DL requests authority to begin LAX-PVG service

[Glenn Quagmire]

NWA used to do C checks and heavy maintenance on the 757 in MSP (along with the DC-10, 747, A-320, DC-9) and HMV and Major aging aircraft work on the DC-9 in ATL at the old Republic/Southern Hangar.

Delta/NWA has never had a maintenance base outside of the U.S. They used to use HAECO in Hong Kong for heavy check overflow. I went to 747-400 school with some of those guys.

 

[topDawg]

now tell us how often those maintenance tasks are done on the Asia 757s at NRT that can't be done with the NRT maintenance operation.

Oh generally a c-check is done ever 18 to 24 months or so. 
 

no one said that DL has a maintenance base.

"the 757s are not STRANDED in Asia. DL has a maintenance base there."
 

they did just move into a hangar where you repeatedly argue that it was more than just line maintenance.

um no. I have said its a line hangar. Now in general they might be able to do a little bit more than what is done on the line, but for the most part all Delta did was lease a hangar to move the engine changes and overnights done at the gate or on a pad into a hangar. 
 

If DL invested in a hangar to do more than line maintenance, then NRT does indeed have DL maintenance capabilities that are beyond what exists in nearly every other int'l city.

but they didn't. Again the biggest thing it changes is the weather. Now they don't have to lease space from ANA or JAL when one of the 757s in Asia needs and engine change and its raining. 
 

but you still can't argue the point that the 757 and 767 utilize a common cockpit rating.

I don't think i have tried. The aircraft are stuck in Asia. Said nothing about the crews. 
 

the 717s WILL NOT BE STRANDED on the west coast because they will be flown by DTW pilots. You yourself have said as much. There will be bridges.

I didn't say they would be. All I said was you are wrong when you said Delta doesn't firewall aircraft. You then went off the deep end 
 
but, as it is, the 717 will likely have, like the 767 does in Asia, aircraft that spend a few days out west. Ie the aircraft does DTW-MCI-SLC-LAS-LAX-LAS-SLC-LAS-LAX-PDX-LAX-LAS-LAX-PDX-LAX-LAS-SLC-MCI-DTW. 
The 767 does the same thing (or did at one point) where a frame would fly a day or two of nothing but intra-Asia and beach turns before taking a flight back to the mainland via PDX or SFO. 
 
But If Delta has 10 flights a day from LAX on the 717 that doesn't mean they have to have that many bridge flights. 1 or 2 bridge flights are more than enough. (and crews are going to be DHing basically no matter what Delta does so that doesn't really matter much) 
 

The 757 is not a stranded aircraft in Asia.

What live flights does Delta have between Asia and the US mainland or Hawaii then? (none, but the aircraft are stranded in Asia) 
 

while you and your union propaganda minion try to argue the point about the 717 vs the 757 as stranded aircraft, would you like to acknowledge that I told you a long time that the 717 would be flying on the west coast and you denied it?

Two things
1) bringing unions in this thread already eh? Get a life
2) I did no such thing. I have said the 717 will not have a pilot base. That is all. 

 

[WorldTraveler]

and MSP is not outside of the US, right?

nowhere does your information say that DL is doing anything different than what NW did.

DL does have greater maintenance capabilities at NRT than in nearly any other station outside of the US.

the Asia 757s are not stranded, remote aircraft.


and given that 700 had to be corrected by dawg that Delta Tech Ops is the name for DL's entire maintenance operation and not just its ATL maintenance base, I don't expect any light to come from him.


if dawg wants to correct me in saying that the NRT maintenance facility is a maintenance operation but not a base, then I will accept that.

but I have seen from him or anywhere else in DL verbiage what constitutes a base and what does not.

DL does have a maintenance FACILITY at NRT that is superior to what DL has at just about any foreign station and more than all but a handful of stations worldwide.

I would no more characterize a pilot or aircraft spending 2-3 days at a time in one region as being firewalled. It is a given that pilots will fly DTW-XXX-west coast and spend a day or more doing completely west coast flying before heading back east. that is not firewalling.

the aircraft will rotate in a similar fashion... perhaps returning to the eastern US faster than the pilots.

 

[topDawg]

NWA used to do C checks and heavy maintenance on the 757 in MSP (along with the DC-10, 747, A-320, DC-9) and HMV and Major aging aircraft work on the DC-9 in ATL at the old Republic/Southern Hangar.

Delta/NWA has never had a maintenance base outside of the U.S. they used to use HAECO in Hong Kong for heavy check overflow. I went to 747-400 school with some of those guys.

FWIW this is a vendor list for Delta (who does what) 
 
https://www.iata.org/whatwedo/workgroups/Documents/MCC-2011-SIN/Day_02/0900-0930_DL_Outsourcing_Strategies.pdf
 
(note the CF6-80C2B8F engine is now in-house. 88HMVs are done by TechOps Mexico, the rest looks up to date) 

 

[Kev3188]

and really, for the most part, it will probably be a difference CBT as the west stations do have MD88/MD90 support.

Yep, some Gen Fam for the AMT's, and some common rotables in the stations that will see them.. 

 

[topDawg]

and MSP is not outside of the US, right?

what does that have to do with anything? 
 
C-checks, gear, engines and APUs are overhauled in Atlanta. Component support is mostly in Atlanta. airframe overhuals are in SAT. 
 
About the only thing MSP does dealing with 757s is 2037 hospital visits.  
 

nowhere does your information say that DL is doing anything different than what NW did.

uh Delta does a good bit different than pre and post strike NW with the 757s. 
Pre strike, and Glenn please correct me if I am wrong, NW did 2037 overhauls landing gear overhauls, Letter checks and airframe overhauls on the 757 in MSP. Post Strike NWA sent all that work to vendors, and for the Asian 757s those checks were done in Asia.
 
So yes Delta is doing it much differently than NW.  
 

DL does have greater maintenance capabilities at NRT than in nearly any other station outside of the US.

How exactly? 
 

the Asia 757s are not stranded, remote aircraft.

again, then how do they get back to the US? 
 

and given that 700 had to be corrected by dawg that Delta Tech Ops is the name for DL's entire maintenance operation and not just its ATL maintenance base, I don't expect any light to come from him.

Point? people make that mistake all the time. TechOps, Technical Operations Center. 
 
and really, pre merger, for the most part TechOps was Atlanta. 
 

if dawg wants to correct me in saying that the NRT maintenance facility is a maintenance operation but not a base, then I will accept that.

Its a line station with a hangar. Nothing of any difference than DTW, SEA, CVG, BOS and SLC.  
 

but I have seen from him or anywhere else in DL verbiage what constitutes a base and what does not.

Delta's maintenance bases are Atlanta and Minny.
A Base for Delta is simply a place where heavy work is done. Overhauls, C-checks etc. (and places that have a 145 cert)
look here.  
 

DL does have a maintenance FACILITY at NRT that is superior to what DL has at just about any foreign station and more than all but a handful of stations worldwide.

And again, what makes it different than any other line station in the system?

 

[topDawg]

Yep, some Gen Fam for the AMT's, and some common rotables in the stations that will see them.. 

might even have an engine put out in SLC. 
 
but for the most part yep. Some CBTs, maybe, maybe a class and thats about it. 
 
Delta will add some bins for most common 717 issues (that aren't the same part # on the 88 and or 90) and that is it. Heck I imagine LAS and PDX will be able to do 717 work too. (but I know SLC/LAX will get 717 parts and training) 

 

[700UW]

what does that have to do with anything? 
 
C-checks, gear, engines and APUs are overhauled in Atlanta. Component support is mostly in Atlanta. airframe overhuals are in SAT. 
 
About the only thing MSP does dealing with 757s is 2037 hospital visits.  
 
uh Delta does a good bit different than pre and post strike NW with the 757s. 
Pre strike, and Glenn please correct me if I am wrong, NW did 2037 overhauls landing gear overhauls, Letter checks and airframe overhauls on the 757 in MSP. Post Strike NWA sent all that work to vendors, and for the Asian 757s those checks were done in Asia.
 
So yes Delta is doing it much differently than NW.  
 
How exactly? 
 
again, then how do they get back to the US? 
 
Point? people make that mistake all the time. TechOps, Technical Operations Center. 
 
and really, pre merger, for the most part TechOps was Atlanta. 
 
Its a line station with a hangar. Nothing of any difference than DTW, SEA, CVG, BOS and SLC.  
 
Delta's maintenance bases are Atlanta and Minny.
A Base for Delta is simply a place where heavy work is done. Overhauls, C-checks etc. (and places that have a 145 cert)
look here.  
 
And again, what makes it different than any other line station in the system?

He is clueless, he believes he knows everything about DL's operation and how it works, but we know he isnt.
 
Just like he claimed DL has an A340 overhaul program in its own MRO business and we all proved him wrong.
 
Hey where are those A340s that DL was suppose to get according to him?

 

[topDawg]

He is clueless, he believes he knows everything about DL's operation and how it works, but we know he isnt.
 
Just like he claimed DL has an A340 overhaul program in its own MRO business and we all proved him wrong.
 
Hey where are those A340s that DL was suppose to get according to him?

I'm still waiting for the 737-700s to go to WN. 
 
don't trust pilot rumors...... just sayin.... 

 

[WorldTraveler]

No, I did not say that DL has a 340 overhaul program. I said DL Tech Ops provides services on the 340.

as for the 737-700s, DL got WN to pay DL $100M to refurbish the 717s. Why would DL give up the 73Gs when WN was as willing to get rid of them and DL had to give nothing in return?

DL itself said that it had considered used widebody aircraft and categorically ruled them all out because of the cost of cabin mods.


SO DL uses the word "base" to describe only ATL (they don't call MSP a base using the page you cited) but they do say that "our MSP location..." and our "ATL facility is our home base"

so is there only one base?

and you still miss the point that NRT has more maintenance capabilities than all but a couple other cities on the DL system - perhaps just ATL and MSP?

and DL FLIES those 757s from NRT to the US to get them back to the US, presumably to do maintenance that DL doesn't choose to subcontract to other Asia providers or do at NRT Tech Ops.

and those eastbound 757 flights are usually LIVE. westbound are ferries, often via ANC.

 

[700UW]

More Maintenance capabilities?
 
You are truly clueless on how maintenance operates.

The work done in a line hangar can be and is also accomplished outside, do you even read what Dawg is explaining to you.
 
Your arrogance and hubris knows no bounds.
 
Engine changes, and gear changes are done outside all the time, airlines like to use hangars to keep their workers out of the elements, but planes dont pick to only break at a station where DL has a hangar.
 
Keep reaching, you have no idea nor clue on what DL maintenance can do at its stations.
 
What happens when a DL plane breaks where DL has no hangar and needs an engine change?
 
Here let me give you a clue, a US plane in ATL needed an engine change this week, they had no hangar and the work was done outside.

 

[jimntx]

Now, 700, you know that Dullta would have built a hangar at that station before doing an engine change.

 

[700UW]

Now, 700, you know that Dullta would have built a hangar at that station before doing an engine change.

Now thats funny! +1

 

[topDawg]

No, I did not say that DL has a 340 overhaul program. I said DL Tech Ops provides services on the 340.

you greatly, greatly, greatly, overstated that. 
delta has a hand full of line stations on the east coast that can do very limited A340 work. 
 

as for the 737-700s, DL got WN to pay DL $100M to refurbish the 717s. Why would DL give up the 73Gs when WN was as willing to get rid of them and DL had to give nothing in return?

couldn't tell you why you thought it was a good idea but you did. 
 

DL itself said that it had considered used widebody aircraft and categorically ruled them all out because of the cost of cabin mods.

no kidding. 
 

SO DL uses the word "base" to describe only ATL (they don't call MSP a base using the page you cited) but they do say that "our MSP location..." and our "ATL facility is our home base"

you are misunderstanding in that direction. What they mean by ATL is our home base is ATL is the HQ. 
 
 

so is there only one base?

no MSP/ATL are a base. notice how they say nothing about DTW or SLC or BOS or SEA on that page? 
 

and you still miss the point that NRT has more maintenance capabilities than all but a couple other cities on the DL system - perhaps just ATL and MSP?

no I don't miss anything. If NRT has more capabilities then please tell me what they are. 
 

and DL FLIES those 757s from NRT to the US to get them back to the US, presumably to do maintenance that DL doesn't choose to subcontract to other Asia providers or do at NRT Tech Ops.

They can't do at the TechOps hangar cause it isn't set up to support c-checks and overhauls 
 
to do a c-check you don't just need a hangar. You need the tooling, back shop support, and man power. None are thing NRT has. 
 

and those eastbound 757 flights are usually LIVE. westbound are ferries, often via ANC.

no they aren't. I know of 1 live flight to repo the 757. 
 
matter of fact one of the 75As was just in SAT getting the cabin mods done.... no live ferry. 

 

[topDawg]

More Maintenance capabilities?
 
You are truly clueless on how maintenance operates.
The work done in a line hangar can be and is also accomplished outside, do you even read what Dawg is explaining to you.
 
Your arrogance and hubris knows no bounds.
 
Engine changes, and gear changes are done outside all the time, airlines like to use hangars to keep their workers out of the elements, but planes dont pick to only break at a station where DL has a hangar.
 
Keep reaching, you have no idea nor clue on what DL maintenance can do at its stations.
 
What happens when a DL plane breaks where DL has no hangar and needs an engine change?
 
Here let me give you a clue, a US plane in ATL needed an engine change this week, they had no hangar and the work was done outside.

exactly. 
 
Or in the case of that US plane they might have, had it been needed or wanted, leased a half bay from Delta or some space for ASA. 
 
One thing, when it comes to that kind of stuff the competition thing goes out the window. We help each other on the MX side. I have been on plenty of field trips where most of the support, tooling sometimes even man power and support comes from airlines like AA, US, UA, UPS, FX etc.