Teamsters card drive

Who would sign a Teamsters card, if a card drive started tomorrow?

  • yes

    Votes: 5 14.3%
  • no

    Votes: 30 85.7%

  • Total voters
    35

767 mechanic

Veteran
Aug 8, 2004
543
528
If there was no one station agreement and the show was on the other foot and dfw was closing and afw knew it would they agree to a one station agreement? No they would not, the closing sucks but it is what it is. The juniority system has been on place for over 50 years at aa. What does suck is when the international cuts deals and screws the membership.

The international cut 2 deals in the last 2 layoffs. 1 happened when the hangar shut down at AFW and the second happened when TAESL shut down. Both happened with 591s knowledge and the 1st layoff happened with lorenzi helping Kevin Lyons get the people to DWH that he wanted. It doesn't matter how you look at it there are people on the street,forced to retire,forced to move their famlies or commuting against their will because the TWU international did not want to follow the CONTRACT. If a person gets screwed because of the contract that is the luck of the draw. If you get screwed by somebody cutting a deal so that they can help someone else or a buddy of there's then that is a different story and that is wrong and the history of the twu.
 
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dfw gen

Veteran
Dec 1, 2011
3,774
2,611
You sir are absolutely correct. The second deal was David virella who allowed and agreed to the deal that allowed Lorenzi to escape.
 

swamt

Veteran
Oct 23, 2010
12,063
4,742
The international cut 2 deals in the last 2 layoffs. 1 happened when the hangar shut down at AFW and the second happened when TAESL shut down. Both happened with 591s knowledge and the 1st layoff happened with lorenzi helping Kevin Lyons get the people to DWH that he wanted. It doesn't matter how you look at it there are people on the street,forced to retire,forced to move their famlies or commuting against their will because the TWU international did not want to follow the CONTRACT. If a person gets screwed because of the contract that is the luck of the draw. If you get screwed by somebody cutting a deal so that they can help someone else or a buddy of there's then that is a different story and that is wrong and the history of the twu.

Yes. 100% correct. I remember this all blowing up in DFW area. How they got away with it is still beyond me. Yet another reason to get rid of this union and out of our industry.
 

Vortilon

Veteran
Jun 22, 2004
2,052
2,124
USA
Well as some seen it as a symbolic gesture of a screwing the ones who took the screwdriver verified the gesture as reality. They wanted to show the guys who refused the symbolic gesture that it was not symbolic but a reality. I thank the guys who took the symbolic screwdriver to verify its authenticity in sacrificing for the non believers such as myself.


Last time I checked there was about 300 + mechs on transfer list to dfw with a lot of them with over 20 years as a mech.

But now there is a one station agreement between DWH and DFW, where an OSM at DWH can upgrade to mech at dfw before the most senior mech on transfer list 32 years seniority from MIA can transfer to dfw.

The only thing we really have anymore in our contract is seniority and the IGM Texas addition is protecting themselves, at the expense of everyone else. Looking forward to a time where there are no special deals and it is a level playing field for all. You go where your seniority will take you.


I know that the transfers from DWH to DFW have had a priority over the rest of the system since DWH first became independent from DFW in 2010. Can't argue over the preferential treatment that the folks from AFW received when the base was closed. I had one AFW refugee tell me how he shouldn't have been forced to go to DWH before eventually ending up at DFW. I just laughed at him, and reminded him of the special deal cut to save them from being forced to bump where the juniority openings were in the system. Now, should some sort of headcount reduction occur, these privileged AFW refugees will remain while quite possibly some 20 years at DFW AMTs - would be forced to bump elsewhere. Haven't looked at the AMT x-fer list in awhile, but I really can't see DFW taking on anymore AMTs. Though; oddly enough, they were hiring off the street on the USAir side.
 

AA89

Veteran
Jun 1, 2010
690
320
Transfers into DFW go by seniority. Seniority got those mechanics from DWH into DFW last year. Not a special deal.
If straight seniority had been used in the TAESL RIF I'd be willing to bet most TAESL mechanics would have stayed local and DWH and DFW would have been flooded with 250 somewhat high seniority mechanics. Amazing how there were 146 openings at DWH and many more around the system but none at DFW. I understand the history of the non-bumping BS at AA but all it does is give the company an easy path to layoffs.
 

TWUBeliever

Member
Nov 5, 2013
16
2
Thanks Bob. I agree with most of the things you said here actually and the ones I don't quite agree with I'm not going to argue with you out of personal respect.

On the last line though all you have to do is read how FSC people are treated (I earn it myself some) when any of us comment on one of their threads and "maybe" that's why some people feel the way they do "unfortunately" about Maintenance. But there is some level of reciprocation which I find personally shameful.

Yes I did hear that Lombardo and co. did try to get us out of the deal but Little made sure it was rock solid. The CWA thing we're not completely out of yet either. There's still the matter of a lease agreement in DC (Whether it's a good place to be or not) That lease seems pretty expensive but what do I know about Real Estate prices in the Nations Capital?

Did you ever hear a rumor that Pike, Danker and Peterson were asked to take a seat but none of them could decide amongst each other? (Since you put this out there) I'm not 100% committed to this "Autonomy" thing myself but it's the price to be paid for the Little regimes heavy hand I guess?

I like Doyle and Virella was cool with me but we both know experience or not they put their best foot forward and went full bore for Lombardo against Gordon so that's not a surprise. But no 100% you need to have a Maintenance guy in the ATD 100%. I have ZERO argument against that. Maybe Gless put a bitter taste in some people's mouths but it's high time to put him in the past and move forward, IMO. I'm hopping it happens after we get that JCBA and if not I would gladly join anyone who would have me in that push. (Frankly Peterson has really impressed me lately)

As for Samuelsen I don't know the man personally but I like the "real" stories I've read about him in the papers. And if he doesn't know the Airlines I hope he's a quick learner and has people that will force feed it down his throat if need be? Otherwise for now Garcia knows our issues very well in the meantime. But Political activation for Aircraft Maintenance HAS to become a future primary focus, again IMO. I just don't read much of a push in that area from anyone where I think it should be. And that goes for AMFA, IAM, IBT and the TWU as well.
 

TWUBeliever

Member
Nov 5, 2013
16
2
Stacked the ATD with all Flleet guys? Do any of you remember willing to vote for Lombardo IF he fired the maintenance reps at the ATD and not replace them in favor of Local Autonomy? AMT's demanded the Int'l stay out of their business both daily and at the contract negotiating table. Lombardo had no problem with that cause the AA AMT's were at the bottom of his totem pole before during and after he got elected and had zero interest in learning the airline side of things. Is a good leader someone who stands T podiums screaming into the mic making it sound good that he's going to do whatever it takes for a work group and doing nothing after his ra ra speech ? The salary increases we got were pre-determined by Little & Co. long before they turned in their keys. He got his salary bump and final pension bump destroyed the lives and families of over 25 (more) people with all those firings and is now gone while we are in the hands of a mad man and his band of self -serving snakes. I guess it's one of those be careful what you ask for you just might get it. When in comes to the interests of maintenance with or without the JCBA the level of union incompetence and inflated egos is at an all time high. Say what you want the last crew were AA/airline guys and actually gave a ****. The rhetoric & propaganda you all not only bought into 4 years ago but you wanted to buy into it and were obsessed with it and I'm sorry the truth is pretty much at the surface and come to fruition that we don't matter anymore. Look in the mirror and look around your work area for who is to blame cause it clearly wasn't the last Int'l board we are now in he hands of monsters
 

bob@las-AA

Veteran
May 10, 2011
1,884
523
DFW Airport
Stacked the ATD with all Flleet guys? Do any of you remember willing to vote for Lombardo IF he fired the maintenance reps at the ATD and not replace them in favor of Local Autonomy? AMT's demanded the Int'l stay out of their business both daily and at the contract negotiating table. Lombardo had no problem with that cause the AA AMT's were at the bottom of his totem pole before during and after he got elected and had zero interest in learning the airline side of things. Is a good leader someone who stands T podiums screaming into the mic making it sound good that he's going to do whatever it takes for a work group and doing nothing after his ra ra speech ? The salary increases we got were pre-determined by Little & Co. long before they turned in their keys. He got his salary bump and final pension bump destroyed the lives and families of over 25 (more) people with all those firings and is now gone while we are in the hands of a mad man and his band of self -serving snakes. I guess it's one of those be careful what you ask for you just might get it. When in comes to the interests of maintenance with or without the JCBA the level of union incompetence and inflated egos is at an all time high. Say what you want the last crew were AA/airline guys and actually gave a ****. The rhetoric & propaganda you all not only bought into 4 years ago but you wanted to buy into it and were obsessed with it and I'm sorry the truth is pretty much at the surface and come to fruition that we don't matter anymore. Look in the mirror and look around your work area for who is to blame cause it clearly wasn't the last Int'l board we are now in he hands of monsters
And a card drive would change everything? It would be a name change only, everything else would remain the same.
 

WeAAsles

Veteran
Oct 20, 2007
21,625
5,278
And a card drive would change everything? It would be a name change only, everything else would remain the same.


The person who wrote all of that could care less about any card drive. It was written by someone who apparently believed once anyone is appointed to a job in the TWU it's a "lifetime" position and they can never be removed.

I guess their lives were ruined when they had to go back to their old jobs?
 

La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
6,924
2,611
The international cut 2 deals in the last 2 layoffs. 1 happened when the hangar shut down at AFW and the second happened when TAESL shut down. Both happened with 591s knowledge and the 1st layoff happened with lorenzi helping Kevin Lyons get the people to DWH that he wanted. It doesn't matter how you look at it there are people on the street,forced to retire,forced to move their famlies or commuting against their will because the TWU international did not want to follow the CONTRACT. If a person gets screwed because of the contract that is the luck of the draw. If you get screwed by somebody cutting a deal so that they can help someone else or a buddy of there's then that is a different story and that is wrong and the history of the twu.
No one seemed to mind when they did that to the Fleet Service Clerks of TUL and TULE. In fact I got told by mechanics quite often that they had no use for Fleet Service and they thought the company should get rid of us.

They were not shy about giving there opinion about how much they didn't want us there.

I remember Fleet Service Clerks were told to shut up or shut their mouth during TWU 514 local meetings.

I heard a few mechanics wished we were back after they had to pull rugs and tape. Guess it did not agree with their back, having seen many FSC's (including myself) suffer back injuries from doing that job I can certainly understand why.

I appreciate the history lesson but UNITY needs to start with the membership. There was no UNITY in 514, not for FSC's anyway.


Respectfully,
A coattail riding Fleet Service Clerk
 

Real tired

Veteran
Jul 29, 2007
733
342
Pit
Visit site
No one seemed to mind when they did that to the Fleet Service Clerks of TUL and TULE. In fact I got told by mechanics quite often that they had no use for Fleet Service and they thought the company should get rid of us.

They were not shy about giving there opinion about how much they didn't want us there.

I remember Fleet Service Clerks were told to shut up or shut their mouth during TWU 514 local meetings.

I heard a few mechanics wished we were back after they had to pull rugs and tape. Guess it did not agree with their back, having seen many FSC's (including myself) suffer back injuries from doing that job I can certainly understand why.

I appreciate the history lesson but UNITY needs to start with the membership. There was no UNITY in 514, not for FSC's anyway.


Respectfully,
A coattail riding Fleet Service Clerk

Thanks for the history lesson. Now one for you.

Our Fleet used to be Teamsters, but some years back, voted overwhelmingly to go non-union. This was lead, by the most part, by our "strong fighting brothers" in that right to work state, North Carolina, staffed mostly with Piedmont employees.

The company forced these people to mandatory movies they HAD to watch on how bad the union was for them, and how great the company could be. They bought it hook, line and sinker.

It was 10 long years of bloodshed where the company could fire their "at will" Fleet employees if they wore the wrong hat, or didn't cut their hair correctly. Many lost their job. Lots of suckin' up to stay employed.

After 10 years the IAM came to the Maintenance and related (Mechanic, Stock clerk, Utility) and started to wage a "Strength in numbers" campaign. And we bought it hook, line and sinker.

So for a long period, M&R organized the Fleet. And why? Because they couldn't. If any of them even whisper the word union while on the clock, the were immediately terminated. So we risked our jobs and help organize these people while on the clock. We used the company printer for flyers that we loaded in the bag bin to get the info out to the out stations. We invited them to our meetings.

After learning it was a better deal to be unionized, they voted to join the IAM and sign up for the IAM National Pension Plan.

As soon as they did, the lumped them into our local. And the meetings became out of control. The yelling and screaming, like, "The Mechanics have this and that, I want this and that too !!!!" It got so bad we stopped going to our own meetings. So the result was the company said, we can't give what the Mechanic have to Fleet service people, and they are all one, so we'll just give nothing to nobody.

That lead to years of cost neutral, and concessionary contract to both sides. And it also was a start to a new 141-M and finally their own 142.

And from that day there has been no unity between our groups. We lost push backs and the Fleet were like, "Great, we got pushbacks. F the Mechanics." We lost de-icing, we lost APU starts, we lost gate moves and we're just about to lose Maintenance moves. And what do I hear but, "Great, we got it. F the Mechanics."

Now you know where the "coat tail riding Fleet Service" comes from on our side. Never once in the years since we helped organize them, have I ever heard a Fleet person ever say "thanks" or try and stand up for Maintenance as the company shifts our traditional work to them.

There's no unity here either, brother.
 

Vortilon

Veteran
Jun 22, 2004
2,052
2,124
USA
No one seemed to mind when they did that to the Fleet Service Clerks of TUL and TULE. In fact I got told by mechanics quite often that they had no use for Fleet Service and they thought the company should get rid of us.

They were not shy about giving there opinion about how much they didn't want us there.

I remember Fleet Service Clerks were told to shut up or shut their mouth during TWU 514 local meetings.

I heard a few mechanics wished we were back after they had to pull rugs and tape. Guess it did not agree with their back, having seen many FSC's (including myself) suffer back injuries from doing that job I can certainly understand why.

I appreciate the history lesson but UNITY needs to start with the membership. There was no UNITY in 514, not for FSC's anyway.


Respectfully,
A coattail riding Fleet Service Clerk



That's funny, cause I can remember going to union meetings at DFW back in the day when FSCs and AMTs were in the same local, and it was just the opposite. Most of the meetings were all about FSCs, and their issues. I mean, at the time, we had part time FSCs voting on issues or contracts for AMTs. It's no secret that the two groups have a divisive history, from an AMTs perspective, FSCs have been shown a lot more favoritism than AMTs from the international. I don't wish any group ill will in getting the best contract they can get on their own merits. I never saw the value in AMTs being lumped in with so many other groups. History shows, I was correct. On the other hand, the international sure did. Why do you think the FAs got out of the TWU back in the 70s? AMTs need to do the same thing; if for no other reason, to eliminate the element of having the International playing their favoritism games. I have seen the shite go on - for the better part of 32 years now.
 

La Li Lu Le Lo

Veteran
May 29, 2010
6,924
2,611
Thanks for the history lesson. Now one for you.

Our Fleet used to be Teamsters, but some years back, voted overwhelmingly to go non-union. This was lead, by the most part, by our "strong fighting brothers" in that right to work state, North Carolina, staffed mostly with Piedmont employees.

The company forced these people to mandatory movies they HAD to watch on how bad the union was for them, and how great the company could be. They bought it hook, line and sinker.

It was 10 long years of bloodshed where the company could fire their "at will" Fleet employees if they wore the wrong hat, or didn't cut their hair correctly. Many lost their job. Lots of suckin' up to stay employed.

After 10 years the IAM came to the Maintenance and related (Mechanic, Stock clerk, Utility) and started to wage a "Strength in numbers" campaign. And we bought it hook, line and sinker.

So for a long period, M&R organized the Fleet. And why? Because they couldn't. If any of them even whisper the word union while on the clock, the were immediately terminated. So we risked our jobs and help organize these people while on the clock. We used the company printer for flyers that we loaded in the bag bin to get the info out to the out stations. We invited them to our meetings.

After learning it was a better deal to be unionized, they voted to join the IAM and sign up for the IAM National Pension Plan.

As soon as they did, the lumped them into our local. And the meetings became out of control. The yelling and screaming, like, "The Mechanics have this and that, I want this and that too !!!!" It got so bad we stopped going to our own meetings. So the result was the company said, we can't give what the Mechanic have to Fleet service people, and they are all one, so we'll just give nothing to nobody.

That lead to years of cost neutral, and concessionary contract to both sides. And it also was a start to a new 141-M and finally their own 142.

And from that day there has been no unity between our groups. We lost push backs and the Fleet were like, "Great, we got pushbacks. F the Mechanics." We lost de-icing, we lost APU starts, we lost gate moves and we're just about to lose Maintenance moves. And what do I hear but, "Great, we got it. F the Mechanics."

Now you know where the "coat tail riding Fleet Service" comes from on our side. Never once in the years since we helped organize them, have I ever heard a Fleet person ever say "thanks" or try and stand up for Maintenance as the company shifts our traditional work to them.

There's no unity here either, brother.


The teamsters were obviously not "getting it done" or they would have never been shown the door.

As far as the mass firings.... are you telling me you have never had to endure some dead weight, lazy b*****d that should have been fired years ago? The one bad thing about a UNION is garbage tends to pile up over time. I am sure many did lose their jobs but I also bet a lot of them had it coming and should have been fired long ago. You invite that when you have people retaining employment by membership instead of merit.

The IAM was not interested in organizing a UNION. What they were interested in is economic gain. I have no doubt in my mind the Fleet Service Clerks demands were being fueled by the IAM itself. I mean after all the IAM got what they wanted, dues coming in and money flowing into the IAMNPF.

They (the IAM) used you.

That's funny, cause I can remember going to union meetings at DFW back in the day when FSCs and AMTs were in the same local, and it was just the opposite. Most of the meetings were all about FSCs, and their issues. I mean, at the time, we had part time FSCs voting on issues or contracts for AMTs. It's no secret that the two groups have a divisive history, from an AMTs perspective, FSCs have been shown a lot more favoritism than AMTs from the international. I don't wish any group ill will in getting the best contract they can get on their own merits. I never saw the value in AMTs being lumped in with so many other groups. History shows, I was correct. On the other hand, the international sure did. Why do you think the FAs got out of the TWU back in the 70s? AMTs need to do the same thing; if for no other reason, to eliminate the element of having the International playing their favoritism games. I have seen the shite go on - for the better part of 32 years now.
Nobody is disagreeing with you. However this has nothing to do with the FSC's and everything to do with UNION tactics for padding their pocket. Put the blame where it belongs.