Delta (finally) adds -8 to the CF34 line

[Kev3188]

There is nothing better than doing your line check or turning the flight. Clearing log items, signing off the logbook and maintenance release, greeting the crew, standing in the jetway watching the pax board, grabbing last minute gate check bags and helping the rampers button up, then pushing back the aircraft, watching it taxi away and takeoff. Doing it all on Holidays, rain or shine. I loved working the hangar...only when I was on the line and saw the aircraft that I had done a complete landing gear attach fitting replacement on, still flying...or seeing that new belly skin I helped replace...

I do miss working the line.

I suspect the overall feeling you've touched on here is why many people stick around. I'm not an AMT, but I can certainly relate...

 

[Glenn Quagmire]

...
DL doesn't need its employees to do the jobs of other employees in other departments. DL employees do the jobs they do have well and the employees themselves as well as the customers both win.

You clearly missed the point. People helping each other at a station to achieve an on-time turn or launch is synergy and camaraderie. Something that sounds lost on you.

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, it isn't lost on me at all.
Small stations are one story and cooperation takes a different flavor but in large stations where most maintenance exists, there isn't a need for employees to do each other's jobs... what DL employees do best is their own jobs. There isn't a need for different employee groups to be stepping into each other's territory if the airline is properly staffed and if people know their jobs.

I do see ramp agents standing in the jetway ready to help out w/ last minute bags even if there are slides present on the jetways. I do see flight attendants communicating among themselves when the overhead bins are full. I do see maintenance quickly responding when maintenance issues arise; I've been on plenty of flights that mechanics were on prior to pushback and in nearly all cases the flight still left on-time.

I'm not against cooperation at all. I do recognize that airlines are highly complex and there are unique training and security procedures for each department. The industry today is vastly different in that regard than it was in its golden age.

The is another element in this discussion that hasn't been discussed and that is there are labor relations issues involved when one workgroup is regularly jumping into each other's work area. There have been posts on a regular basis here about scope and protecting each work area. Creating a climate where employees are doing work for another workgroup is bound to set off labor relations issues; even if the majority of DL's workforce is non-union, there would be just as much pushback if DL encouraged employees to work in other areas.

DL runs as well as it does and people like their jobs at DL because they have the resources they need to do their own job and do it well. And each employee group has people who find just as much satisfaction as you do in being close to the line and getting a planeload of people safely and on-time to their destination and giving them the best customer service they know how to give.

 

[700UW]

Gee they do their job great?

Ask the families who received the wrong bodies from DL and had to delay the funerals.

You do see?

If you arent a DL employee how do you see all this happening when DL is turning a flight?

Something is rotten in Denmark here.

 

[WorldTraveler]

and you not being a DL employee are supposed to have the inside view on what is going on at DL? Can we expect you to have any more insight than you did when you boldly asserted that airlines don't buy aircraft in cash when I quickly showed you just one example where that is exactly what happened?

Q's view of the job he used to do while romantic and nostalgic isn't reality TODAY. I do in fact fly more than enough to know not only how DL works but also other airlines. There are indeed windows in a lot of places around airports, including on the planes themselves.

Employees just don't jump in and do other people's jobs anymore and for very good reason. Airlines don't ask them to and in some cases there would significant pushback if this type of thing happened on a regular basis.

BTW, share with us the latest employee survey results at US - or any other airline for that matter.

DL employees are happy in their jobs which they know and do well; they don't have expectations of other workgroups doing their job for them and it doesn't happen.

 

[700UW]

Nice try to change the subject, like I said, you arent a DL employee anymore (or so you say) you have no idea of what is going on at every jetway with every DL flight. Walking down a jetway to take flight doesnt make you an observer on everything that transpire, give it a rest all ready mr delta cheerleader.

So keep trying.

And airlines dont hand Boeing or Airbus Cash, its either wired or a certified check, how many aircraft deliveries have you attended?

I have attended a few, and also they usually take a loan, issue EETCs, or sale-lease buy back.

Dont let the facts get in your way.

Happy in there job?

Check this out then:

https://www.facebook...ps/62602435887/

By the way if DL is so good, why is its stock trading lower than LCC?

http://www.tickerspy.com/index/Airline-Stocks

 

[WorldTraveler]

please tell me you know better than that the actual price of a stock is indicative of the value of the company or that a few minutes worth of movement has any real bearing on the value of the company.

The total value of outstanding DAL stock hovers around $16 billion; LCC's is just over $3 B. It isn't hard to see which company is more highly valued by investors.

Oh and Checks aren't USUALLY written for tens of millions of dollars; wire transfers do the trick, though. Just because you haven't seen the money actually transferred doesn't mean it doesn't happen... you know there might not be windows in the finance office.

 

[Kev3188]

Happy in there job?

Check this out then:

https://www.facebook...ps/62602435887/

That's just one in a long list of similar pages...

The employee surveys are a farce. You can get any answer you want if you ask the right question(s). Also, this year they pared the ability to expound on your answers way back.

Sure, people participate, but most I know have no illusions of it accomplishing anything meaningful (other than to vent).

If only half bothered to do it, what's that say about the company? And that was after an absolute blitzkrieg of messaging pushing us to do it.

Furthermore, if the data shows that of that half, 80% are happy, then it also shows that 20% are not. This airline becomes more & more data driven daily, so maybe this year, they'll actually listen and work towards meaningful change. I'm not holding my breath.

And in the interim, the A cards keep coming in...

 

[WorldTraveler]

of course employee surveyes are a farce if they don't tell the story you want to see... both sides of the general populace say the same thing about the respective sides of the media.

yes, ONLY 40% of the total employee population rate DL as a "great place to work." Neither I or DL mgmt expect that a majority of people at DL would rate the company in the most favorable light but tell me how many people at ANY large company, let alone at an airline, rate the company that high. Perhaps AS, perhaps WN but certainly none of the legacy carriers that have been thru BK are doing that.

I'm still waiting for results of the employee survey at US.

There are undoubtedly cards that have expired - and there is no evidence that the number of cards coming in outpaces the number that are expiring.

There have been unionization drives at DL for decades... DL employees know how to work the system to keep enough pressure on the company - and yet CONSISTENTLY the majority of employees decide it isn't worth voting in the union, even when the opportunity arises. It is doubtful that employees are going to mess with the formula that is compensating DL employees better on average than those at any other legacy/network airline. With expectations of $1.5B-$2B in profits this year, there will be plenty of profit sharing to go around, even at reduced percentage levels after the pay raises. Given that most DL employees' salaries are at or above their peers at other network/legacy airlines, the economic argument for a union just doesn't work.
Even for the half of the company that might not see the company favorably, most are smart enough to consider the economic factors above all else.

A sense of being slighted by the company for taking away the unions is only going to motivate a very small number of employees.

 

[Kev3188]

yes, ONLY 40% of the total employee population rate DL as a "great place to work." Neither I or DL mgmt expect that a majority of people at DL would rate the company in the most favorable light but tell me how many people at ANY large company, let alone at an airline, rate the company that high. Perhaps AS, perhaps WN but certainly none of the legacy carriers that have been thru BK are doing that.

You're the one who continuously pounds the mantra that most DL employees are happy. I'm merely pointing out that the data point you're currently doesn't necessarily help your case.

There are undoubtedly cards that have expired - and there is no evidence that the number of cards coming in outpaces the number that are expiring.

Says who?

...the economic argument for a union just doesn't work.

Actually, it does on a lot of levels.

However, as I've told you repeatedly, for most people it's not an economic argument, but rather a QOL discussion...

 

[WorldTraveler]

because cards have a limited shelf life... if there aren't enough to force a vote, they lose their validity at some point. Telling us that cards keep coming in without telling us how many are dropping would be an inaccurate use of data, wouldn't it?

I've said most DL employees don't believe that a union can provide enough value to run the risk of losing what they currently have and gain something that most airline employees don't have.

As much as you'd like to believe that the majority of people would take a QOL stance at an economic cost, the reality is that they simply won't, esp. since the QOL issues you see are from your perspective... not everyone sees them the same way. You're an idealist and I commend you for taking stands... but the vast majority of people are most interested in maximizing their economic situations and most importantly can live with the dissonance between what they want in life and what they actually receive.

And as much as you want to believe otherwise, working for a financially strong company does carry a lot of weight w/ employees, esp. when they gain profit sharing because of their employer's leadership.
At least some people now believe that DL IS the industry leader, surpassing WN. Remember that DL employees have made much, much more than their WN peers in profit sharing over the past few years.

Southwest Passes the Leadership Torch to Delta
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2013/05/16/southwest-passes-the-leadership-torch-to-delta.aspx

 

[robbedagain]

but now accrding to the article wn is taking a page out of DL book by buying 10 737s from WestJet of Canada. i thought Ryan Air had some too but i guess that WN is not interested in them yet they deferred orders for new 737-700/700 max and the 800 and 8 max for 5 or so yrs although it saves the money from buying new planes dont delta already burn thru a large amount just for the up keeps on the old DC-9s ? and soon to be the MD-90s if they have not yet gotten the used ones?

 

[WorldTraveler]

Delta's maintenance costs have been the lowest among network carriers for years and have been lower than even the low cost carriers that either outsource almost all of their maintenance or have much less senior workers. So no, DL's maintenance costs are not necessarily higher.

The agreement with WN for the 717s involves them being delivered up to date on maintenance and ready for service to DL's standards.

As with most older aircraft w/ most carriers, DL has managed to schedule the DC9s to maximize their useable life before heavy maintenance. Douglas Aircraft are known for the durability.

 

[QA4Jet-A]

Delta's maintenance costs have been the lowest among network carriers for years and have been lower than even the low cost carriers that either outsource almost all of their maintenance or have much less senior workers. So no, DL's maintenance costs are not necessarily higher.

The agreement with WN for the 717s involves them being delivered up to date on maintenance and ready for service to DL's standards.

As with most older aircraft w/ most carriers, DL has managed to schedule the DC9s to maximize their useable life before heavy maintenance. Douglas Aircraft are known for the durability.

DL has managed to schedule the DC9s to maximize their useable life before heavy maintenance.
Are you kidding me? Don't you think those frames have seen the barn a number of times for Major Heavy Checks?
I wish them well with the 717s too. A fun plane to fly on, like riding a 'Bottle Rocket', but they do have some interesting quirks too!
I'll bank on WNs decision to go with a few used 737-7s for a few years and wait on the Max!

 

[737823]

Nice try to change the subject, like I said, you arent a DL employee anymore (or so you say) you have no idea of what is going on at every jetway with every DL flight. Walking down a jetway to take flight doesnt make you an observer on everything that transpire, give it a rest all ready mr delta cheerleader.

So keep trying.

And airlines dont hand Boeing or Airbus Cash, its either wired or a certified check, how many aircraft deliveries have you attended?

I have attended a few, and also they usually take a loan, issue EETCs, or sale-lease buy back.

Dont let the facts get in your way.

Happy in there job?

Check this out then:

https://www.facebook...ps/62602435887/

By the way if DL is so good, why is its stock trading lower than LCC?

http://www.tickerspy.com/index/Airline-Stocks

All ready??? You don't work for DL, never did. You have been separated from USAIR since 2005. Attended a few deliveries? You haven't a clue about aircraft financing. Stick to what you do best, chief damage control agent for the IAM (scab) union.

Josh