AUG/SEPT 2012 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[nevergiveup]

Brilliant strategy....never get a CBA. Ever. It won't be long before a McDonalds manager makes more than your highest paid captain. You guys have already been thrown out the drivers seat. You're too irresponsible and emotional. You're along for the ride now.

Sorry, dude.

 

[Move2CLT]

You forgot to add that "in your very humble opinion" that is your view point. For many in the East, they stood up for what is right, did the right thing, and we stand behind that belief.

breeze

And here you are.

For the east, the viewpoint of "what is right" has always been wrong and has sent you guys to the bottom of the industry.

But you keep on hanging yourself with your belief.

 

[traderjake]

For many in the East, they stood up for what is right, did the right thing, and we stand behind that belief.

Do you still believe in Santa Clause and the Easter bunny?

 

[Move2CLT]

Do you still believe in Santa Clause and the Easter bunny?

He does because USAPA promised him they would bring him DOH.

 

[nic4us]

Binding yes, provided a CBA is reached with US AIrways. You keep leaving out that little part. Agreed upon checks and balances were included prior to the arbitration.

Speaking of leaving little parts out.....

The seniority arbitration is binding regardless of whether or not a CBA is reached. It is further contractual that is not implemented until a CBA is reached. That was put in the TA to apply pressure on management to reach a CBA, not to allow veto power of the arbitration.

Now knowing with separate ratification the West would never vote in a DOH cramdown, usapa tried to remove the separate ratification vote by busting the union and stripping the West of representation. Hence, guilty of DFR.

Perhaps you remember Seeham's proposal for restitution after the guilty verdict?? Reinstatement of separate ratification. Great idea for a scab lawyer's clients. Let the West deny the east DOH, and you still reach your DFR goal to avoid the Nic by forcing separate ops indefinitely.

To sum, the Nic is binding regardless of contract ratification. usapa is further guilty of DFR by intentionally forcing separate ops to avoid the Nic and denying its membership a CBA. Seeham is a union busting scab lawyer. The Nic is still the only system seniority list for all LCC pilots and the only legally available list with which to combine in any upcoming merger (which btw is also a little contractual part you left out)

 

[Beancounter]

You forgot to add that "in your very humble opinion" that is your view point. For many in the East, they stood up for what is right, did the right thing, and we stand behind that belief.

breeze

Now I hear this a lot and..............I'm confused. Stood up for what is right? You guys didn't just stand up against the NIc, that I could understand. You stood up and tried to take the entire west groups seniority aka DOH. There's nothing honorable, just, or right about that.

Bean

 

[fifidriver]

Binding yes, provided a CBA is reached with US AIrways. You keep leaving out that little part. Agreed upon checks and balances were included prior to the arbitration.

Not Exactly. The "agreed upon checks and balances" that you reference are not exactly that. They were merely intended to define a start date. They would be more properly considered a "loophole". The kind of thing that unscrupulous persons utilize to their benefit and to the detriment of others (and themselves) in order to renege on agreed to "final and binding arbitration".
If you continue to support this agenda, you are still dishonorable people.

 

[Ames]

You forgot to add that "in your very humble opinion" that is your view point. For many in the East, they stood up for what is right, did the right thing, and we stand behind that belief.

breeze

You stood up for what you believe is right and think you did the right thing.

Reneging on your agreements and attempting to usurp a binding arbitration are not the right thing to do in any society.

 

[luvn737s]

You forgot to add that "in your very humble opinion" that is your view point. For many in the East, they stood up for what is right, did the right thing, and we stand behind that belief.

breeze

Very postmodern of you. While you might enjoy contributing to the blurring of "right" and "wrong", history points to a universal repudiation of those who cowardly abandoned their responsibility to their obligations. I can't frame that "IMHO" because that opinion is so widely shared it's neither solely "Mine" nor "Humble".

Perhaps USAPA was founded by those who returned from Canada following the draft.

 

[Phoenix]

You stood up for what you believe is right and think you did the right thing.

Reneging on your agreements and attempting to usurp a binding arbitration are not the right thing to do in any society.

You want to talk about "society"... denigrating a defendant in a dispute isn't the right thing to do, and unlike the amateur and childish antics on display here, the courts don't take kindly in their own court rooms to what apparently passes for civility here in this romper room (accept maybe in Wake's court room 😀).

 

[Phoenix]

I've a minor point of curiosity here. As you now appear intent on interpreting for the appeals court to presumably serve your position ("That is exactly what the 9th circus told usapa..")...umm....why refer to them as "...the 9th circus.."?

In one of the west's academy award winning video productions, made prior to the ruling...well...they were, and I quote: "A MASSIVE display of legal authority!". Since the court's rulings now clearly fit in with your notions...well...just curious as to when/how they devolved into a "circus"...? 😉

Brilliant. Simply brilliant.

The West always talks about "the right thing to do", "integrity matters", and all that "moral righteousness position" stuff... you would think their great moral friend and confidant, the 9th, could get a little common civility and respect... I mean, come on, no one is asking the West to love their enemies, not even to love their friends.. just a casual, insincere, tepid civility toward their great moral friends in the 9th would be a grand improvement toward proving that the West has at least a meager attempt at civility. (Yes I know Nic is not really representative of the West mindset, though she presents herself as such 😀).

 

[traderjake]

You want to talk about "society"... denigrating a defendant in a dispute isn't the right thing to do...

Says the guy who thinks it's OK to renege on a mutually agreed upon arbitration so he can try to steal another man's job.

Spare us your opinion on the right thing to do.

 

[nevergiveup]

Speaking of leaving little parts out.....

The seniority arbitration is binding regardless of whether or not a CBA is reached. It is further contractual that is not implemented until a CBA is reached. That was put in the TA to apply pressure on management to reach a CBA, not to allow veto power of the arbitration.

Now knowing with separate ratification the West would never vote in a DOH cramdown, usapa tried to remove the separate ratification vote by busting the union and stripping the West of representation. Hence, guilty of DFR.

Perhaps you remember Seeham's proposal for restitution after the guilty verdict?? Reinstatement of separate ratification. Great idea for a scab lawyer's clients. Let the West deny the east DOH, and you still reach your DFR goal to avoid the Nic by forcing separate ops indefinitely.

To sum, the Nic is binding regardless of contract ratification. usapa is further guilty of DFR by intentionally forcing separate ops to avoid the Nic and denying its membership a CBA. Seeham is a union busting scab lawyer. The Nic is still the only system seniority list for all LCC pilots and the only legally available list with which to combine in any upcoming merger (which btw is also a little contractual part you left out)

Good post, but I do not recall USAPA ever receiving a quality CBA offer from the company to vote on.

 

[jetjok1]

Binding yes, provided a CBA is reached with US AIrways. You keep leaving out that little part. Agreed upon checks and balances were included prior to the arbitration.

IMO....it is a binding arbitration unless it's a windfall to one side or the other. That's what people are forgetting. Case in point. How does a west pilot hired 2 days before I was gain 850 numbers. Explain that plz.....Now, to show you how stupid that is, in my seniority I lost an average of 400-500 numbers..........so how does one pilot, stated above, gain so many. Explain that plz....it shows the inaccuracies of his boondoggle list. And I might point out, this is insignificant to the travesty that was done do the men and woman that sit next to me and what this aribidisgraction has done to them.

 

[traderjake]

How does a west pilot hired 2 days before I was gain 850 numbers. Explain that plz.....

Longevity is not seniority.

Four pilot seniority arbitrations in a row say so.