US cuts all PIT-Florida flights

EyeInTheSky

Veteran
Dec 2, 2003
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Pittsburgh
Stupid people in Phoenix...just give the business to Southwest. Doofuses...

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08249/909608-28.stm

US Airways cuts nonstop flights to Florida
Friday, September 05, 2008
By Mark Belko, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
US Airways isn't finished cutting flights in Pittsburgh just yet.

Starting Jan. 5, the airline will eliminate all nonstop service to Florida, one of the most popular destinations from Pittsburgh International Airport, as it seeks to reduce capacity in light of high fuel prices.

Gone will be 11 weekly nonstop flights to Orlando (one to two a day), seven a week to Fort Lauderdale (one a day), and six a week to Tampa. Next year, US Airways travelers will have to connect through Philadelphia or Charlotte, N.C., to get to Florida.

With the decision, US Airways "is literally handing the competition business," said Bradley D. Penrod, Allegheny County Airport Authority executive director.

Orlando is the top destination for travelers from Pittsburgh, Tampa is eighth, Fort Lauderdale is ninth, and Fort Myers is 15th. Southwest Airlines, AirTran Airways and USA 3000 will continue to provide nonstop flights to Florida.

In fact, AirTran will be adding nonstop trips four to five times a week to Fort Lauderdale, Tampa and Fort Myers Oct. 7. All three convert to daily nonstop service Nov. 20. Fort Lauderdale will get a second daily nonstop flight in February.

Although AirTran said the flights were in the works before US Airways decided to eliminate nonstop service, Mr. Penrod said the pending cuts "probably helped accelerate it some."

He said the new AirTran trips serve to blunt the impact of the US Airways' cuts.

"They've stuck with Pittsburgh," he said of AirTran. "The region has supported them, and they acknowledged that by adding service when others like US Airways are cutting it. I take that as a very good sign."

Tad Hutcheson, AirTran vice president of marketing and sales, said the carrier could add more flights depending on demand.

"Of course, we'll watch passenger demand. As more passengers flock to AirTran Airways, we'll add more flights and more seats. Hopefully, we'll pick up a lot of those passengers who used to fly US Airways," he said.

The US Airways' decision comes in the wake of its elimination this week of all service to Harrisburg and Richmond, Va., from Pittsburgh and cuts in nonstop flights to Los Angeles and San Francisco, leaving only one a day to each of those cities.

As with those moves, US Airways spokesman Morgan Durrant linked the Florida cutbacks to a 3 percent to 5 percent reduction in capacity the airline is undertaking to offset staggering fuel costs.

"It's one sector we found where we could reduce the capacity," he said. "We know it's not going to be painless. We know it's valued."

Asked how US Airways would compete with other airlines offering nonstop service, Mr. Durrant replied, "This is one area where we will have to do the best we can."

The reductions are the latest in a series of retreats from Pittsburgh that US Airways began shortly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. At one time it had more than 600 daily nonstop flights from Pittsburgh. This month, that's down to 58.

But two aviation analysts said the Florida moves aren't surprising given the financial crunch precipitated by fuel prices.

Local analyst Bill Lauer said travelers shouldn't view the latest cuts as denigrating to Pittsburgh. He said there was a "need to take capacity down. It's got to come from somewhere."

"A lot of US Airways' post-9/11 system planning has been seen, to some extent unfairly, by folks in this locale as a slap to the face of the region. Whatever you might think of the original decision to dehub Pittsburgh, I don't think what they're talking about now has anything to do with that."

While US Airways will end nonstop service to Florida cities, Mr. Lauer believes it still will be able to maintain the bulk of its traveler base to those destinations.

Darryl Jenkins, a Virginia-based airline industry consultant who has followed US Airways closely, said he was surprised the airline didn't cut the service sooner.

"In a normal year they would have. This is what we call an abnormal year, perhaps the most abnormal year of my life," he said. "This is the worst operating environment I've ever seen."

He called the end of the nonstop flights "a good move."

"It's kind of a very reasonable thing to do. I actually think it's remotely predictable. When they pulled down Pittsburgh as a hub, they began routing flights elsewhere. Their thinking is people will still get the service; they'll just have to make a stop," he said.

He doesn't think US Airways will lose much sleep over travelers it might lose to other airlines.

"I doubt they care because it's probably passengers they couldn't make money on. If AirTran or Southwest can make money on them, God bless them," he said.

Southwest currently offers three to four nonstop trips a day to Orlando and two a day to Tampa. Spokeswoman Whitney Eichinger said the airline has no plans to add service in response to the US Airways' decision.

"We do have plenty of service there to Florida and we will continue to operate that," she said.

As of July, in the latest statistics available from the airport authority, USA 3000 offered four flights a week to Fort Lauderdale and Fort Myers and three a week to St. Petersburg.
 
US really thinks they can do this and people will connect.

They did this because of Airtran and Southwest. US simply cannot compete in markets where it's not the only player.

If Southwest wanted to do the industry a favor, it would start around 20x/day from CLT to it's biggest destinations. Game. Set. Match.

What I want to know from the sandfleas is what markets do they actually think this move is going to work (retreat from "leisure")?
 
Another move to show how truly stupid this management is...that's right, let's cut flights that are ABSOLUTELY PACKED and connect these people through PHL when they could get on a competitor and get there in less than 1/2 the time for most likely less money-----uh, huh--we won't lose their business. Do they think about what to say before opening their mouths ??? never mind, I just answered my own question.
 
As much as we all hate to see these cuts, we all know that packed flights don't always mean they are profitable. This is just about always the case with Fla. flights anyway. A few years ago (pre 9/11), we had a daily flight to MCO that ran full on a regular basis. A marketing rep told us that they needed a 110% L/F to break even in this market, and we had no competion from SWA or AirTran. Just about all of us in the station asked why the company didn't try to raise to fares to a profitable level, and we were told that the passengers wouldn't be willing to pay any more. It would have made more sense to make an attempt to rasie the fares, and see if the loads dropped off as a result, especially with no direct competition.... :blink:
 
What makes you think SWA will just flood the PIT market.? They haven't exactly built a fortress in PIT. Face it, PIT is dead. If SW wanted to build it up, they would. There are PLENTY of gates. And many of those so called "packed" a/c are on e190's...a whole 99 seats.
 
Stupid people in Phoenix...just give the business to Southwest. Doofuses...

Next year, US Airways travelers will have to connect through Philadelphia or Charlotte, N.C., to get to Florida.

"Next year, former US Airways travelers will be flying nonstop to Florida on Airtran or Southwest."
 
My two cents on this subject. There are 5 weekday freqs DCA-MCO and 4 DCA-TPA. While DCA has much higher demand due to all the connection options in DCA from places like BUF/PVD/MHT/ALB etc I would think keeping 1 PIT-MCO and 1 PIT-TPA and reducing DCA-MCO from 5 to 4 and DCA-TPA from 4 to 3 would result in full flights out of PIT and an even higher LF and yield out of DCA by reducing excess seats. Lots of empty gates in PIT, no empty gates in DCA. Nothing against DCA and I know I don't have the whole picture. And I wonder how many newspapers would carry the negatvie story about US reducing DCA-MCO from 5 to 4?

Again just my two cents.

LGA777
 
If this move allows US to move equipment to more profitable, higher yield flying (is there still such a thing?), then I am all for it! Why should we fly full flights around with trash yields because we must compete with Airtran? If marketing is able to utilize the equipment in a higher yielding market, bravo! WN has already said, many times, that they feel their current PIT service is "appropriate" (although they cut here and there quite often)... And, with the current fuel crisis, I just don't see Airtran flooding the PIT market with 40 flights a day: WN didn't, (after many "experts" said it was coming! :lol:) why would Airtran? And, you feel that people will just be "flocking" to Airtran for nonstop flights? Probably, but don't kid yourselves: the leisure crowd will "flock" to the cheapest fare, even if it means a stop in CLT.

I'm surprised these flights held on as long as they did.
 
Another move to show how truly stupid this management is...that's right, let's cut flights that are ABSOLUTELY PACKED and connect these people through PHL when they could get on a competitor and get there in less than 1/2 the time for most likely less money-----


With no offense meant to PIT, a city I've always loved, US Airways has shunned two of the biggest markets from which people travel to Florida -- New York and Boston -- for years. In the meantime, JetBlue and Airtran can't add Florida non-stops from those big airports fast enough, while Southwest picks up the traffic from MHT, PVD, BDL, ISP, etc.



As much as we all hate to see these cuts, we all know that packed flights don't always mean they are profitable. This is just about always the case with Fla. flights anyway. A few years ago (pre 9/11), we had a daily flight to MCO that ran full on a regular basis. A marketing rep told us that they needed a 110% L/F to break even in this market, and we had no competion from SWA or AirTran. Just about all of us in the station asked why the company didn't try to raise to fares to a profitable level, and we were told that the passengers wouldn't be willing to pay any more. It would have made more sense to make an attempt to rasie the fares, and see if the loads dropped off as a result, especially with no direct competition.... :blink:


Management has been bleating this same thing for years; "We don't make any money on flights to Florida..."

Which raises the obvious question, "Then why do you even bother to sell tickets to Florida?" To keep people from flying on Delta (and letting Delta lose the money)? That would be like Ford selling an F-150 for less than it cost to build it, just to keep a Joe Sixpack from buying a Chevy or Dodge truck. And management has always claimed that if they raised the fares, everybody would go fly on the other airlines.

Really? Try walking up to any other airline ticket counter the Friday before Presidents Day or the day before Thanksgiving and saying, "I don't like US Airways' fare. Give me a ticket to Orlando on your airline." For that matter, try making a reservation from BOS to MCO today for next February, and see how many empty flights you have to pick from.

As far as people not paying a higher fare? Baloney. They will. They want to go to Florida. They've already promised their overindulged, spoiled little brats that they will go see Mickey. Just like people who want to see an NFL game or a NASCAR race will pay the exorbitant price to do so (and then pay seven bucks for a beer).

The people who can afford to go to Florida will p. & m. like they're being persecuted, and write nasty letters to the newspaper, but they ultimately will pay what it costs to get there. And the people who can't afford it shouldn't be going anyway.
 
Management has been bleating this same thing for years; "We don't make any money on flights to Florida..."

So you're saying that PIT-FLA prints money, as does BOS-MCO, but USAir just says it doesn't because airlines like jetblue flood the market with profitable nonstops? Why are they making millions on the route and we weren't (aren't)?

As far as people not paying a higher fare? Baloney. They will. They want to go to Florida. They've already promised their overindulged, spoiled little brats that they will go see Mickey. Just like people who want to see an NFL game or a NASCAR race will pay the exorbitant price to do so (and then pay seven bucks for a beer).

And they'll do it for the lowest possible fare in the market, even if it makes a connection through Charlotte. Or Atlanta. PIT leisure travelers will pay ultra exorbitant fares simply for a nonstop? Come on... And, you think $7 is expensive for a beer? That's about what you pay when you get to Nascar!

The people who can afford to go to Florida will p. & m. like they're being persecuted, and write nasty letters to the newspaper, but they ultimately will pay what it costs to get there. And the people who can't afford it shouldn't be going anyway.

Agreed. I've started to miss the "I Hate USAir" blather in the PIT Post Gazette...

Moreover, fewer people are going to be able to afford these trips they promised their "spoiled little brats" as the capacity reductions take hold and fares start rising to the levels where airlines can cover their operating costs. When that happens, I think the leisure folk will find a cheaper connecting fare even LESS offensive..
 
This is good.
Everyone for years has complained about the airlines focus on Market share over profitable flying!
That is exactly what management is doing, willingly giving up market share in return for not loosing money. It s common sense that mosy business use but the airlines for some reason never have. SW only flies to 75 some odd destinations that works great for them. We should only fly routes that make money or feeder routes that are close to break even.
 
I would think keeping 1 PIT-MCO and 1 PIT-TPA and reducing DCA-MCO from 5 to 4 and DCA-TPA from 4 to 3 would result in full flights out of PIT and an even higher LF and yield out of DCA by reducing excess seats. LGA777

The one difference between a TPA-PIT vs a TPA-DCA flight is the TPA-DCA flight will have lots of government/military fares vs almost all leisure into PIT. The govt fare is a decent fare and with MacDill/Centcom in TPA, we get lots of meetings with DCA-TPA traffic. The extra seats can be used for the conx that are no longer there in PIT. With the new skd in PIT we usually dont have more than 5-10 conx at most and all of the conx from PIT can be made in DCA or CLT or PIT. The best thing to do would be to offer 1 stop flights from PIT to Florida if you want to continue a presence in the market without doing a nonstop.
 

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