August 2013 Pilot Discussion

[EastUS1]

Bit of paranoia creeping in that aging mind of your L - T? I think you need the help with all those imaginary dogfights you've been having.

"Bit of paranoia creeping.."? Fascinating. How did you manage to manufacture that, and from what reference or personal feeling? Why would you imagine that your cycling of military ranks "your L - T" would offer some devastating, personal offence?

Never suggested anything approaching actual dogfights, which would be deadly serious business, and are largely issues of ealrier times in history, and solely limited to war in any case, but merely some enjoyable, recreational flying encounters. Seems "spartans" are just easilly intimidated. Perhaps you might consider briefly slithering out from under your sad, sunlight-deprived, sick and sorry little rock and joining me for some grins aloft? 🙂

Seriously though; just get yourself some help. You desperately need it. Life needn't be a continuing process of nothing more than the confused pain you're suffering.

 

[Claxon]

Excerpt from PHL update today.

IMHO, this is the current and correct summary of the situation as it stands today.

"In the case before Judge Silver, the Addington Plaintiffs are claiming that USAPA had breached its duty to the West Pilots by failing to include the Nicolau list in the MOU. This, of course, is different than the previous DFR suit; the landscape in this case is entirely different in that there are multiple parties involved in the MOU that were not involved in the original case. In addition, the plaintiffs are seeking a separate seat for themselves in the McCaskill-Bond arbitration process with the APA.

As you know, this MOU was voted on and was considered neutral in respect to seniority. We were informed that we should not vote for or against the MOU based on seniority. This was made perfectly clear and the West pilots voted by a 97% margin to accept this MOU as written, with the clear understanding that the seniority issue would be decided through the McCaskill-Bond process should direct negotiations with the APA fail. From our perspective, to now insist that the Nicalou Award be included in the MOU is ludicrous. We can tell you we have confidence in our position and expect USAPA to prevail in Judge Sliver’s court. We will continue to keep you informed as the process unfolds."

 

[dca319]

"Bit of paranoia creeping.."? Fascinating. How did you manage to manufacture that, and from what reference or personal feeling?

Never suggested anything approaching actual dogfights, which would be deadly serious business, and are largely issues of ealrier times in history, and solely limited to war in any case, but merely some enjoyable, recreational flying encounters. Seems "spartans" are just easilly intimidated. Perhaps you might consider briefly slithering out from under your sad, sunlight-deprived, sick little rock and joining me for some grins aloft? 🙂

Seriously though; just get yourself some help. You desperately need it. Life needn't be a continuing process of nothing more than the confused pain you're suffering.

Seriously though, you're not in the Air Force anymore. Let go and quite trying to relive you past challenging others to fictitious dogfights. If anyone needs help, Gunny, its you.

 

[dca319]

Excerpt from PHL update today.

IMHO, this is the current and correct summary of the situation as it stands today.

"In the case before Judge Silver, the Addington Plaintiffs are claiming that USAPA had breached its duty to the West Pilots by failing to include the Nicolau list in the MOU. This, of course, is different than the previous DFR suit; the landscape in this case is entirely different in that there are multiple parties involved in the MOU that were not involved in the original case. In addition, the plaintiffs are seeking a separate seat for themselves in the McCaskill-Bond arbitration process with the APA.

As you know, this MOU was voted on and was considered neutral in respect to seniority. We were informed that we should not vote for or against the MOU based on seniority. This was made perfectly clear and the West pilots voted by a 97% margin to accept this MOU as written, with the clear understanding that the seniority issue would be decided through the McCaskill-Bond process should direct negotiations with the APA fail. From our perspective, to now insist that the Nicalou Award be included in the MOU is ludicrous. We can tell you we have confidence in our position and expect USAPA to prevail in Judge Sliver’s court. We will continue to keep you informed as the process unfolds."

Yes, our PHL reps have been so spot on with all their info. Thanks for posting. The west has no chance.

 

[EastUS1]

Seriously though, you're not in the Air Force anymore.

While you never were, but take solace in being a mighty "spartan" instead. Perhaps the "army of leonidas" will even someday honor you with a 21 kazoo salute. 🙂 "I think you need the help with all those imaginary dogfights you've been having."? Some reading comprehension issues in play as well?: "Never suggested anything approaching actual dogfights....but merely some enjoyable, recreational flying encounters. Seems "spartans" are just easilly intimidated"...although in fairness; I have been threatened with a Beechcraft today ("Nice, stable platform") even accompanied by a ferocious "This is Sparta" sort of war cry: " This aint no Cessna buddy!!!" 😉

No use in my further suggesting therapy to you. It's your life and you are your own problem.

 

[Pi brat]

Couple weeks away from closing it out and we'd be well into our second one by now? We would have been better off that staying on LoA93. But no, AW's like you wanted DoH.

Not really. You have to start questioning your handlers.

Actually look at what was left and use your brain to figure out if we were a "few weeks out."

Oh, I'm sorry,...

 

[Pi brat]

And they'll be working Christmas for the rest of their careers as the west guys come in over them. Congrats to them.

It's so nice when a westicle points out their own windfall. Thanks phx319!

Old Ken Holmes, co-author of the MOU, was also one of the authors of the famous AOL brochure series. He pointed to the Salamant report where a 20+ east F/O ONLY had to wait another 2 years for his upgrade(he failed to mention the more years on reserve etc....), but he didn't mention the 6 year acceleration of upgrade for certain west F/Os. I wonder why? Maybe the whole "windfall at the expense of others" thing?

 

[Pi brat]

I propose we use Beechcraft.

Really? I propose you in a V tail Bonanza for that.

 

[Pi brat]

Seriously though, you're not in the Air Force anymore. Let go and quite trying to relive you past challenging others to fictitious dogfights. If anyone needs help, Gunny, its you.

Hey, it's drainage wanting to take him on in a Bonanza.

 

[Pi brat]

An honest to God quote from a west friend of mine:

"I work with some of the stupidest people on earth." I didn't question him based on this board.

 

[EastUS1]

Hey, it's drainage wanting to take him on in a Bonanza.

In fairness to Beechcraft: The T-34 Mentor, essentially straight-tailed Bonanza (before and after some additional wing strengthening) was sported around in some USN Aero Clubs, and, given that any Mil ID allowed for some access there, was sometimes a fun toy to get 2-4 fellow ne'er-do-wells together, check out a couple/three (subject to availability) of 'em, and play with, most especially off Monterey and out over mother ocean. Slow, and one needed to be a bit gentle, but great fun. 🙂 Umm...Quite naturally though...I'd hate to ever face a "seasoned aviator" the likes of Prechil in anything even half so formidable! 😉

 

[767one]

I propose we use Beechcraft. Nice, stable platform, plenty of power available. We each supply our own airplanes. Now, you have to sign a consent form releasing me of all harm you will likely endure after that first turn because I don't want you to sue me. It's in your nature to do that when things don't go your way and you don't really play by any rules either- just have to protect myself... Nothing personal, it's how you roll.

It is actually quite American not to play by the rules. In the revolutionary war we won by hiding behind trees and ambushing the British who wore bright red coats and marched in straight lines.

All the best,

Bob

 

[Pi brat]

In fairness to Beechcraft: The T-34 Mentor (after some additional wing strengthening) was sported around in some USN Aero Clubs, and, given that any Mil ID allowed for some access there, was sometimes a fun toy to get 2-4 fellow ne'er-do-wells together, check out a couple/three (subject to availability) of 'em, and play with, most especially off Monterey and over mother ocean. 🙂

That's true. I still think she was talking about a V tail Bonanza with a throw over yoke. Or a Duchess. No, no........a Skipper! That's it, a Skipper!

 

[767one]

The sad part is what it cost the guys who started retiring this year and won't see the MOU payraise.

Trader,

No hard feelings from me. It's just the way it is. when you retire the world moves on and it is expected.

All the best,

Bob

 

[Pi brat]

Trader,

No hard feelings from me. It's just the way it is. when you retire the world moves on and it is expected.

All the best,

Bob

Best to you Bob. We never got to fly together, but a beer with a common F/O told me you were one of the good ones.