Does this apply to USA320pilot too?
ALPA AWA MEC Thread for 8/10-8/17
- Thread starter electricjet98
- Start date
Richard
Veteran
- Dec 15, 2005
- 2,084
- 2
It certainly does.
Oh dear, that will make him very angry.
I predict a lot of posts from him beginning with: "MODERATOR: Please do not merge this thread. What I have to say is just SOOOO important and it would be unfair for the world not to hear me repeat myself for the billionth time."
I predict a lot of posts from him beginning with: "MODERATOR: Please do not merge this thread. What I have to say is just SOOOO important and it would be unfair for the world not to hear me repeat myself for the billionth time."
OP
electricjet98
Senior
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #19
AWA MEC Hotline 8/10/2007
August 10, 2007—In this issue:
• More Work for Less Pay
• Parker's Perspective
• BUDCO Audit
• Distance Learning
• Upcoming MEC Meetings
• Rice Committee Open Forum for America West Pilots
• Negotiations Update
• Seniority Lawsuit Update
• East Propaganda
• Educating the Truth
More Work for Less Pay
If the East continues down the path of separate operations with no gains likely until at least two years past their amendable date of December 2009 rather than focus on achieving a joint contract, the East MEC have likely forfeited the following amounts on behalf of their pilots had we had a contract by December 2007:
Captain: $115,900
First Officer: $63,064
ALL east pilots could expect 31 days of vacation, rerouting protections, red-flag pairings at 125 percent, reroute and junior assignments at 150 percent, and other substantially improved work rules, not to mention FULL PAY for deadheads, much improved pairing constructions rules, ten golden days each month for reserve pilots (12 or 13 total days off for reserve pilots), etc.
These total figures do not include the higher rates to achieve ratification or any outlying year increases, nor do they include any increased payments to the DC retirement plan.
Back to top
Parker's Perspective
US Airways CEO Doug Parker held a crew news session earlier this week at the Training Center with approximately 50 pilots who asked several very good questions.
One pilot asked why America West was losing money while US Airways was making money. The short answer from Doug was that we should think of our company as one airline, not two. He believes that we have been considered as one since the beginning of the merger and starting the next quarter, separate numbers for the pre-merger airlines will no longer appear.
In addition to answering questions about the ATC fiasco on the East and the problems in PHL, Doug talked extensively about how important it was for all parties to work together toward a single contract. He made it clear that his preference for pilots to achieve pay raises and contract improvements would hopefully only come through a single, negotiated contract, not separate pay parity or America West Section 6 talks.
Back to top
BUDCO Audit
US Airways is conducting an audit of the employee healthcare plan and verifying the eligibility of dependents. If you are on the Company healthcare plan and have any dependents listed, you will need to submit the proper verification forms by August 31 in order for them to continue to receive coverage. Your dependents will be removed from your healthcare plan effective September 1 if this information is not received by the deadline. Please contact BUDCO (the company conducting the audit) at 888-326-7201 with any questions or to receive a new packet of information.
Back to top
Distance Learning
We currently have two Distance Learning modules to complete. NGS 3 is the longer recurrent module that needs to be completed by August 25, not the 31st as may be listed on the Hub. The second module is one that the Training Department activated last week as a refresher to the Sabre FOS, which needs to be completed by September 17. Please do not hesitate to contact Dean Jenkins, our Distance Learning point of contact at US Airways, with your questions and feedback. He can be reached at 480-693-5391 or [email protected].
Back to top
Upcoming MEC Meeting
As a reminder, the MEC will convene next week at the MEC office in PHX from Tuesday, August 14, to Friday, August 17. Among other things, the MEC will
Elect MEC officers to two-year terms beginning September 1, 2007;
Appoint committee chairmen per long-standing AWA MEC Policy;
Discuss the upcoming vacancy in the Communication Committee chairman position;
Discuss changes to the Policy Manual;
Review our legal strategy (closed session);
Review JNC talks (closed session); and
Speak with the Rice Committee (closed session).
Active members in good standing are welcome to attend the open portions of the meeting; however, please be advised that portions of the meeting will be closed, and as such, you may want to call the MEC office to find out the schedule for the day. The meeting will begin at 9:30 a.m. the first day and 9:00 a.m. each subsequent day. The MEC office is located north of the airport at 432 N. 44th Street, Suite 340.
Back to top
Rice Committee Open Forum for America West Pilots
On Thursday, August 16, our MEC will host an Open Forum for members in good standing to address ALPA First Vice-President Paul Rice and members of the Rice Committee. The Open Forum will be held from 1:00 p.m. to 3:00 p.m. at the Doubletree Hotel in Phoenix, which is located at 320 N. 44th Street. (The hotel is near the airport on the northwest corner of Van Buren and 44th Streets.)
This is an excellent opportunity for America West pilots to speak with our National leadership directly and express their opinions and/or concerns. Whether you’re off for the day or on your way to or from work, plan to stop by to make your voice heard.
Back to top
Negotiations Update
The America West MEC Negotiating Committee distributed an update yesterday via email. In it, they reviewed last week’s bargaining session, which included discussion about moving the process forward. Management indicated their interest in pursuing mediation as provided in the Transition Agreement. This process has proved successful with the fleet service employees who are represented by the IAM, as it was announced today that the parties had reached a Tentative Agreement. While our MEC remains open to mediation in an effort to achieve gains for all US Airways pilots, the East MEC indicated that they are not interested in anything that would advance the implementation of the Nicolau Award. If you have not yet read the update, please do so by logging on to the MEC website at www.alpa.org/awa.
Back to top
Seniority Lawsuit Update
In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy, the America West MEC expects ALPA to defend the seniority arbitration award. As such, our legal team at Bredhoff and Kaiser filed a motion earlier this week to make “ALPA, International†a defendant in the ongoing litigation filed by the US Airways MEC. That motion and its attachments are available on our MEC website, www.alpa.org/awa.
Back to top
East Propaganda
“Definition of a windfall: The total number of Captain years transferred from US Airways pilots to America West pilots is 4,463 years.â€
We have heard this over and over from the East and these numbers are intentionally inaccurate and a reflection of the East’s over-reaching attempt to win public support for their outrage.
The East implies that implementing the arbitration award would result in the transfer of 4,463 Captain years to the America West pilots. What they fail to mention is how they determined this figure and the unrealistic presumptions that it considers.
Presumption #1
All East pilots have and will bid strictly for the highest pay position in any base their seniority can hold without regard to line status or other quality of life issues.
Reality
This type of strict bidding does not exist. For example, the East is recalling furloughees into the right seat of the A330, the highest paid equipment on the property. Many other pilots have and will choose to remain senior in their first officer position until they are able to hold a line or a domicile that they desire
Presumption #2
All West pilots will immediately bid upgrade positions in the East system.
Reality
As already evidenced by bidding patterns not only on the West, but the other major multi-domicile airlines, pilots do not strictly bid for the highest paid position at the expense of a long commute, crash pad and reserve schedule.
The transfer of Captain years is additionally inflated to compensate for the already out of seniority positions of the two separate seniority list. It is based on a strict form of “stove-pipe†bidding where EVERY pilot always bids for the highest pay position and that creates the waterfall of vacancies. This does not exist on either property and the 4,463 Captain years reflect the theoretical adjustment that is required to exercise this concept.
Back to top
Educating the Truth
“And there are other analysts as well, but the general tenor was that the financial community was concerned that there may be a liquidation. In my opinion, from an outsider's perspective, if I was analyzing this business and saw the cash declining to the level that it was during a bankruptcy, having all the benefits of that protection I would have the same view.â€
Source: Mr. Robert W. Mann, Jr., Principal
R. W. Mann & Company, Incorporated, which is an airline industry analysis and consulting firm.
AAA/AWA Seniority Integration Hearing Transcripts
January 10, 2007; pages 1625-26
Please continue to fly safely and securely, and please be professional and courteous to your fellow crewmembers.
August 10, 2007—In this issue:
• More Work for Less Pay
• Parker's Perspective
• BUDCO Audit
• Distance Learning
• Upcoming MEC Meetings
• Rice Committee Open Forum for America West Pilots
• Negotiations Update
• Seniority Lawsuit Update
• East Propaganda
• Educating the Truth
More Work for Less Pay
If the East continues down the path of separate operations with no gains likely until at least two years past their amendable date of December 2009 rather than focus on achieving a joint contract, the East MEC have likely forfeited the following amounts on behalf of their pilots had we had a contract by December 2007:
Captain: $115,900
First Officer: $63,064
ALL east pilots could expect 31 days of vacation, rerouting protections, red-flag pairings at 125 percent, reroute and junior assignments at 150 percent, and other substantially improved work rules, not to mention FULL PAY for deadheads, much improved pairing constructions rules, ten golden days each month for reserve pilots (12 or 13 total days off for reserve pilots), etc.
These total figures do not include the higher rates to achieve ratification or any outlying year increases, nor do they include any increased payments to the DC retirement plan.
Back to top
Parker's Perspective
US Airways CEO Doug Parker held a crew news session earlier this week at the Training Center with approximately 50 pilots who asked several very good questions.
One pilot asked why America West was losing money while US Airways was making money. The short answer from Doug was that we should think of our company as one airline, not two. He believes that we have been considered as one since the beginning of the merger and starting the next quarter, separate numbers for the pre-merger airlines will no longer appear.
In addition to answering questions about the ATC fiasco on the East and the problems in PHL, Doug talked extensively about how important it was for all parties to work together toward a single contract. He made it clear that his preference for pilots to achieve pay raises and contract improvements would hopefully only come through a single, negotiated contract, not separate pay parity or America West Section 6 talks.
Back to top
BUDCO Audit
US Airways is conducting an audit of the employee healthcare plan and verifying the eligibility of dependents. If you are on the Company healthcare plan and have any dependents listed, you will need to submit the proper verification forms by August 31 in order for them to continue to receive coverage. Your dependents will be removed from your healthcare plan effective September 1 if this information is not received by the deadline. Please contact BUDCO (the company conducting the audit) at 888-326-7201 with any questions or to receive a new packet of information.
Back to top
Distance Learning
We currently have two Distance Learning modules to complete. NGS 3 is the longer recurrent module that needs to be completed by August 25, not the 31st as may be listed on the Hub. The second module is one that the Training Department activated last week as a refresher to the Sabre FOS, which needs to be completed by September 17. Please do not hesitate to contact Dean Jenkins, our Distance Learning point of contact at US Airways, with your questions and feedback. He can be reached at 480-693-5391 or [email protected].
Back to top
Upcoming MEC Meeting
As a reminder, the MEC will convene next week at the MEC office in PHX from Tuesday, August 14, to Friday, August 17. Among other things, the MEC will
Elect MEC officers to two-year terms beginning September 1, 2007;
Appoint committee chairmen per long-standing AWA MEC Policy;
Discuss the upcoming vacancy in the Communication Committee chairman position;
Discuss changes to the Policy Manual;
Review our legal strategy (closed session);
Review JNC talks (closed session); and
Speak with the Rice Committee (closed session).
Active members in good standing are welcome to attend the open portions of the meeting; however, please be advised that portions of the meeting will be closed, and as such, you may want to call the MEC office to find out the schedule for the day. The meeting will begin at 9:30 a.m. the first day and 9:00 a.m. each subsequent day. The MEC office is located north of the airport at 432 N. 44th Street, Suite 340.
Back to top
Rice Committee Open Forum for America West Pilots
On Thursday, August 16, our MEC will host an Open Forum for members in good standing to address ALPA First Vice-President Paul Rice and members of the Rice Committee. The Open Forum will be held from 1:00 p.m. to 3:00 p.m. at the Doubletree Hotel in Phoenix, which is located at 320 N. 44th Street. (The hotel is near the airport on the northwest corner of Van Buren and 44th Streets.)
This is an excellent opportunity for America West pilots to speak with our National leadership directly and express their opinions and/or concerns. Whether you’re off for the day or on your way to or from work, plan to stop by to make your voice heard.
Back to top
Negotiations Update
The America West MEC Negotiating Committee distributed an update yesterday via email. In it, they reviewed last week’s bargaining session, which included discussion about moving the process forward. Management indicated their interest in pursuing mediation as provided in the Transition Agreement. This process has proved successful with the fleet service employees who are represented by the IAM, as it was announced today that the parties had reached a Tentative Agreement. While our MEC remains open to mediation in an effort to achieve gains for all US Airways pilots, the East MEC indicated that they are not interested in anything that would advance the implementation of the Nicolau Award. If you have not yet read the update, please do so by logging on to the MEC website at www.alpa.org/awa.
Back to top
Seniority Lawsuit Update
In accordance with ALPA Merger Policy, the America West MEC expects ALPA to defend the seniority arbitration award. As such, our legal team at Bredhoff and Kaiser filed a motion earlier this week to make “ALPA, International†a defendant in the ongoing litigation filed by the US Airways MEC. That motion and its attachments are available on our MEC website, www.alpa.org/awa.
Back to top
East Propaganda
“Definition of a windfall: The total number of Captain years transferred from US Airways pilots to America West pilots is 4,463 years.â€
We have heard this over and over from the East and these numbers are intentionally inaccurate and a reflection of the East’s over-reaching attempt to win public support for their outrage.
The East implies that implementing the arbitration award would result in the transfer of 4,463 Captain years to the America West pilots. What they fail to mention is how they determined this figure and the unrealistic presumptions that it considers.
Presumption #1
All East pilots have and will bid strictly for the highest pay position in any base their seniority can hold without regard to line status or other quality of life issues.
Reality
This type of strict bidding does not exist. For example, the East is recalling furloughees into the right seat of the A330, the highest paid equipment on the property. Many other pilots have and will choose to remain senior in their first officer position until they are able to hold a line or a domicile that they desire
Presumption #2
All West pilots will immediately bid upgrade positions in the East system.
Reality
As already evidenced by bidding patterns not only on the West, but the other major multi-domicile airlines, pilots do not strictly bid for the highest paid position at the expense of a long commute, crash pad and reserve schedule.
The transfer of Captain years is additionally inflated to compensate for the already out of seniority positions of the two separate seniority list. It is based on a strict form of “stove-pipe†bidding where EVERY pilot always bids for the highest pay position and that creates the waterfall of vacancies. This does not exist on either property and the 4,463 Captain years reflect the theoretical adjustment that is required to exercise this concept.
Back to top
Educating the Truth
“And there are other analysts as well, but the general tenor was that the financial community was concerned that there may be a liquidation. In my opinion, from an outsider's perspective, if I was analyzing this business and saw the cash declining to the level that it was during a bankruptcy, having all the benefits of that protection I would have the same view.â€
Source: Mr. Robert W. Mann, Jr., Principal
R. W. Mann & Company, Incorporated, which is an airline industry analysis and consulting firm.
AAA/AWA Seniority Integration Hearing Transcripts
January 10, 2007; pages 1625-26
Please continue to fly safely and securely, and please be professional and courteous to your fellow crewmembers.
USA320Pilot
Veteran
- May 18, 2003
- 8,175
- 1,539
It appears the AWA MEC and their vocal supporters have gone under ground. Where is AWA320, Junebug, Prechillill, etc.? Considering recent exhanges with the AWA MEC and their communications I believe the AWA pilots got the message that their correspondence, email mesages, and posts where increasingy the resolve of the US Airways pilots to never, ever let the Nicolau Award proceed.
Regards,
USA320Pilot
Regards,
USA320Pilot
E
EastUS
Guest
"FACT: Senior management has stated that they will gain at least $10 million more a year in synergies with perhaps more to be gained in the area of intangibles by merging operations. A single FAA certificate is expected by September 25, 2007."
Hmmm....I'm trying to sift through all the BS here...OK:
"One pilot asked why America West was losing money while US Airways was making money. The short answer from Doug was that we should think of our company as one airline,"
And THAT consitutes an "answer" to you?
A better question from your side would be just how secure AWA is from being sold off seperately...and that will depend purely upon available suitors, and what's in it for "Doug" and company. The AWA crowd seems fixated upon some adolescent fantasy that the Tempe boys actually care about you."Doug talked extensively about how important it was for all parties to work together toward a single contract. He made it clear that his preference for pilots to achieve pay raises and contract improvements..." Pu-Leeaze tell me that you're not simple enough to actually believe that?
""FACT: Senior management has stated that they will gain at least $10 million more a year in synergies with perhaps more to be gained in the area of intangibles by merging operations." Ummm...and DP has stated that it would take approximately ONE HUNDRED and TWENTY MILLION to raise the east pilots to the west contract...and he's just chomping at the bit to do that for,,,ummm...ten Mill and "perhaps more to be gained "?...You're joking...right?
Oh yes = Doug's your boy...he's just dying to tie it all together yesterday
It has, after all, only been TWO YEARS wherein he could have taken action to improve pay/contracts/etc. His only rational impetus to desire any such is to achieve better packaging for a sell-off/merger...get a clue.
Junebug172
Veteran
- Sep 26, 2002
- 629
- 1
You sure about that chief?
I've been sorting through all the crap pilots have been sending me regarding you and your flip-flopiness.
You are truely a joke.
Tiger 1050
Veteran
- Aug 4, 2007
- 882
- 12
Don't you get it? We are in fact trying to get you guys to try this decert thing. We want to call your bluff.
If you take the time to read through the posts coming from the east you'll find mostly unbridled emotion tainted with ignorance. You kids out east had better start educating yourselves otherwise you will be settting yourselves up for additional disappoinment...
And sometimes the drivel that leaks from your mouth is just too much to respond to. This may be the lull you speak of.
Good day little children...
AWA320
Veteran
USA320 CLAIMS.
He claims to have enough cards!! He says that his attorneys say "we can win" He says "we will get this award over turned" If any of this is true and it's a really big if tell me something USA320, what does your attorney say about USAPA being sued by the AWA pilots?? What does your attorney say about not getting the aid of 2000 pilots on the westside and what that will do to your chances??? What does your attorney say about 2000 west pilots doing the direct opposite of EVERYTHING usapa does????
Will you have medical the ALPA aero provides??
Will you have legal services that ALPA legal provides???
Will you have the accident protection that ALPA provides???
You won't have the money to fight the company that ALPA provides so we already know that answer and without the financial support of the west pilots it will fail!!
The east MEC has over twenty meetings a year how will you afford all the FPL???
These are some tough questions and I hope he has the answers that satisify you because if not he will have hurt you AGAIN!!
Once a GAGer always one right??
Prediction, if and again that's a big if you can even get this done usapa will be broke in a year.
He claims to have enough cards!! He says that his attorneys say "we can win" He says "we will get this award over turned" If any of this is true and it's a really big if tell me something USA320, what does your attorney say about USAPA being sued by the AWA pilots?? What does your attorney say about not getting the aid of 2000 pilots on the westside and what that will do to your chances??? What does your attorney say about 2000 west pilots doing the direct opposite of EVERYTHING usapa does????
Will you have medical the ALPA aero provides??
Will you have legal services that ALPA legal provides???
Will you have the accident protection that ALPA provides???
You won't have the money to fight the company that ALPA provides so we already know that answer and without the financial support of the west pilots it will fail!!
The east MEC has over twenty meetings a year how will you afford all the FPL???
These are some tough questions and I hope he has the answers that satisify you because if not he will have hurt you AGAIN!!
Once a GAGer always one right??
Prediction, if and again that's a big if you can even get this done usapa will be broke in a year.
B
BottomFeeder
Guest
AWA320,
You just don't get it do you?
The East is willing to do WHATEVER it takes to keep their flying.
When your members figures it out. I will bet you that the recalls are coming to a West base near you.
How's your pension doing lately?
To the EASTies - DECERT, DESERT, DECERT!!!
And see what the next round of consolidation brings you... Ala AMR - TWA!!!
NOW, that's was the GREATEST STAPLE JOB!!!
Your arrogance, inmaturity and stubborness could bring you that.
Easy there Capt. Jack!
GL
AWA320
Veteran
I seriously doubt it and we do a lot of recalling here!! You see I do get it, it's called being responsible for our actions something that the east has failed to learn.
That all or nothing attitude of yours is the same one your MEC used and it was a complete failure wasn't it?? Now thus far we have not filed suit against anyone as we feel pretty strong about taking the high road. The problem is we've been up here so long that we now have altitude sickness.
You don't have a case and this is going to cause your membership to spend money that it doesn't need to, but hey do what you feel you need to do because ALPA is paying our legal bills, how bout yours??
You asked me about a pension and how it's doing?? Hows yours in fact how is LOA 93 treating you?? USA320 reported that some double secret meeting between the east mec and the company was about to produce parity. Did you get it yet?? Has anything at all you fine folks have done up to now been smart?? Your actions thus far have got to be as dumb as a bag of hammers.
Pension
lets see how funny you think it is when this management team opens a base within a base on you...nostradamus
Veteran
- Dec 7, 2004
- 2,038
- 0
The above person was hired by America West in 2003. He is dissing the pilots that were working with Usairways 15 years or more than he has with a buyout company run by a drunk, what would you do, bend over or act.I seriously doubt it and we do a lot of recalling here!! You see I do get it, it's called being responsible for our actions something that the east has failed to learn.
That all or nothing attitude of yours is the same one your MEC used and it was a complete failure wasn't it?? Now thus far we have not filed suit against anyone as we feel pretty strong about taking the high road. The problem is we've been up here so long that we now have altitude sickness.
You don't have a case and this is going to cause your membership to spend money that it doesn't need to, but hey do what you feel you need to do because ALPA is paying our legal bills, how bout yours??
You asked me about a pension and how it's doing?? Hows yours in fact how is LOA 93 treating you?? USA320 reported that some double secret meeting between the east mec and the company was about to produce parity. Did you get it yet?? Has anything at all you fine folks have done up to now been smart?? Your actions thus far have got to be as dumb as a bag of hammers.
Pension
E
EastUS
Guest
"...hired by America West in 2003" = Four WHOLE years?....or could he be lying about such a wealth of experience?.
.....Words truly fail me here.
B
BottomFeeder
Guest
Dumb as a bag of hammers?
West:
Let's see the Nic award is in a drawer at ALPA National.
Your still on contract what?
Stagnation for how long?
Section 6 to get a raise?
JNC moving at a fast clip.
6 quarters of losses
East:
Recalls at near 500 on the East
Upgrades = $$$$$$$
Progression to better lines of flying = Lifestyle improvement
Reserves becoming blockholders = Lifestyle + $$$$$$$
The trump vote on the JC, if ever there is one to vote on.
Yeah I guess your right about this one. Those poor Easties are a bunch of hammers.
