Industrial vs. Craft

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Anomaly

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Jun 2, 2012
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Is that your story?

Seems to me you left out quite abit. You try to make it out to be an innocent transgression with yout statement...



The petitions were passed around the meeting and the BA ask attending members to sign. He also attended shop steward weekly meetings where he asked them to get the petitions signed.

The BA was found guilty of using union resources to aid in an indivduals campaign, the investigator went so far as to call it a "text book example".

I have the report if you'd like me to post it here, rest assured it wasn't as innocent as you make out.

As for the rest, you illustrate my point perfectly.



You freely admit...for political purposes.

(just an aside, you claim ... "for political purposes" ...did it ever occur to you maybe the person in question did it because it was the right thing to do? The BA was found in violation)

All that being said you also left out the fallout that occured following this investigation where suddenly the Chief steward involved got brought up on charges....which of course went nowhere but the games were on, and continued on through the rest of the election cycle.......once again, you claim to be in SFO yet you either conviently forgot this or in fact weren;t aware of it.

As for your generalized statements against AMFA, while you may not have seen action, I have. You make vague claims of power grabs that worked against members...Like What?

Alls I have to do is turn to the back page of the teamster journal, or visit temaster.net and read a litany of actions by fellow teamsters that work against the members. You claim AMFA is worse, when it the teamsters STILL under federal oversight.
By all means, lets see the FULL report. Not and edited version, post the whole thing. Including the violation, discipline and remedy. PLEASE POST IT.

Alls I have to do is wonder if your post is as accurate as you pretend, why did we switch to the Teamsters? And why are we still Teamsters? Could it be that so many of us are beginning to appreciate how comfortable life can be under a Teamster contract? If you have no idea what I am talking about, you should sign up for a field trip. These things BANK. And I a STILL able to bust your chops once in a while. ALL of the guys on my crew agree, we are making more money than we ever have. Create any story you want, but this Teamster contract is better than anything we have ever had before. THAT IS A FACT.
 

ThirdSeatHero

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Dec 8, 2004
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Here is the full report. Sorry for the header on it, the normal teamster site I get downloads from has removed it, but scroll past the first page flyer, and the full report is there.

Notice under "findings of fact" the BAs actions were a bit more egregious than your "inadvertently, unknowingly, or mistakenly" description of events.

http://mechanicsforchange.com/files/bp_03.pdf

As for you your opinion on the CBA, that's all that it is...your opinion. Not fact.

Others say different.
 
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xUT

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SanFranFreako, KommieFornia
Here is the full report. Sorry for the header on it, the normal teamster site I get downloads from has removed it, but scroll past the first page flyer, and the full report is there.

Notice under "findings of fact" the BAs actions were a bit more egregious than your "inadvertently, unknowingly, or mistakenly" description of events.

http://mechanicsforc...files/bp_03.pdf

As for you your opinion on the CBA, that's all that it is...your opinion. Not fact.

Others say different.
Say it isn't so...DOH!
B) xUT
 

Anomaly

Veteran
Jun 2, 2012
1,220
218
Here is the full report. Sorry for the header on it, the normal teamster site I get downloads from has removed it, but scroll past the first page flyer, and the full report is there.

Notice under "findings of fact" the BAs actions were a bit more egregious than your "inadvertently, unknowingly, or mistakenly" description of events.

http://mechanicsforc...files/bp_03.pdf

As for you your opinion on the CBA, that's all that it is...your opinion. Not fact.

Others say different.

WOW.....this was a serious issue. :shock: This was SOOO serious, that the Local was forced to post election rules in both English and Spanish on all union bulletin boards. :huh:

Tell me your not serious about pretending that this had anything to do with the election results. Hoffa won the election with 60% of the membership vote. The other two candidates came in with 23% and 17% respectively. The petition in question was to get Hoffa on the ballot which had an even greater margin of success.

My point is this: you make slighted statements in an attempt to deceive the readers in this post.

"Just as example under the ibt here in SFO during the latest international election one of our Chief stewards reported on one of our BAs who later under investigation was found guilty of election violations."

The IAM took it even further by tagging the headline; "This constitutes election fraud"

If I wrote: Seeham Found Guilty of Illegal Activity During Business Associated With AMFA, and failed to mention he received a parking ticket while meeting with a member, you and the TWU informer would be jumping all over my comments as lie's, fear, and smear. By all accounts, you are doing exactly this.

However. I do appreciate the time you took to post the entire case. I had mistakenly believed you were speaking of my Local's BA, Earl Averette, who was inadvertently turned in by Chief Steward Pat Conlan for leaving the petitions on the sign in table.

Regardless, the case is now here to read, (once you get past the IAM BS) and each person can decide for themselves if it was an innocent mistake, or if the election was truly marred by this act. I think there will be two completely different points of view, but still, the facts are now fully displayed.

That is all I ask.
 
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xUT

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SanFranFreako, KommieFornia
WOW.....this was a serious issue. :shock: This was SOOO serious, that the Local was forced to post election rules in both English and Spanish on all union bulletin boards. :huh:

Tell me your not serious about pretending that this had anything to do with the election results. Hoffa won the election with 60% of the membership vote. The other two candidates came in with 23% and 17% respectively. The petition in question was to get Hoffa on the ballot which had an even greater margin of success.

My point is this: you make slighted statements in an attempt to deceive the readers in this post.

"Just as example under the ibt here in SFO during the latest international election one of our Chief stewards reported on one of our BAs who later under investigation was found guilty of election violations."

The IAM took it even further by tagging the headline; "This constitutes election fraud"

If I wrote: Seeham Found Guilty of Illegal Activity During Business Associated With AMFA, and failed to mention he received a parking ticket while meeting with a member, you and the TWU informer would be jumping all over my comments as lie's, fear, and smear. By all accounts, you are doing exactly this.

However. I do appreciate the time you took to post the entire case. I had mistakenly believed you were speaking of my Local's BA, Earl Averette, who was inadvertently turned in by Chief Steward Pat Conlan for leaving the petitions on the sign in table.

Regardless, the case is now here to read, (once you get past the IAM BS) and each person can decide for themselves if it was an innocent mistake, or if the election was truly marred by this act. I think there will be two completely different points of view, but still, the facts are now fully displayed.

That is all I ask.

You had your A$$ handed to you and you come up with this BS?
Rich, Dan, Paul and their minions have complained, undermined AMFA since day one.
(Funny how they were IAM OFFICIALS but switched to reamsters and kicked the IAM to the curb...DOH!).
How many LOA's has the reamsters implemented without membership vote and/or knowledge?
Kiss the ring sweet cheeks and admit you were wrong.
B) xUT
 
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ThirdSeatHero

Veteran
Dec 8, 2004
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Left Coast
WOW.....this was a serious issue. :shock: This was SOOO serious, that the Local was forced to post election rules in both English and Spanish on all union bulletin boards. :huh:

Tell me your not serious about pretending that this had anything to do with the election results. Hoffa won the election with 60% of the membership vote. The other two candidates came in with 23% and 17% respectively. The petition in question was to get Hoffa on the ballot which had an even greater margin of success.

My point is this: you make slighted statements in an attempt to deceive the readers in this post.

"Just as example under the ibt here in SFO during the latest international election one of our Chief stewards reported on one of our BAs who later under investigation was found guilty of election violations."

The IAM took it even further by tagging the headline; "This constitutes election fraud"

If I wrote: Seeham Found Guilty of Illegal Activity During Business Associated With AMFA, and failed to mention he received a parking ticket while meeting with a member, you and the TWU informer would be jumping all over my comments as lie's, fear, and smear. By all accounts, you are doing exactly this.

However. I do appreciate the time you took to post the entire case. I had mistakenly believed you were speaking of my Local's BA, Earl Averette, who was inadvertently turned in by Chief Steward Pat Conlan for leaving the petitions on the sign in table.

Regardless, the case is now here to read, (once you get past the IAM BS) and each person can decide for themselves if it was an innocent mistake, or if the election was truly marred by this act. I think there will be two completely different points of view, but still, the facts are now fully displayed.

That is all I ask.

Keeping things in context, I made no attempts to deceive the readers. My original point was not about the severity of the issue, or its effect/non-effect on the Hoffa election. I made this statement to another poster....

I offered my take on this because there are some posts here that are more outlandish than factual. Did we have recalls in AMFA? Yes. Were they happening everyday? No. Was there cases of politic based infighting Yes, but no more so than in the ibt or IAM. Just as example under the ibt here in SFO during the latest international election one of our Chief stewards reported on one of our BAs who later under investigation was found guilty of election violations.....does that mean its happening every day? No.

I cited the issue to make the point that politics is prevalent in all unions and none more so than the other to any great degree.

After I made this post you tried to down play the event I cited and its severity, which was never my original point. I only delved further into this becuase of your description of events which didn't fit the facts of the case.

You yourself admit you mistakenly thought I was refering to another BA (Averette), that clearly wasn't the case.



 
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Tex-Mech

Veteran
WOW.....this was a serious issue. :shock: This was SOOO serious, that the Local was forced to post election rules in both English and Spanish on all union bulletin boards. :huh:

Teamster Boy, in case you missed the memo, none of us are interested in paying $400 a year more in dues to live under a turd of a contract from the twu. So go away, and try again in six years. We need our money to pay for the medical cost increases, and you can't negotiate for us until 2018. Goodbye
 
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xUT

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Dec 28, 2009
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SanFranFreako, KommieFornia
Teamster Boy, in case you missed the memo, none of us are interested in paying $400 a year more in dues to live under a turd of a contract from the twu. So go away, and try again in six years. We need our money to pay for the medical cost increases, and you can't negotiate for us until 2018. Goodbye
You haven't heard the reamster lie "we can open section 6 negotiations if certified".
Know how this works? Reamsters request negotiations, Da Company says "sorry we have a contract".
Been there, done that, no T-Shirt.
Take Care and Best to 'everyone'!
B) xUT
 
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TWU informer

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Nov 4, 2003
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You haven't heard the reamster lie "we can open section 6 negotiations if certified".
Know how this works? Reamsters request negotiations, Da Company says "sorry we have a contract".
Been there, done that, no T-Shirt.
Take Care and Best to 'everyone'!
B) xUT

That exact lie was distributed at last weeks Teamsters false information meeting.
 
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aapitbull

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Oct 4, 2002
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hotmail.com
That exact lie was distributed at last weeks Teamsters false information meeting.



If you want to pay more dues for the same lies and the same misrepresentation sign a Teamster card. The two organizations are the same.Industrial Union sloganism hell the Teamsters bought a sign in Tulsa their Motto WE CAN WIN they should add BUT YOU WILL LOSE!
 
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Anomaly

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Jun 2, 2012
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Keeping things in context, I made no attempts to deceive the readers. My original point was not about the severity of the issue, or its effect/non-effect on the Hoffa election. I made this statement to another poster....



I cited the issue to make the point that politics is prevalent in all unions and none more so than the other to any great degree.

After I made this post you tried to down play the event I cited and its severity, which was never my original point. I only delved further into this becuase of your description of events which didn't fit the facts of the case.

You yourself admit you mistakenly thought I was refering to another BA (Averette), that clearly wasn't the case.

Agreed. But my point too, is at least one of the predominant names on the protest was later invited to attend the negotiations to see for himself what happens at these proceedings. I think even he may have a different view. I understand he is on the latest UAL negotiating committee as well. I do not know him well, but would venture to say he would NOT be part of the process if he truly believed elections were marred. I think you know the former ALR I am speaking of.
 

DNTULSA

Senior
Sep 22, 2009
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Hey amaladingdong,

Your back!

you have had 444 posts, and been swatted 284 times.

You should ask the twu for a raise for the splendid job you are doing! (snicker)
 
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