August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[Claxon]

So you think the APA is willing to throw Millions of dollars at further litigation on behalf of the East pilots that this far, have failed to prove the legality of their behavior? How long has it taken the 9th to get around to the DJ appeal? 18 months or so? Lets do the math, hearing Sept 24...lets say she rules the same day...which I doubt. You think USAPA will exist with a dime to its name in March 2015?

A Jury took 90minutes to shut you down....your odds don't look good here either.

Your new jury I hope takes 1 minute to rule, then East will win it in the 9th again in 18 months. Mean while no merger. No, Judge silver removed US Airways, AMR and APA from you arse, er arsenal. She will dismiss your case

 

[Claxon]

In order to dismiss with prejudice, she would have to vacate a final and binding arbitrated award, 6 years past the SOL for contesting the award.

That right there is what they call grounds for an appeal.

An agreement could be reached between the APA and usapa to avoid arbitration, and if that agreement disregards the Nic, it is off to the DFR races once again, with injunction sought for the illegally obtained "agreed" to list. Does not sound like the no delay path of least resistance to me.

You will be off on that rat race again. APA and USAPA will agree on a list out of arbitration, it will then become law due to the MB.

 

[prechilill]

The misery caused by USAPA will end in about 8 months.

Yep! USAPA = DoA in about 8 months.

Jefferson Davis, Stevie Bradford... God this is going to be fun to watch!!! Lol

 

[Claxon]

Lie to judges? Not for long.

Your 3 million dollar councel lied to the Judges in NY BK court.



""Pilots’ counsel disclaiming any interest in interfering with the merger would provide adequate comfort that they intended, and desired, no such interference.
It is now clear, however, that counsel for the West Pilots intended to provide much less comfort than was understood at the time.

The West Pilots have made it clear, in fact, that they intend to seek injunctive relief to prevent the merger-related seniority integration process from proceeding — to prevent the parties to the MOU from complying with their contractual commitments — if the West Pilots have not fully and finally prevailed on the claims they have asserted in the Arizona Action when that MOU seniority integration process begins. It is extraordinarily unlikely that the US Airways seniority dispute will be finally resolved by that time; one need only observe (a) that it has already been festering for eight years;and (B) that USAPA has already told the judge in the Arizona Action that the dispute is not yet ripe,6 and will remain so until the merger-related seniority integration process has been completed and a new collective bargaining agreement is in place.

Given these irreconcilable views, there is no alternative but to seek relief from this Court. The Court should dismiss this adversary Proceeding, but do so with an admonition to the parties that they refrain from seeking any relief in the Arizona Action that might interfere with the MOU’s seniority integration process or otherwise prevent the parties to the MOU from complying with their MOU-related contractual commitments.""

The Judge of the AMR BK will dismiss your west case, August 15th.

http://leonidas.cactuspilots.us/USAPA_v_Leonidas/Doc_20_Memorandum_Supporting_AMR_and_UCC_Motion_to_Dismiss.pdf

 

[Reed Richards]

Judge Silver: "By my decree, the pilots of US Airways voted on a new contract that secretly contained a 6 year old bargaining position on seniority from their long gone previous union. They might have been told otherwise by their own NAC, Legal, and in the actual wording of the MOU they were voting on , but they did it none the less. Too bad, I decree that to be the list. I also decree that their previous process under the T/A is null and void, and that I can impose a list on them going forward. I am a judge, I supersede all bargaining between Companies and Labor. The NIC is the list. No conscious voting allowed. You all vote, only then do I actually rule what you voted on." RR

 

[Claxon]

Yep! USAPA = DoA in about 8 months.

Jefferson Davis, Stevie Bradford... God this is going to be fun to watch!!! Lol

Precilill's 13th countdown clock has started.

Good luck with your new countdown, Prozac breath.

 

[Metroyet]

Judge Silver: "By my decree, the pilots of US Airways voted on a new contract that secretly contained a 6 year old bargaining position on seniority from their long gone previous union. They might have been told otherwise by their own NAC, Legal, and in the actual wording of the MOU they were voting on , but they did it none the less. Too bad, I decree that to be the list. I also decree that their previous process under the T/A is null and void, and that I can impose a list on them going forward. I am a judge, I supersede all bargaining between Companies and Labor. The NIC is the list. No conscious voting allowed. You all vote, only then do I actually rule what you voted on." RR

Just because you've convinced yourself all of bulls.it you wrote is how the law actually works doesn't mean it's real.

 

[Reed Richards]

Yep! USAPA = DoA in about 8 months.

Jefferson Davis, Stevie Bradford... God this is going to be fun to watch!!! Lol

Actually, USAPA the representational union may be gone much quicker. If USAPA and the APA are able to come up with a negotiated settlement on seniority (which will, by the way, go out for a vote by all members) then there will be no need for USAPA past single carrier status. But the organization USAPA will survive with all dues moneys intact, in order to defend against litigation for the rest of our careers. 6M and donations should just about cover us, at least until I am gone. RR

 

[Reed Richards]

Just because you've convinced yourself all of bulls.it you wrote is how the law actually works doesn't mean it's real.

You are correct Metroyet. Just because I believe something to be true in the legal arena does NOT make it true. But up until now, what is my track record? Superheroes are not supposed to brag, so I will leave it at that. RR

 

[Metroyet]

Actually, USAPA the representational union may be gone much quicker. If USAPA and the APA are able to come up with a negotiated settlement on seniority (which will, by the way, go out for a vote by all members) then there will be no need for USAPA past single carrier status. But the organization USAPA will survive with all dues moneys intact, in order to defend against litigation for the rest of our careers. 6M and donations should just about cover us, at least until I am gone. RR

APA won't meet with USAPA without the East West settled first. That process begins on 9-24

 

[prechilill]

Actually, USAPA the representational union may be gone much quicker. If USAPA and the APA are able to come up with a negotiated settlement on seniority (which will, by the way, go out for a vote by all members) then there will be no need for USAPA past single carrier status. But the organization USAPA will survive with all dues moneys intact, in order to defend against litigation for the rest of our careers. 6M and donations should just about cover us, at least until I am gone. RR

The NMB sets the timeline for USAPA's decapitation- the seniority issue has no bearing on when the guillotine drops on Bradford's creation. The head will roll into a basket regardless, the NMB just decides when it will happen. Cheers!

 

[traderjake]

If USAPA and the APA are able to come up with a negotiated settlement on seniority (which will, by the way, go out for a vote by all members) then there will be no need for USAPA past single carrier status.

Agree to the slotting by equipment and status that APA wants and you have your settlement.

The odds of me dating Kim Kardashian better than that happening.

 

[Reed Richards]

<p>

The NMB sets the timeline for USAPA's decapitation- the seniority issue has no bearing on when the guillotine drops on Bradford's creation. The head will roll into a basket regardless, the NMB decides when it will happen. Cheers!

USAPA stays alive to represent US Airways pilots in the MB like process until a final product is rendered. USAPA stays alive as an organization as long as the Officers deem it necessary. Read the CBL. There are no tears being shed over the demise of USAPA, rather only tears of joy that it was able to fend off the NIC. RR

 

[Claxon]

You know like the judge in the RICO suit did. No trial he determined that usapa had no facts and no case.

Not true, the Judge in the america west pilots RICO case stated in his final order;

"While the Court has concluded that such actions do not come
within the purview of RICO, It may well be that a Court of appropriate
jurisdiction will conclude that such actions do constitute violations of state
law and that injunctive relief is warranted to prevent this type of conduct
from continuing."

Page 45 for quote.

http://leonidas.cact...Final order.pdf

 

[prechilill]

<p>

USAPA stays alive to represent US Airways pilots in the MB like process until a final product is rendered. USAPA stays alive as an organization as long as the Officers deem it necessary. Read the CBL. There are no tears being shed over the demise of USAPA, rather only tears of joy that it was able to fend off the NIC. RR

You are wrong, usapa can't grant their own stay of execution. Their heads are going to roll on a timeline governed by the NMB as pushed along by the APA. Rumors from the APA higher ups is February time frame. I'm bringing a basket for you. Have a great day!