AMFA Organizing Drive to Replace Association

[1AA]

Will the twu stick it to the iam?

The TWU is sticking to all of us. Anyone who still thinks that a TWU write in is better than the Association needs to realize the TWU is the other half of the Association. Time to let it all go. They represented us for over 75 years at AA. That book is worn out. You can't even turn those pages anymore. Let's not forget with too many choices and no majority we lose union representation all together. No clear majority and we are sitting ducks.

 

[767 mechanic]

The TWU is sticking to all of us. Anyone who still thinks that a TWU write in is better than the Association needs to realize the TWU is the other half of the Association. Time to let it all go. They represented us for over 75 years at AA. That book is worn out. You can't even turn those pages anymore. Let's not forget with too many choices and no majority we lose union representation all together. No clear majority and we are sitting ducks.

I suggest you check your facts on your last two sentences. If I remember correctly around 2012 that rule about no union was changed. The only way we would be without a union is if the majority of votes cast were for no union. The ballot would show Ass AMFA No union and a write in. In that order. Lets say that the Ass got 35% Amfa 40% no union 10% and the write ins recieved 15% of the votes cast. The top 2 AMFA and the Ass would have a 2nd vote and the one that recieved over 50% of the votes cast would win. The only other way it would go is if in the 1st vote one of the possibilities recieved more than 50% of votes cast.

 

[dfw gen]

I suggest you check your facts on your last two sentences. If I remember correctly around 2012 that rule about no union was changed. The only way we would be without a union is if the majority of votes cast were for no union. The ballot would show Ass AMFA No union and a write in. In that order. Lets say that the Ass got 35% Amfa 40% no union 10% and the write ins recieved 15% of the votes cast. The top 2 AMFA and the Ass would have a 2nd vote and the one that recieved over 50% of the votes cast would win. The only other way it would go is if in the 1st vote one of the possibilities recieved more than 50% of votes cast.

I believe you are correct. I can't imagine a vote going two rounds. With the apathy of twu and Iam members and the resolve of these wanting change i would think its one vote and done.

 

[swamt]

Its 21 out of 30. 3 of them out on leave but they still vote...until Jerry Glass files the challenge that you can't carve them out ot TO...so true...all of it.

Tell ya what, I'll give ya some benefit just for the hell of it. I will concede and meet ya in the middle of the two differences from your numbers and AMFA's numbers. So now let's just settle and call it 75% just for rounding purposes. But what is funny here is if ya include those 3 on leave as supporting an AMFA election then the numbers exactly match what AMFA National reported at 80% cards plus. No matter the numbers you prefer to use, it does not change the fact that well over 3/4's of the JB MC's want to be represented by the Class and Craft AMFA union representation, period. Those are big %'s when collecting cards under a grass roots effort no matter the size of the group attaining signed cards.

 

[swamt]

I suggest you check your facts on your last two sentences. If I remember correctly around 2012 that rule about no union was changed. The only way we would be without a union is if the majority of votes cast were for no union. The ballot would show Ass AMFA No union and a write in. In that order. Lets say that the Ass got 35% Amfa 40% no union 10% and the write ins recieved 15% of the votes cast. The top 2 AMFA and the Ass would have a 2nd vote and the one that recieved over 50% of the votes cast would win. The only other way it would go is if in the 1st vote one of the possibilities recieved more than 50% of votes cast.

I believe you are correct. I can't imagine a vote going two rounds. With the apathy of twu and Iam members and the resolve of these wanting change i would think its one vote and done.

I too believe he is correct. The only 2 ways that I know of are as you said, if the majority actually voted no union. Also if the majority of the membership called for a decertification of their union representation. The later I have never seen or remember even hearing of being done without another entity in place to continue representation of said group. Kinda like (I think?) the MC's did at AA when they got rid of the TWU (that could have been the meteorologist) can't remember.
I also would think there will only be one vote. Too many are just fed up with how this asso is being ran, and most @AA are sick and tired of the TWU ways of representation over 3 decades plus with their past records. I also think there will be some silent voters come out once there is an actual vote called for. Some folks out there just don't like nor want confrontations so they will stay silent on their beliefs and let their voices be heard silently during the vote by selecting AMFA.
I would expect the TWU to try and do something desperate to keep their name in the game with or without the IAM. The IAM strong armed the TWU into the agreement and they are strong arming them still with managing the majority of control over the TWU. It's time to get rid of the 2 entity operation with the control changing all the time and they never to this day have agreed to anything unanimously, and they never will. The head butting will continue forever if these 2 unions remain and you guys will be fighting very, very long and dragged out nego's every time the contract comes due.

On a side note: I am still not sure if the TWU can do a write-in as they are already on said ballot as the combined asso (TWU/IAM). Maybe I am wrong here, but anyone have a clarification?

Let's take somewhat of a pole; Does anyone think there will be a ruling (final) by the NMB this month??? Here we are already mid August and still no ruling...

 

[cessna210g]

No. I think we will be lucky to have a ruling before the end of the year.

 

[Rogallo]

This decade for sure!

 

[Timid Weak Union]

Will the twu stick it to the iam?

FREE AT LAST.....FREE AT LAST....SCREW TWU AND IAM!!!!!!!!!

 

[chellow]

On a side note: I am still not sure if the TWU can do a write-in as they are already on said ballot as the combined asso (TWU/IAM). Maybe I am wrong here, but anyone have a clarification?

Ref: NATIONAL MEDIATION BOARD REPRESENTATION MANUAL ( Page 16)

"SECTION 13.201

Telephone and Internet Voting Instructions

The Instructions consist of the Telephone and Internet Voting Instructions, and an Access Code. It is NMB practice to list the incumbent, the applicant, the intervenor, the “write-in” option, and the “no representative” option in descending order on the Instructions. If there is no incumbent and more than one applicant or intervenor, the Investigator will determine the placement of the names."

"14.305-2 Valid Ballots

Valid ballots cast for representation include “write-in” ballots
which clearly indicate the voter’s desire for representation.
Voters must “write-in” the name of a specific organization or
individual to cast a valid vote."



I don't see anyone but TWU officers doing this ...... LOL ... as far as I know you can write anything even Mickey Mouse.

 

[swamt]

Ref: NATIONAL MEDIATION BOARD REPRESENTATION MANUAL ( Page 16)

"SECTION 13.201

Telephone and Internet Voting Instructions

The Instructions consist of the Telephone and Internet Voting Instructions, and an Access Code. It is NMB practice to list the incumbent, the applicant, the intervenor, the “write-in” option, and the “no representative” option in descending order on the Instructions. If there is no incumbent and more than one applicant or intervenor, the Investigator will determine the placement of the names."

"14.305-2 Valid Ballots

Valid ballots cast for representation include “write-in” ballots
which clearly indicate the voter’s desire for representation.
Voters must “write-in” the name of a specific organization or
individual to cast a valid vote."



I don't see anyone but TWU officers doing this ...... LOL ... as far as I know you can write anything even Mickey Mouse.

Good info, thx for sharing. It will be interesting watching the route that the asso takes with this upcoming vote announcement. Also very curious to how the co. will react as well.
Also thinking down the road here; Let's say the vote happens and AMFA wins by a good majority. Will this be the demise of the asso.? Will they finally see that it really is a failure from the get go and split the 2 entities back into 2 separate unions as they were before?? And maybe the TWU could repay the IAM by going out and drumming up new recruited members from the IAM represented work groups as a poke in the eye for what they did to the TWU. Could get interesting indeed...

 

[Rogallo]

Sito Sues The IAM.

Top Airline Labor Leader Sues His Union, Saying He Lost His Job For Speaking Out On An Election

Airline industry labor leader Sito Pantoja sued the IAM, alleging that it demoted him and his chief of staff because he supported an opposition candidate for secretary/treasurer in a union election.

www.forbes.com

HAD ENOUGH YET?

You can't make this stuff up!

 

[swamt]

Sito Sues The IAM.

Top Airline Labor Leader Sues His Union, Saying He Lost His Job For Speaking Out On An Election

Airline industry labor leader Sito Pantoja sued the IAM, alleging that it demoted him and his chief of staff because he supported an opposition candidate for secretary/treasurer in a union election.

www.forbes.com

HAD ENOUGH YET?

You can't make this stuff up!

Wow!
After reading this you would think Gary Peterson should have been Court-martialed for supporting another union in its entirely. Sito simply supported a single person for a secretary position and look what they did to him, stripped him of everything as well as his staff. GP was fully supporting a rival union that was starting a grass roots effort to get a vote for representation decided by the membership and not forced upon the members.
I smell something fishy here. There has to be more to this story other than him merely supporting another person running for a position. Just goes to show you how this asso treat their own. A true example of the "Buddy-Buddy" system at play there. Either you join them or you get thrown out like garbage, period.

Now it's time for the membership to discard this asso., like garbage, the same way and send them packing when the vote comes...

 

[swamt]

I did a quick search and found NOTHING on the IAM's sites on the demotions and removals. You would think that at that higher up level within the International there would have been some type of communication within the entity to communicate to their officers, members, as well as reporting to the labor boards. Very odd indeed. Why all the secrecy? Oh that's right, it's the industrial union called the employees asso., never mind. They have never been transparent from day one, why would they start now.
I smell a cover up of something else...

 

[Kev3188]

I did a quick search and found NOTHING on the IAM's sites on the demotions and removals. You would think that at that higher up level within the International there would have been some type of communication within the entity to communicate to their officers, members, as well as reporting to the labor boards. Very odd indeed. Why all the secrecy? Oh that's right, it's the industrial union called the employees asso., never mind. They have never been transparent from day one, why would they start now.
I smell a cover up of something else...

Not trying to be a d*ck here, but that news was plastered everywhere. I saw 2-3 places on Twitter alone.

EDIT: For IAM sites specifically, they rarely if ever post anything like that. It's always sunny on Placid Harbor.

 

[swamt]

Not trying to be a d*ck here, but that news was plastered everywhere. I saw 2-3 places on Twitter alone.

EDIT: For IAM sites specifically, they rarely if ever post anything like that. It's always sunny on Placid Harbor.

I saw it in other places, as stated, it wasn't on any of the asso's or the IAM web sites anywhere. You would think, rather good news or bad for the organization, someone holding that high up of a position, that the org would have made an announcement that he was removed, moving on, retiring or something, just like all other large organizations do when their exects and officers move around or "look at other adventures". Instead, everyone hears about it well after the fact, and even after he hires an attorney, and files a suit against the asso. org. Those suits takes time to file and get a response back.
Mainly pointing out how NON-transparent the asso. is being by hiding the fact that they removed him from all his duties and even told him to never show up on any IAM offices or properties without first gaining permission first, amazing after being as high a position as he was.
On a side note, they may just be trying to avoid paying out his large pension payments in retirement, which is probably part of the reason he his fighting it. Hell he probably has a case, but only have read his side of the story thus far...