On 1/30/2003 7:32:59 PM MiAAmi wrote:
Your comparing one route compared to what AA dominates worldwide. I don't think they are even in the same league. And if you want to keep score why not stick to high school football.
Relax. Actually it was 2 routes. Its one of the few times when the big, "dominates worldwide,AA," retreated from just a little upstart. Remember AA started JFK-OAK after JBLU to try to beat them out of the market and lost. Whats going to happen when JBLU starts flying to ORD & BOS?
AMR might dominate the world in routes but when it comes to running an airline here is the scores that really count.
AMR lost $3.5 Billion, JBLU made $105 Mil. AMR/JBLU,CASM 10.78/6.32 cents, JBLU CASM were DOWN 6.32% 02' vs'01, RASM 8.38/7.36 cents. JBLU RASM were up 8.9%. JBLU nearly doubled in size in '02 and plans to grow by more than 50% in '03, AMR down over 20% with more cuts ahead. Load factors 70%/83%.
The truly impressive number at JBLU is that its operating margin was a whopping 16.5%. That compares to profitable SWA margin of 6.3%.
I know its comparing apples to oranges, but what you really have is an airline running on a 20th century system vs one running one in the 21st century. I hope AA hurries up and and figures out how to do the same. Your right they are not in the same league.
Here's some more numbers specific to the city-pair in question:
According to David Neeleman (quarterly conference call), jetBlue maintained a yield and load factor premium over AA in this market. His numbers had jetBlue with an average load factor of 85% (versus AA's 68%), and an average one-way fare of $160 (versus AA's $148).
On 1/31/2003 410 PM MiAAmi wrote:
Those Jetblue employees are going to want some raises someday.
Those Jet Blue employees will get raises, as they are scheduled to. Is it so hard to believe that a group of people could be happy with what they have? And is it so hard to believe that the management there might actually treat them half way decent? And if they are eventually unionized, just as Southwest Airlines employees are, is that going to bring them to their knees? Cause Southwest seems to be doing okay, unions and all.
I believe that SWA is something like 85% unionized also. Pretty amazing. Just because an airline is heavily unionized doesn't mean they have to lose money. I think some of the blame has to lay with how management uses the company's resources. Just my thoughts.....
On 1/31/2003 3:43:41 PM AAmech wrote:
Could you imagine the profit AA would make if it payed JB's wages to its employees?
MiAAmi says. "Those Jetblue employees are going to want some raises someday. '
JetBlue F/A's entry level pay is, when you add in the benis', near the top, if not the top. $20 up to 70 hours, $30 after that. If you made $30,000 at JB last year you would have recieved a nice profit sharing check of $4050 at year end. This year will be bigger! If you put 3% into a 401K JB match would have equaled $900. Yes, there are scheculed pay increases too. So pay isnt that big of an issue. Plus you add the fact that you are part of the new revolution in airtravel. Were there is a good chance you could be working next to your CEO on you next flight. Everyone I know who works at JB is extremely happy about their future. How happy are you?
Here a list of benis from their web site:
The rewards of joining the JetBlue crew include access to a superior package of benefits. In most cases, coverage starts on the first day of the month following your date of hire.
Here are highlights of the program. Should you become a member of our crew, you will receive complete information on benefit options and pricing at that time.
Security for Today:
If you are a full-time crewmember, medical coverage is offered to you and your eligible dependents through a preferred provider organization (PPO).
You may use any doctor or facility you wish - there is no gatekeeper and no referral required to see a specialist. However, the plan will pay more if you use an in-network provider.
Part-time employees are offered a catastrophic medical plan.
JetBlue offers a dental plan to all full-time crewmembers.
Under the dental plan, you may see the dentist of your choice; however, the plan will pay more if you use an in-network provider.
The plan includes orthodontic services for children.
JetBlue offers a voluntary vision plan to all full-time crewmembers.
The plan provides for an exam, lenses and frames every 24 months after a copay.
Contact lenses are also covered.
You may see the vision provider of your choice; however, the plan will pay more if you use an in-network provider.
JetBlue pays for basic life and AD&D insurance for all crewmembers working over 20 hours per week.
The amount of coverage depends on your job classification.
You can purchase additional supplemental coverage up to six times your annual salary up to a plan maximum.
Coverage is also available for your spouse and dependent children.
Short-Term Disability Insurance
If you live in New York, California or Puerto Rico, you are eligible for coverage under the government-regulated disability plan for your area.
If you live in another location, you can purchase short-term disability coverage that pays a benefit equal to 60% of your weekly base pay up to a plan maximum.
Coverage is available for all crewmembers working over 20 hours per week and begins on your date of hire.
Long-Term Disability Insurance
Coverage is provided for all full-time crewmembers and begins on your date of hire.
The plan pays 60% of your monthly base pay up to a plan maximum.
Employee Assistance Program
The Employee Assistance Program provides up to three visits with a trained counselor if you or your family members need help with emotional, financial, marital, legal, drug and alcohol and other problems that impact your life or work.
The program is completely confidential.
Security for Tomorrow:
401(k) Investment Plan
The plan lets you save any percentage of your pay in pre-tax dollars.
JetBlue will match the first 3% that you save dollar for dollar.
You choose how to invest your account among 16 funds.
Matching contributions to your account vest over five years.
The plan differs slightly in Puerto Rico.
JetBlue crewmembers share in our success if we make a profit for the year.
Any profit sharing contributions are made once a year and are fully vested as soon as they go into your account.
The profit sharing contribution for 2001 was a big 13.5% of pay.
Stock Purchase Plan
Really be a part of the crew by buying JetBlue stock through the Crewmember Stock Purchase Plan.
The plan allows crewmembers to buy shares of company stock through payroll deduction every six months at 15% off the fair market value.
Enjoying Time Away from Work
Paid Time Off
The Paid Time Off (PTO) plan combines vacation, sick leave and holiday pay into a single bank of time for maximum flexibility.
You begin earning time on your date of hire and can use your PTO after three months on the job.
You and your immediate family members are eligible for unlimited stand-by on JetBlue flights and passes on partner airlines.
Your designated buddy or significant other may also be eligible.
Note: This page highlights JetBlue's crewmember benefits program, but is not a summary plan description or plan document. If there is any conflict between this page and the official plan documents, the plan documents will govern.
On 2/2/2003 808 AM TWAFA007 wrote:
JetBlue F/A's entry level pay is, when you add in the benis', near the top, if not the top. $20 up to 70 hours, $30 after that. If you made $30,000 ...
Did you do your math prior to posting that assumption?
Seventy hours a month at twenty dollars an hour times twelve months a year equals $16,800. To get to $30,000 annually, one would need to put in almost 37 additional hours, at the $30 an hour rate, each and every month. That is assuming no vacation or sick time (Paid Time Off) is taken, which makes your assumption even more ludicrous.
You figures are not based in reality; but then, almost nothing you post is.