an opinion I share (usually for very different reasons), I support it. I have done so in just the past week.

For example I said, "US & US have tried to merge 2 times." In response Funguy2 said, "Only one offer was ever made... Maybe they have talked before or since, but nothing has become of it. Just because I talk to a realtor does not mean I tried to buy a house."

In regard to Funguy 2, he is clearly wrong, but loves to try and dispute my message. It's really sort of funny to have me start a thread and Fungy2 and otehr "naysyers" attempt to dispute the facts.

For example, in 1995 UA made its first attempt to acquire US. Was a formal financial offer made? No, but Gerry Greenwald openly entertained the idea in the news media and held meetings with Seth Schofield's team and every US ALPA leader, trying to persuade US Airways to agree to a deal under labor's terms, since UA was an ESOP controlled company.

The terms or show stopper was UA's union's demanding super seniority with a pre-nuptial agreement, no furlough protection for UA employees, and about 20% of US employees furloughed as conditions for the deal to proceed.

US and its employees said "no thanks". Did US & UA try to merge in 1995 and then again about 5 years later? Absolutely, but Funguy2 tries to twist reality into his own thinking to try and discredit the author, which does not work.

Several comments here...

Your normal discourse suggests that US Airways and UAL have spoken about a merger SINCE the official 2000 merger attempt. You discuss, often and at length, how various people, including Seigel, Lakefield, Bronner, and Tilton, are discussing a merger... None of those people were around in 1995.

So now we have 1995, 2000, and post 9/11/01... That would be three attempts by your counting, isn't that right?

Regardless... The FACTS stand that only one official offer for UAL to acquire US Airways was EVER made. There has yet to EVER be an offer from US Airways to acquire UAL. Period. You can spin and speculate on who is talking to whom. But those are the FACTS as they stand today.

[Added Later]

By the way. I may or may not have inside information. You do not know. Why? Because a person with insider information is in a trusted position. Revealing insider information actually puts whatever the information is about in jeopardy. If TWA's line pilots (or managers or whoever) posted information about AMR swooping in and acquiring TWA's assets on internet web sites, don't you think that management at CAL, DAL, NWAC, UAL, LUV, AAI, JBLU, and others would have read about this and considered trying to undermine the deal, or acquire TWA for themselves? Therefore, whatever insider information I may or may not have, I would never reveal on an internet chat board.

Again... If I were in Seigel's, Baldenza's, or Lakefield's shoes, I would be using a line pilot whom continues to 1) bug me by asking constantly about what I am working on and 2) post what I say verbatum on various internet websites, I would use that line pilot to spread the message of my choosing, which may or may not be the truth.

 

[whlinder]

guys, guys, remember we are just armchair internet analysts, therefore our thoughts and opinions mean nothing. 🙄 If we invent conversations with high level management in our heads to support our ideas, then what we say can be treated as the gospel. But until then, our thoughts mean little, just slightly more than the opinion of someone who is allowed to operate commerical airplanes yet does not reside in reality.

 

[cws818]

As an aside, I thought the codeshare was more than just domestic, with US putting its code on UA's transatlantic and transpacific flights. Did this change?

[post="253511"][/post]​

It does extend to international. On the transatlantic side, UA codeshares with US to certain destinations out of PHL, and US with UA on some of its routes as well.

 

[UseYourHead]

I agree Fly.

At this point....who cares? If it can work together, than that's how it should be. Our pay and work rules are pretty similar, don't discount it. Besides, Lufthansa has a LOT to lose if both partners left the market....so they could be the financial backer.

[post="253231"][/post]​

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

guys, guys, remember we are just armchair internet analysts, therefore our thoughts and opinions mean nothing.   🙄   If we invent conversations with high level management in our heads to support our ideas, then what we say can be treated as the gospel.  But until then, our thoughts mean little, just slightly more than the opinion of someone who is allowed to operate commerical airplanes yet does not reside in reality.

[post="253641"][/post]​

Wait hold on you forgot we have one in our mist that is "talking with the parties or key sources close to the discussions" We are lucky he is so deeply involved and such an insider. It is amazing he is allowed to post all that sensitive information illegally for us. Too bad it just never pans out.

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

Don't ask me why but I really like this post. I cringe when we hear "My Sources" or one of A320's comments regarding "Senior Management told me".

Big Freaking Deal! I speak to someone in CCY once or twice a week on some matter. That certainly doesn't make me any more knowledgable than anyone else about things within US Airways.

  We all come from different places, Pilot, ramp/utility, Flight Attendent and lastly a customer.  That's what makes this a fun place to hang out instead of watching mindless sit coms like Will & Grace.

[post="255132"][/post]​

Let me make you cringe a few more time there Pineybob. I agree I liked that post of whlinder's too and your SEC comment. Oh I know you don't care what I like or not but I am free to post it anyway. That being said...

To bad you had to ruin your post with your own plug just like 320's on the very next line boosting of your supposedly semi weekly talks with wigs at CCY.

You left out Customer service and mechanic examples (and other groups) of having strong opinions on this board too.

No mindless Will and Grace for you you rather watch the mindful Howard Stern show.