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ALPA/USAPA /West thread 4/6-4-12

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The west’s lawyer, Mr. Freund, has the highest possible rating in that guide. Mr. Seham did not.
Indeed, were both attorney's involved in similar events, one might possibly make the implication you did.

Comparing apples to oranges is like comparing a successful blue-collar worker to a white-collar executive. One, the BC worker will have no failures. The high powered SC executive will. The doer will have "failures", the couch potato will not.

Who do you want to represent yourself, the pizza eating beer swilling couch potato who lives with his mom and has no failures or the person who gets his hands dirty from 6 am to 12 pm and has a couple of false starts in his life?

I want someone with some life experience under his belt.
 
And I do know what I am talking about in regards to labor, very educated on the matter and well experienced.


............as well as a certified expert on the subjects of Cuban overflight ops, the USAir 5050 accident investigation, APA's 45 million dollar fine payment (NOT!), "slotting" in the US-PI merger, ETOPS preflight preparation and paperwork, the relative fuel efficiency of the 767-200 vs. A330, and an almost endless list of other topics. :up:
 
Indeed, were both attorney's involved in similar events, one might possibly make the implication you did.

Comparing apples to oranges is like comparing a successful blue-collar worker to a white-collar executive. One, the BC worker will have no failures. The high powered SC executive will. The doer will have "failures", the couch potato will not.

Who do you want to represent yourself, the pizza eating beer swilling couch potato who lives with his mom and has no failures or the person who gets his hands dirty from 6 am to 12 pm and has a couple of false starts in his life?

I want someone with some life experience under his belt.

Well, I have now read everything. If I understand you, Mr Seham’s inability to achieve any rating and experience with failure in representing other unions are qualifications to be USAPA’s counsel.

I guess that would make sense to a USAPA kool-aid drinker, but I have little doubt that should USAPA win, Mr Seham’s experience with failure will be added to. According to USAPA logic that will make him more qualified, but, unfortunately, the other normal people who are forced along for the ride will pay the price for this additional “experienceâ€￾.

Beyond this, the idea that someone who has attained the highest possible peer review by his fellow professionals could be compared to a beer swilling couch potato is equally inane.
 
............as well as a certified expert on the subjects of Cuban overflight ops, the USAir 5050 accident investigation, APA's 45 million dollar fine payment (NOT!), "slotting" in the US-PI merger, ETOPS preflight preparation and paperwork, the relative fuel efficiency of the 767-200 vs. A330, and an almost endless list of other topics. :up:


Posting negative comments about another poster is not allowed. This poster has just received time off.
 
From ALPA National:


USAPA: Rules Are Meant to Be Broken

The rules of a representational election under the Railway Labor Act are established and administered by the National Mediation Board (NMB). These rules define who is eligible to vote in a representational election. In response to an NMB inquiry, ALPA took the position that the eligibility rules should be applied evenly across the board. If USAPA had its way, it would pick and choose which rules would best help its cause and who would get to vote. But neither ALPA nor any other reputable union can take this approach to long-standing rules. Consider the following:

1. The NMB’s eligibility rules were established long ago, not just for this election. These rules have long included a principle known as the “cutoff dateâ€â€”a date the NMB sets to determine which employees are eligible to vote in the class and craft. This rule was designed to protect the integrity of elections by preventing manipulation of the eligibility roster through the timing of hirings and recalls. Every responsible union should favor this rule as an important protection for labor.

2. Contrary to USAPA’s claims, ALPA has never petitioned the NMB to exclude pilots working for affiliates and subsidiaries of US Airways, nor has it sought to exclude pilots from voting who are eligible within the long-standing rules of the NMB. The NMB raised the issues involving voter eligibility concerning pilots working at subsidiaries and affiliates of US Airways. These issues are between the company and the NMB.

This is made clear by USAPA’s general counsel in a April 10 letter in which he argues: “… no party to this proceeding ever raised these issues, with respect to the individual pilots now identified, to any stage of the representation dispute.†Indeed, ALPA has commented on this matter only because the NMB, in response to a demand made by USAPA, requested that ALPA do so.

3. USAPA hypocritically attempted to deny the right to vote to a number of eligible pilots within our class and craft—such as senior check airmen, those on medical leave, and those who have termination grievances pending. The NMB properly rejected these efforts and ruled that these pilots should retain their right to vote.

4. USAPA is attempting to do exactly what the NMB’s rules were intended to prevent:

· It is pushing for a last-minute change to the rules that will selectively add some pilots to the eligibility roster who are on the seniority lists, but were not flying for the airline at the cutoff date.

· It is lobbying to leave out other pilots who are in a similar situation.

· It is asking the Board to selectively enforce these rules in USAPA’s favor in a way that has never been done before for any NMB election.


5. USAPA’s general counsel is talking out of both sides of his mouth when he acknowledges that pilots working for other carriers are ineligible under long-established and consistently applied NMB election rules. He references the NMB Representational Manual (§9.207) in an April 10 letter: “We recognize that employees ‘working for another carrier other than the carrier involved in the dispute are ineligible.’†This statement is completely inconsistent with USAPA’s efforts to circumvent the rules of eligibility in order to include only pilots who it thinks will vote for USAPA.

6. If, however, the NMB should decide to change the long-standing cutoff date rules for this election, ALPA has made it clear that the change needs to be applied fairly and consistently across the board, and not selectively. There are a number of pilots on the seniority lists who are now working at US Airways but were not working for the carrier on the November 13 cutoff date, and were therefore not included on the eligibility list. If USAPA gets its way, those individuals would not get to vote while those similarly situated, who USAPA believes would support them, would get to vote. An example would be new hires brought aboard after the November 13 cutoff date.

The bottom line is that ALPA, in response to the NMB’s request, called for a straightforward application of a Board rule that has been applied without exception in every NMB election. ALPA also added that if the Board decides to change this long-standing rule it should do so fairly and consistently so that no one gets an unfair advantage in this election and in elections to come. Throughout this matter ALPA has supported the right of every pilot on the property as of the cutoff date to vote.

USAPA is only permitting you to see half of what you need to know. This hardly bodes well for any future under the USAPA banner.

ALPA Legal Department
 
Well, I have now read everything. If I understand you, Mr Seham’s inability to achieve any rating and experience with failure in representing other unions are qualifications to be USAPA’s counsel.

I guess that would make sense to a USAPA kool-aid drinker, but I have little doubt that should USAPA win, Mr Seham’s experience with failure will be added to. According to USAPA logic that will make him more qualified, but, unfortunately, the other normal people who are forced along for the ride will pay the price for this additional “experienceâ€￾.

Beyond this, the idea that someone who has attained the highest possible peer review by his fellow professionals could be compared to a beer swilling couch potato is equally inane.
I said, experience, perhaps something you lack which would account for your misunderstanding. When you get experience, come on back and we can revisit what I said.

and,

one can make no mistakes either because one is tops, in which case, why is an attorney playing around with "labor" or one makes no mistakes because they never try.
 
I don't know why you post that "stuff" here. It already arrives at everyone's house by email and snailmail, then you put it here. I won't read more "junk" about ALPA trying to justify it's existence any longer.
 
It is part of the transition agreement which is part of both CBAs, it wont go away.
Not according to the ALPA lawyers at a CLT roadshow. At this point in time I honestly don't know. One ALPA side says it goes away, another says it stays. I guess we'll have to wait and see, won't we?
 
Recent ALPA mailing:


April 14, 2008

Dear US Airways East and West Pilots:

The decision you face on who will represent you as a union is one of the toughest choices you will make as an airline pilot....

Thank you Lance and John for making it easier... I mean easy.

Oh by the way Sir ALPA. The only difficulty I see that you are adding to the mix is your attempt to prevent ALPA pilots from being able to vote by having their eligibility overturned after they already voted. If nothing else, you are consistent. Uh... yeah.. consistent. I'll get back to you if I think of something else.
 
Agreed. Unless something disappeared that I didn't see. I think he was posting about the particular gentleman's areas of expertise. Hhmm.

AAA73Pilot -

It seems to me he was merely repeating all the union and legal "expertise" that the other individual has been claiming on these boards for years. If repeating these things is ground for detention, what about sending the perpetrator to the corn fields for stating them in the first place?
 
DO NOT challenge moderators or make personal comments about other posters unless YOU would like to join the others.

Actions taken against others is not your concern.

And this is as good a time as any to close this thread for the week...
 
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