2014 Pilot Discussion

[AAviator]

Because it's fair,again if one of west friends "84" hire can hold a 777 slot he should get it if you guys don't want it. I know you are clueless with this since you support the west however every AA jumpseater and my AA friends want some sort of wide body protection and seat protection and they should, we have no problem with that, why do you want to screw over you fellow AA pilots and give away their wide body jobs, I don't get that part.

In the case of this SLI, I could care less what shade and blend of polyester uniform anyone is wearing prior to this integration.  I think you have a skewed view on just "what" both sides bring to the table.  I used Munn as an example.  He's an 85 hire.  That seniority can hold a block on the 777 at AA.  He can't hold a block on the A330 at LCC can he?  Can he even hold A330 left seat in the system?  If not, he's got no business being on the combined list in a position that absent your C&R and fences can hold 777 or A330.  At some point your C&R and fences come down and he's someplace he has no right to be.  What if retirement age is raised to 70?  What if there's another BK and the contract gets abrogated?
 
Durability of your placement on the list is where the rubber meets the road.  your job grab under the guise of "DoH is fair, but we really don't want your jobs" is a tall pile of B.S,
 
And why do you keep bringing up the 84 AWA hire?
 
 
Riddle me this #260 seniority…  Where did you come from?  Piedmont?  Allegheny?  You do know the original Us Air that merged with PI never had any wide bodies… did you?  Are you original Empire?  Should a Fokker driver ever fly a B767?
 
Start trying to make sense..  i called you out on your diverging statements and all you can keep saying is DOH.

 

[AAviator]

Because it's fair,again if one of west friends "84" hire can hold a 777 slot he should get it if you guys don't want it. I know you are clueless with this since you support the west however every AA jumpseater and my AA friends want some sort of wide body protection and seat protection and they should, we have no problem with that, why do you want to screw over you fellow AA pilots and give away their wide body jobs, I don't get that part.

If that '84 AWA hire holds A300 on the NIC as of integration date, why would I object to him holding it post SLI?
 
And what AA pilot would pass on a 777 upgrade??
 
Are you ok??

 

[AAviator]

. What don't you get, well yes I am senior to Munn, I would be in the top 260 or so on your list, One more time I think we should have a fence, most everyone I have talked to on both side agree, now pay attention we should not bump you out of your seats, C and R can be done, you brought a lot of big planes to this merge, their yours. I can't make it any clearer for you.
 
Ok, they're ours.  But we can't have the associated seniority numbers that typically come with those kinds of jobs?  (just like anywhere else on the planet?)
 
Did I get that right?  Whats the point in having a number then?

 

[AAviator]

Sorry for the delay...Sunday household "chores" and all!

In a nutshell, from USAPA's filing and fit for "public" consumption, they are attempting to force parties into:

proceeding with USAPA to an arbitration
hearing in accordance with Section 13(a) of the Allegheny-Mohawk LPPs until
completion of the requirements thereof for resolution of the seniority list integration
dispute among the pilots of American Airlines and US Airways;

In reality, I believe they are more concerned with NOT ALLOWING west pilots any voice at the arbitration. I guess if APA continues to force the issue they will simply be forcing USAPA into a further downward spiral of total dysfunction. APA's probable opinion: "WINNING"!

We'll get everybody under the same umbrella, fight for a while, disagree to not be able to agree, submit to arbitration and move on.  No loss of DFR if its all thrown to an arbitrator.  Institutional indifference.
 
Oh yea, then fight lawsuits from the Easties until the last one retires. 😀

 

[luvthe9]

What happened to your "Majority Rules" mantra?

In the case of this SLI, I could care less what shade and blend of polyester uniform anyone is wearing prior to this integration.  I think you have a skewed view on just "what" both sides bring to the table.  I used Munn as an example.  He's an 85 hire.  That seniority can hold a block on the 777 at AA.  He can't hold a block on the A330 at LCC can he?  Can he even hold A330 left seat in the system?  If not, he's got no business being on the combined list in a position that absent your C&R and fences can hold 777 or A330.  At some point your C&R and fences come down and he's someplace he has no right to be.  What if retirement age is raised to 70?  What if there's another BK and the contract gets abrogated?
 
Durability of your placement on the list is where the rubber meets the road.  your job grab under the guise of "DoH is fair, but we really don't want your jobs" is a tall pile of B.S,
 
And why do you keep bringing up the 84 AWA hire?
 
 
Riddle me this #260 seniority  Where did you come from?  Piedmont?  Allegheny?  You do know the original Us Air that merged with PI never had any wide bodies did you?  Are you original Empire?  Should a Fokker driver ever fly a B767?
 
Start trying to make sense..  i called you out on your diverging statements and all you can keep saying is DOH.

I can't argue with you anymore, you are the one the mentioned an 84 hire, I came shortly after the we changed from Allegheny, yes I agree BK and raising the age are a variable. Skewed view of what's brought to the table are you kidding me, you guys are bringing about 5 times to big planes we are I think they should be yours. I am saying the same thing over and over in different ways you can understand, I give up, we agree to disagree. Are you aware of all the attrition form both sides in 5 or so years. You obviously want arbitration and slotting, you might get that but it will hurt you side.


Majority rules, when we are all together.

 

[AAviator]

I can't argue with you anymore, you are the one the mentioned an 84 hire, I came shortly after the we changed from Allegheny, yes I agree BK and raising the age are a variable. Skewed view of what's brought to the table are you kidding me, you guys are bringing about 5 times to big planes we are I think they should be yours. I am saying the same thing over and over in different ways you can understand, I give up, we agree to disagree. Are you aware of all the attrition form both sides in 5 or so years. You obviously want arbitration and slotting, you might get that but it will hurt you side.

I am very aware of that.  Are you aware of the attrition beyond 5 years?
 
Why, at your seniority are you so hell bent on throwing anyone under the bus?  Retire you old fart!

 

[luvthe9]

I am very aware of that.  Are you aware of the attrition beyond 5 years?
 
Why, at your seniority are you so hell bent on throwing anyone under the bus?  Retire you old fart!

Sure after five or so years all the junior kids will move up nicely into big airplanes the way it's suppose to happen, I'm am not the one throwing anyone under the bus, just want what we have now nothing more nothing less, you on the other hand want to give us your big plane slots, we'll sure find someone to take them I'm sure. Good luck son! I would love to retire but our scum ALPA boy gave my pension away at 2 o'clock in the morning without a vote, be lucky we help fund yours.

 

[AAviator]

Sure after five or so years all the junior kids will move up nicely into big airplanes the way it's suppose to happen, I'm am not the one throwing anyone under the bus, just want what we have now nothing more nothing less, you                              on the other hand want to give us your big plane slots,   
 
If true, what difference is it to you?  If they're not yours anyway, how can you give them away?  Are you suggesting I join USAPA to fight for our jets?  Is that why USAPA is suing APA? To save us from ourselves?
 
 
 
 
we'll sure find someone to take them I'm sure. Good luck son! I would love to retire but our scum ALPA boy gave my pension away at 2 o'clock in the morning without a vote, be lucky we help fund yours.
 
 

You didn't fund crap.  Our A fund is frozen and the b fund was monetized..   You really appear to be factually challenged.
 
​You need to be thankful APA got you a respectable pay rate and 16% 401K, cupcake..
 
​Oh yea,…. You're welcome!

 

[Claxon]

Y

 

[luvthe9]

American's pilots, represented by the Allied Pilots Association, recently agreed to a pay package deal with US Airways that is some $522 million above what they had originally agreed to with American's management.

 

[AAviator]

Yep, that was 87 million/year divided amongst everyone.
 
Tell the whole story why don't you?

 

[nevergiveup]

Yep, that was 87 million/year divided amongst everyone.
 
Tell the whole story why don't you?

Murdock?

 

[Phoenix]

Ahhhh, wordsmithing…  I'm slow, so I'll have to verify your statement..  You think for some reason that the APA will use the NIC and not what USAPA brings to the table?
 
You're far too crafty and wiley for me to keep up with..  Am I getting closer to the answer of the riddle you present??

"Implicit assumption" isn't a riddle, it's a dead end legal strategy that Ferggie and Koontz foisted on gullible dreamers. $3M and counting... Lots of $675 ties.

It's a wedge the "neutral" company promotes and now it appears the APA has succumb to the temptation to join the company. It's normal... pilots have a history.. They will spare no expense to manipulate a fair and equitable result that is more fair to themselves.

 

[nevergiveup]

"Implicit assumption" isn't a riddle, it's a dead end legal strategy that Ferggie and Koontz foisted on gullible dreamers. $3M and counting... Lots of $675 ties.

It's a wedge the "neutral" company promotes and now it appears the APA has succumb to the temptation to join the company. It's normal... pilots have a history.. They will spare no expense to manipulate a fair and equitable result that is more fair to themselves.

I think APA is just more afraid of DFR than arbitration. Perhaps Doug has told them he will keep things separate for a certain period of time.

 

[Phoenix]

American's pilots, represented by the Allied Pilots Association, recently agreed to a pay package deal with US Airways that is some $522 million above what they had originally agreed to with American's management.

America West did wonders! Admit it!!