Grounding 744s ?
- Thread starter LukeAisleWalker
- Start date
whatkindoffreshhell
Veteran
Well said sir!
However stupid pricing decisions are already being inflicted on the NW cargo ops by their new ATL masters...
metopower
Veteran
- Nov 28, 2006
- 932
- 313
Do you wonder why NWA lost those contracts? Have you watched the far east cargo meltdown. FEDEX is losing money in the far east and is rumored to furlough 700 pilots and have reduced flt hours to prevent that. Take a look at last months Aviation Week that talks about how the global economic meltdown has effected the demand for air cargo. What was a gold mine is just not there right now. Deploying those aircraft to So. America might be the answer.
- Thread Starter
- #36
It was interesting to hear what Glenn had to say on the IFS Conference Call the other day about the 744s. I believe (can't remember the exact words) he said that they were unsure about where this a/c will fit in in Delta's future and that even NW's plan was to phase them out for the 787. He responded to a caller that asked if the 744 interior would be updated.
I love the 747..(and will probably be around a while longer)
but..
they seriously need to simplify the fleet, more than likely the International flagship will be the 777 down the road..it just makes more sense in the long term..
Thats what I got from the conference call. To me it sounded as soon as this winter
we can see many 744's parked. It will be interesting to read the transcript. Not
good for the Northwest side if true.
I believe if a '744' is substituted for another aircraft per the pilots agreement those pilots(former NW) would fly those substituted aircraft, within a 5 year period. I stand corrected..
after a SOC, if representation is not successful, to my understanding, all aircrafts will be available for bid by all Flight Attendants (premerger NW and DAL)..
if representation is successful after a SOC, and theoretically the 744 is grounded and a 777 is put in its place, per our contract we would follow the pilots and due to the fence(keeping both groups separate until a combined contract), and since we will be trained on the DAL equipment this fall.. even if that did happen there would still not be an issue.
Kev3188
Veteran
For awhile the plan was to replace the 744's with 787's on a one-for-one basis, and in turn convert the -400's into freighters to replace the 747-200's...
to me, a purpose of the merger and why DAL/NW merged in the first placed was to combine the airlines..
enabling the ability to right-size every market in the system with a variety of aircraft fleet types..that make the most sense at this time, taking into consideration the global economic situation.. also to position the airline to be strong long term, and then a gradual one for one replacement of widebody aircraft and retirement of other fleet types, such as the DC9..
are capacity cuts warranted at this time? yes.. the total grounding of all 744 in the fall? no.
grounding an entire International fleet of aircraft..(used primarily for long range internationals) just for the sake to save money in fact eliminates revenue and service..and makes no sense what-so-ever.
the 787 delays more than likely will cause a shifting of 744 replacement to 777.. it would make sense not to completely cancel the 787 order inherited by the merger.. but evaluate the need in 3 to 5 years and then make a decision at that time (either to go ahead or outright cancel), while allowing other airlines to take the initial 787 delivery slots, the 787 program seems to be encountering some lengthy delays..so any forfeiture of delivery slots would not pose a competitive disadvantage.
in 10 to 15 years the 787 may be a viable solution but in the near future, probably not. (but keep some options open for consideration if possibly warranted at a later time) the 787 may have made sense for NW, but I sorta dont see it really fitting into the combined airline.
the focus should be absolutely streamlining the fleet gradually..
some of the 767 with an upgrade is also a good move..
or
replace the carpeting and install new seat covers in the 744 coach cabins, upgrade the IFE, focus on meals and service and shift that aircraft to destinations such as the current HNL markets, while utilizing the 777 and the basicially brand new 330 Internationally to key markets such as NRT, SYD ext. and utilize the 744 for at least another 6 to 9 years for leisure/vacation markets including some longer range destinations including Japan. The 767/757 configured for International are perfect for some markets.
sometimes its best to work with what you have, IMO.
enabling the ability to right-size every market in the system with a variety of aircraft fleet types..that make the most sense at this time, taking into consideration the global economic situation.. also to position the airline to be strong long term, and then a gradual one for one replacement of widebody aircraft and retirement of other fleet types, such as the DC9..
are capacity cuts warranted at this time? yes.. the total grounding of all 744 in the fall? no.
grounding an entire International fleet of aircraft..(used primarily for long range internationals) just for the sake to save money in fact eliminates revenue and service..and makes no sense what-so-ever.
the 787 delays more than likely will cause a shifting of 744 replacement to 777.. it would make sense not to completely cancel the 787 order inherited by the merger.. but evaluate the need in 3 to 5 years and then make a decision at that time (either to go ahead or outright cancel), while allowing other airlines to take the initial 787 delivery slots, the 787 program seems to be encountering some lengthy delays..so any forfeiture of delivery slots would not pose a competitive disadvantage.
in 10 to 15 years the 787 may be a viable solution but in the near future, probably not. (but keep some options open for consideration if possibly warranted at a later time) the 787 may have made sense for NW, but I sorta dont see it really fitting into the combined airline.
the focus should be absolutely streamlining the fleet gradually..
some of the 767 with an upgrade is also a good move..
or
replace the carpeting and install new seat covers in the 744 coach cabins, upgrade the IFE, focus on meals and service and shift that aircraft to destinations such as the current HNL markets, while utilizing the 777 and the basicially brand new 330 Internationally to key markets such as NRT, SYD ext. and utilize the 744 for at least another 6 to 9 years for leisure/vacation markets including some longer range destinations including Japan. The 767/757 configured for International are perfect for some markets.
sometimes its best to work with what you have, IMO.
I don't think anyone said anything about grounding the whole (16) 744 fleet.
You might want to listen to the replay or read the transcript when it comes out because
what you mentioned above doens't seem to be in the works. If It were up to me, I would
order the 748 to replace th 744. However we would end up in Chapt 7 if I were in charge. LOL..
BTW the 787 will, and is going to be a great "eventual" replacement for the
A330's and 767's.
I know..
(what I think is going to happen is they all will be painted and used for passenger service for the time being, especially while both airlines are operating under their separate certificates, but after an SOC, who knows?)
I think the 744 in one way or another will be around..a while.
this is how things generally work out... they have a plan A...that sorta works out and then resorts to plan B, and then take some aspects from plan C, and then something from plan D, and then what ends up as the final result is a combination of plan A, B, C and D.
(just because they say its in the works doesnt mean it always..works out..) but I know what you are saying.
running a business is really not as difficult as it may appear, because of course as we all know, the ones who ultimately run the business..(the daily operation) are the front line workers combined with those behind the scene and at the top..(working as a team)...those people the front line..you and me.. so on and so on..are the real backbone that keeps the 'wheels moving'..
those at the top make strategic decisions that enable the overall success or subsequent failure of a company..it is those decisions that can take a company in one direction or another..
if you have someone at the top who is determined to succeed... it can happen.. based on making the right decisions with a sense of fairness for all..if you have someone who focuses solely on the shareholders and their personal bonus and pay, the entire company suffers one way or another..
maybe, a long looong time down the road, IMO.
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