AMFA Organizing Drive to Replace Association

AMFAinMIAMI

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Jun 22, 2012
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Miami, Fl.
I don't think your outlook is representative of the collective. At least not from what I am seeing on these posts.
I mean you know..... it has been 20 years.
According to studies the average person works 43.27 years.
If a person born in 1954 hired in 1972 (18 years old) and worked until he could draw full retirement (year 2020 at 66 years old) he will have worked 48 years. That is almost your best case scenario.
48 years and that is hiring in the day you are eligible (18) and working until full retirement age (66). In the scenario we have with AMFA that mechanic would have been waiting 19 years (39.6 percent of his career rounded up ) only to close out his career with no success. The longer it takes to get AMFA in the worse that average gets.

I think your passion is overriding your objectivity.
His passion or objectivity as you put it is just that HIS, as with you, your opinion is Yours. He 1AA has lost Faith in the current representation, and is looking for something different. a Change. If you are stuck on believing the TWU or the ASSOCiation is going to give your related AA employee a better wage, and career then have them support the ASSOC. when the NMB gives the M&R work group a VOTE.

Let's wait on the ruling from the NMB, see which way that goes, then all the BS will can start on how we failed again or which way the membership is going to VOTE. You have had this explained to you so many times it really is getting OLD.
 

dfw gen

Veteran
Dec 1, 2011
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If I am mistaken about your career I apologize up front, Your NOT an AMT or even with AA, Nor were you part of the M&R class and craft.

My comment and question to you.

What HIGH hopes did you have for AMFA?

Until The membership signs enough cards AMFA had NOTHING to do with ALL the drives that have been attempted here at AA. It was all accomplished by a group of people who have had enough of the TWU and Now the ASSOCiation. Failure to collect enough cards was due to the misinformation put out by the TWU, or the failure to bring enough information to the M&R work group by the Organizers to generate interest. The resistance to change due to the insecurity of the membership also played a part in that. It all boils down to the membership NOT AMFA.

The current card drive is in the hands of the NMB. We the Organizers turned in enough cards to give the membership a Chance to VOTE. With that said that means that enough of the M&R membership signed a card saying that they as well have had enough. NOW if the NMB gives us a VOTE and AMFA does Not win, then that will be the choice of the M&R class and craft workgroup.

AMFA National is NOT the bargaining unit for AA thus is NOT allowed on AA property, Nor are they allowed to post any information on BB on AA's property.
No matter what accomplishments or Failures that have happened during AMFA's past represented of carriers they have Not had any part of what has Happened HERE.

The Organizers will attempt to schedule meeting places for the M&R class & craft members to GO ask any questions to the National Officers once a determination is made by the NMB to allow a Vote. Any member will then be able to ask any question, voice his/her opinion.
How long is the NMB going to drag this on who knows. AMFA nor the Organizers can do anything to speed this process along.

So putting your oar in the pond to stir up the waters here to me just says your board and have nothing better to do.
He's a former fleet service clerk whose job was eliminated in tulsa. He's very bitter about it but won't admit it. Put him on ignore you will be better for it
 
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swamt

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Oct 23, 2010
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Thanks. Now I see the light behind him. Time to move forward so we don't make the same mistakes of the past.
Agreed. Also this long pause gives AMFA National more time to get prepared for all the Road Shows they will set up for info meetings and Q&A's for the membership to get the real answers instead of all the misinformation and inaccurate details.
 

1AA

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Aug 20, 2002
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Thinking about the decisions or recommendations the NMB made on which groups to add that are currently not Title 1 or Title 2 leaves the company and the Association in a position they never were in before. So if lav service people are in our Title group by definition then we in Title 1 will pick up those positions and the current fleet will be dropped or pushed out. All line stations Title 1 employees have both FAA ratings. Only the shops in overhaul either have two, one or no license ratings but have a skilled rating or acknowledgment of a specific skill. Welders are the ones I'm referring too. I have two ratings and can't weld to save my a$$.
The Association will lose members and the company has to put licensed Title 1 guys to service lavs and push back aircraft. This is what the Association is claiming and the NMB went along with it. I seriously think the company will not have Title 1 service lavs at AMT wages. So if the final say is yes they come to Title 1 then this will cost the company and the Association money. We on the other hand pick up heads and if AMFA is successful they will get those dues that the Association so stupidly gambled away. Does anyone really think the company will allow an AMT to service lavs and pushback live trips or other moves that fleet currently does? The Association took a gamble. That is a desperate move. Lets see how it plays out. I'm sure I left out a few other job functions the Association wants to dump on us.
 
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La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
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If I am mistaken about your career I apologize up front, Your NOT an AMT or even with AA, Nor were you part of the M&R class and craft.
You are 100% percent correct.

I am NOT an AMT, I do NOT work for American Airlines, NOR was I part of the M&R class and craft.

I was a Fleet Service Clerk working at TULE cleaning aircraft interiors, stocking aircraft, replacing upholstery and carpet, that sort of thing.

However my wife IS title one, she DOES work for American Airlines, and she IS part of the M&R class and craft.

I would love to see her get more focused representation.

My comment and question to you.

What HIGH hopes did you have for AMFA?
That you get class and craft representation of course.

What is wrong with wanting to see you accomplish your goals? Especially if my spouse benefits from it.

Until The membership signs enough cards AMFA had NOTHING to do with ALL the drives that have been attempted here at AA. It was all accomplished by a group of people who have had enough of the TWU and Now the ASSOCiation. Failure to collect enough cards was due to the misinformation put out by the TWU, or the failure to bring enough information to the M&R work group by the Organizers to generate interest. The resistance to change due to the insecurity of the membership also played a part in that. It all boils down to the membership NOT AMFA.
I never said it was an AMFA problem. I only said that it is taking a LONG time for the group of people trying to implement change to accomplish their goal. Again..... it has been 20 years.

The current card drive is in the hands of the NMB. We the Organizers turned in enough cards to give the membership a Chance to VOTE. With that said that means that enough of the M&R membership signed a card saying that they as well have had enough. NOW if the NMB gives us a VOTE and AMFA does Not win, then that will be the choice of the M&R class and craft workgroup.
Great. However I have heard this same thing before a couple of times. Maybe the third time is the charm who knows.

AMFA National is NOT the bargaining unit for AA thus is NOT allowed on AA property, Nor are they allowed to post any information on BB on AA's property.
No matter what accomplishments or Failures that have happened during AMFA's past represented of carriers they have Not had any part of what has Happened HERE.
Don't delude yourself. AMFA is giving SOME support to those trying to implement a change for representation. Rather that be information or whatever.

The Organizers will attempt to schedule meeting places for the M&R class & craft members to GO ask any questions to the National Officers once a determination is made by the NMB to allow a Vote. Any member will then be able to ask any question, voice his/her opinion.
How long is the NMB going to drag this on who knows. AMFA nor the Organizers can do anything to speed this process along.
Yes indeed. I am familiar with the concept of bureaucracy. I have mostly conservative outlook remember? Government bureaucracy is a hot button item for conservatives.

So putting your oar in the pond to stir up the waters here to me just says your board and have nothing better to do.
Your response tells me you get butt hurt over any criticism levied at efforts to bring AMFA to American Airlines.

Twenty years............
 

La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
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You left out all the new guys coming into the industry. It's a continuous revolving door. I just don't see your point in this. AMFA or any other union?
Many retired between 1988 and now that signed AMFA cards. They put their time in this career and left. This journey is coming to a close hopefully by the end of the month. Let's see if the NMB does the right thing.
That is a good point. American Airlines has had a lot of churn in the last 5 years or so.
 

La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
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His passion or objectivity as you put it is just that HIS, as with you, your opinion is Yours.
I am sure he appreciates you coming to his "rescue".

If the man has something to say to me let HIM say it.

He 1AA has lost Faith in the current representation, and is looking for something different. a Change. If you are stuck on believing the TWU or the ASSOCiation is going to give your related AA employee a better wage, and career then have them support the ASSOC. when the NMB gives the M&R work group a VOTE.
Yeah? No kidding.

I got so fed up with the UNION BS I left the company remember? We all know TWU is dysfunctional at best. I don't need you to explain to me the fallacy of the TWU. Believe me, when they farm out over 100 people and the ONLY 2 people that don't get displaced or laid off happen to be UNION officers that just happened to have jobs waiting on them the appalling lack representation is obvious.

You have had this explained to you so many times it really is getting OLD.
Then by all means stop explaining.

More to the point stop trying to control or silence viewpoints you don't agree with. You WON'T dictate to me what I choose to say or express.

If you want to control the narrative join the media.


Speaking for 1AA. Trying to control my forum content. You really are full of yourself aren't you? I am sure you see yourself as a great leader of men. :D
 

1AA

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Aug 20, 2002
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Speaking for 1AA. Trying to control my forum content. You really are full of yourself aren't you? I am sure you see yourself as a great leader of men. :D

Remember the first amendment?
What's next? Censorship?
You don't have to speak for me. I'm capable of exercising my first amendment rights. Thank you anyway for being so thoughtful.
 

La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
7,047
2,616
Remember the first amendment?
What's next? Censorship?
You don't have to speak for me. I'm capable of exercising my first amendment rights. Thank you anyway for being so thoughtful.
I think you need to read my whole post again.

I was not claiming to speak for you.

I was listing grievances against AMFAinMIAMI.

He 1AA has lost Faith in the current representation, and is looking for something different.
He was the one attempting to speak for you.

I am sure he appreciates you coming to his "rescue".

If the man has something to say to me let HIM say it.
I was the one stating to let you speak for yourself.

Maybe next time follow the conversation and not just misinterpret one sentence.

Then by all means stop explaining.

More to the point stop trying to control or silence viewpoints you don't agree with. You WON'T dictate to me what I choose to say or express.

If you want to control the narrative join the media.
If anybody is trying to control someone's speech it is AMFAinMIAMI. He is the one trying to censor me.

He's a former fleet service clerk whose job was eliminated in tulsa. He's very bitter about it but won't admit it. Put him on ignore you will be better for it
Thanks. Now I see the light behind him. Time to move forward so we don't make the same mistakes of the past.
Yes exactly. I am bitter how it went down. Things turned out pretty good for me but many of my coworkers weren't as lucky. Over 100 people get laid off and only the 2 UNION officers in the shop did not get displaced or laid off. Those same two also happened to be pushing a concessionary contract. Reeks of an under the table deal.

Try to debase me all you want but I have my issues with the TWU like anyone else. Frankly I would like to see you guys get actual representation instead of a UNION that has no problem with it's local officers stabbing peers in the back and an international that turns a blind eye while under the table deals are made to the detriment of UNION members.
 

AMFAinMIAMI

Veteran
Jun 22, 2012
1,659
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Miami, Fl.
You are 100% percent correct.

I am NOT an AMT, I do NOT work for American Airlines, NOR was I part of the M&R class and craft.

I was a Fleet Service Clerk working at TULE cleaning aircraft interiors, stocking aircraft, replacing upholstery and carpet, that sort of thing.

However my wife IS title one, she DOES work for American Airlines, and she IS part of the M&R class and craft.
I know
I would love to see her get more focused representation.
Good

That you get class and craft representation of course.
Great
What is wrong with wanting to see you accomplish your goals? Especially if my spouse benefits from it.

Nothing
I never said it was an AMFA problem. I only said that it is taking a LONG time for the group of people trying to implement change to accomplish their goal. Again..... it has been 20 years. TRUE it has taken 20 yrs and with that said it mostly has been the same group of members doing all the grunt work to get it to this point. It also has taken this time due to the membership being told by the TWU and NOW the ASSOCiation how AMFA Failed, does not have any $$$$, No Power and so on as you know what has been said here and many other places in all these yrs.
TOO Many people come here to this site and blame AMFA for the failure to bring new representation here to AA. It IS and ALWAYS BE the failure of the MEMBERSHIP. Not signing a card to bring a VOTE to the M&R members.
Great. However I have heard this same thing before a couple of times. Maybe the third time is the charm who knows.


Don't delude yourself. AMFA is giving SOME support to those trying to implement a change for representation. Rather that be information or whatever.
I WAS one of the main members attempting to bring a VOTE to AA, So how much involvement and what was given to the Organizers and when it was given I know it ALL..

Yes indeed. I am familiar with the concept of bureaucracy. I have mostly conservative outlook remember? Government bureaucracy is a hot button item for conservatives.


Your response tells me you get butt hurt over any criticism levied at efforts to bring AMFA to American Airlines.
I don't get butt hurt as you say, I do get bothered when people who are NOT involved or type things here that are incorrect. Placing blame or whatever on the wrong group. Having inside information as to what has happened throughout the last 20 yrs gives me that. I didn't want to bring your wife into this discussion if you re-read my msg. But since you have, Does she have a say or is it just YOU? Being a FSC at TUL and whatever happened there does NOT need to be rehashed again HERE. If you want the BEST for your WIFE, then why the negative? And when you do type your opinion, and some some responds it is due to the fact that so many try to instill in others a doubt about changing representation after a lot of money, time, work has been done by the many guys who are attempting to BRING that better representation to your WIFE.
Twenty years............I am retired I took the package last Sept. I will Not get hurt in any way either way. I am NOT actively involved in this but with my involvement in the last 20 yrs and my participation of actually BRINGiNG the card to the NMB this Time, I just want to see it through as best I can. My Bottom line is to see M&R get a VOTE, Bring AMFA to AA. Remove the CORRUPT TWU & ASSOC. Give the future Class & Craft members a Union which they control.
 

AMFAinMIAMI

Veteran
Jun 22, 2012
1,659
1,814
Miami, Fl.
I am not new to this site. I have been reading it for years. I just decided to join so I could make a statement.
The NMB seems to be doing everything they can to avoid letting us vote. Why?
aajetmech2021;

NO ONE person here on this website is going to be able to answer that question. The AMFA Natl. legal team doesn't understand why either but we all must wait until some ruling from them (NMB) happens one way or the other. As I mentioned earlier on this site, the MX controllers from Alaska who filed for representation in June of last yr are waiting as well. So it's just not AA M&R.

Is it for some political reason, has the AFLCIO laid pressure on the NMB, who knows. Is it because they had minimal staff in the office due to covid like most organizations and companies? Who knows. Maybe it's the US Government just being themselves. The Senate, Congress, most branches of our Government do as they please. I am NOT being Political so NO rebutle needed.

It is a good question. I asked if the membership could do anything to move the process along, or if there was legal way to get the NMB to give AA's M&R an answer. The answer I got was nothing can be done. So AA M&R must just wait..
 
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1AA

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
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www.usaviation.com
End of the month has arrived.
Hopefully some good news soon.
Maybe August will bring more surprises. So if this filing went the average length and AMFA won representation think how much dues money the Association would have lost and AMFA would have gained. Assuming the Association will lose representation all they can do is try to stall and collect as much dues as possible.
 

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