August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[dca319]

"Arbitration is powerful evidence of a fair result" - Judge Silver. And not a word about a LUP other than "the majority rules".

 

[Claxon]

"Arbitration is powerful evidence of a fair result" - Judge Silver. And not a word about a LUP other than "the majority rules".

“Do I believe in arbitration? I do. But not in arbitration between the lion and the lamb, in which the lamb is in the morning found inside the lion.”


Samuel Gompers

Us Airways, America West Seniority Dispute rough draft timeline

2005-2006 US Airways, United in merger talks

2005 Us Airways, America West merge

May 2007 Arbitrator George Nicolau’ pilot seniority award was issued. The award was written with the assistance of two ALPA pilot neutrals, Steve Gillen United Airlines Pilot and Jim Brucia former Continental pilot now United Airlines Pilot.

2007 Us Airways pilots ask ALPA to review the award. ALPA president John Prater, former Continental pilot now United Airlines pilot, assigns ALPA vice president Paul Rice, United pilot, to review the award.

December 2007, Paul Rice, United pilot, delivers seniority list to Us Airways.

2007 A group of Us Airways pilots start a drive to start their own in house pilot union.

March 2008 ALPA puts the Us Airways ALPA Mec in trusteeship.

April 2008 In a National Mediation Board sanctioned election, Us Airways pilots oust ALPA and vote in USAPA as their official pilot representative.

May 2008 United calls off merger talk with Us Airways.

June 24, 2008 United Airlines starts furloughing pilots that will eventually lead to 1450 pilots at United on the street. Had a merger occurred using the Nicolau award derived with the assistance of United pilot neutrals, Us Airways pilots would have suffered the brunt of the furloughs and few United pilots would have been effected.

2008 America West pilots sue for DFR against USAPA.

2009 2010 US Airways and United restart merger talks.

April 2010 United Us Airways end merger talks.

June 2010 The 9th circuit court rules in USAPA’s favor.

 

[mrbreeze]

Not surprising you would fall back on undercutting a poster because you didn't like the message. And I'm sure Jerry doesn't appreciate his initials being thrown around here.

The message had nothing to do with it....just pointing out the way you have always posted when you don't like something. There is a pattern.

 

[Pi brat]

"Arbitration is powerful evidence of a fair result" - Judge Silver. And not a word about a LUP other than "the majority rules".

Judge Silver:

"THE COURT: Well, I said they do not have to adopt
Nicolau. Okay?"

"THE COURT: Okay. Okay. I agree with you. But the
legitimated union purpose can be in representing everyone which
would also be the East Pilots and coming up with a combination;
right?"

 

[Claxon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHUx5rdXM0Q

 

[Claxon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpSFvQ-0p2I

 

[Pi brat]

Seems no west pilots want to address why voting for an MOU with the intention of declaring it illegal is just the same as not accepting binding arbitration.

 

[cleardirect]

That's not what happened. The MOU renegotiated the TA and previous contracts because the union knew that we were being left behind. It negotiated better pay for ALL US pilots and it was up to the pilots to look at the changes and cast a vote as to whether it was better to stay in our quagmire and let our merger partner that was in Chp 11 reap the benefits while we continued to fight it out, or accept the changes and get the money. It was laid out, and we voted on it, with the west pilots voting for it 97%.

I feel confident that is what the union will say, because what else is there/

But, show your integrity. Wasn't it your plan all along to vote for the MOU knowing it didn't include the Nic, and then file suit claiming it was illegal? So you turned your back on an agreed upon contract. Sound familiar?

Gee. That is exactly the decision you eastie were going to have to make. Get a new contract with the Nicolau in it or remain on LOA 93. Just because a merger came along does not change your obligation.

If you wanted out of the quagmire you could have at any time told the company use the Nicolau and get a contract.

Choices, choices. Ignoring the problem and telling the membership usapa is kicking the problem down the road and goings to use a process that can't be used (M/B) is not an LUP.

Judge Silver did not seem to impressed with your legal filings or excuses. This trial should be fun.

 

[Beancounter]

But, show your integrity. Wasn't it your plan all along to vote for the MOU knowing it didn't include the Nic, and then file suit claiming it was illegal? So you turned your back on an agreed upon contract. Sound familiar?

Well, I for one didn't/don't think the MOU was/is illegal. The MOU was/is seniority neutral. It is what USAPA is attempting to do with DOH that is illegal. The MOU simply helped push along the issue of ripeness, well that and a nice pay raise🙂

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

Seems no west pilots want to address why voting for an MOU with the intention of declaring it illegal is just the same as not accepting binding arbitration.

Please refer to prior post.

Bean

 

[fifidriver]

Seems no west pilots want to address why voting for an MOU with the intention of declaring it illegal is just the same as not accepting binding arbitration.

I would be happy to address it. I believe it to be much akin to the moral relativism of the entire black community in that it's OK for someone (as long as you are not a Caucasian male), to break another's nose, straddle another, and bash his head repeatedly against a sidewalk. But, when the "big ace" gets played, to cry that it somehow wasn't fair. In the words of Trayvon, "You got me!" The way that I see it, and from what I read of Friday"s transcripts, you are looking for some kind of respite or absolution from the events of the last six years. It sounds somewhat to me, like you just wish to wash, both your "hands and feet" of the entire affair. Some sort of, "What she did was just as bad as what I did..." Good Luck! I recommend that you schedule a few sessions with the "pedantic psycho-therapeutic putz", who posts here so regularly, and see if he will grant you any absolution. Cheers!!! and don't scrape the tail on your way out.....

 

[fifidriver]

Seems no west pilots want to address why voting for an MOU with the intention of declaring it illegal is just the same as not accepting binding arbitration.

Dang... can't revise the last post to ask just this; Have you ever played chess with someone that just seemed to see the board a few more moves ahead than yourself? That's exactly how it feels. You can always just concede or "topple your king". Maybe it might somehow abbreviate the pain. Cheers! (Max pitch 10 degrees, or whatever a B737-400 is...) Curses!!! Sullyed again!

 

[traderjake]

Your Mom is hot.

 

[snapthis]

Your Mom is hot.

Claxon certainly has the hots for Carie and is a fan of Cat 3 Productions. Gotta give credit where it is due.

BlackTop Pest

from Cat3 Productions PRO 8 months ago not yet rated ~ 3rd Bay (band members) ~
Carie Saracino - Lead Vox
Mike Saracino - Guitar
John Dorsey - Guitar
Nate Raible - Drums
The Don - Rap

~ The Cast (alphabetically) ~
Larry Coulter - Fat Cat/Shyster Lawyer
John Dorsey - Rat
Nat Fuqua - Rat, ALPA Pilot
Scott Germain - Rat
Daryl Morris - Boy 2
Nate Raible - Rat

~ Music, Lyrics ~
Mike Saracino

~ Director, Screenwriter, Editor ~
Brice LeCarre

~ Director of Photography, Editor ~
Ivan Nevares

~ Crew ~
Lisa LeCarre
Eric Auxier
Daryl Morris
Marty Zacharias

 

[Phoenix]

Now you have a west friend? Stirring the pot? It's "we" Pi. Just because you don't know me doesn't mean I'm not east.

Umkay. See my screen name. I'm a Westie! We need to drop all the lawsuits and just accept what we voted on and agreed to.

Besides that I can't afford this platinum donations plan. I have so many other things that I should spend my hard earned money on. We Westies get paid more than the East scum and we shouldn't waste our extra money on futile lawsuits. There are so many things that would be money well spent. As great as Marty is (and I love him to death--and our 2004 DOH leaders too)... Well I just can't afford to fund their lifestyle anymore. My wife gave up a couple years ago and is really putting the pressure on me to just move ahead.